$500 Agile vs 1.7K Kiesel?

[Carl Kolchak]

Agile
https://www.rondomusic.com/Agile_Epic_727_Flat_Black.html

Kiesel
https://www.kieselguitars.com/guitars-in-stock/139392

Roughly the same specs, but price?

So my questions is this, what am I getting for that extra 1.2K?

It's not a question of money, as I can easily afford the Kiesel at this time, but, I wonder, could I bring that Agile more or less up to the same level of quality as the Kiesel for an additional investment of another $400 or so, or is the Kiesel simply that much better a guitar?

 

[budda]

You wouldnt know for sure until you played them both.

 

[r3tr0sp3ct1v3]

Honestly. Kiesel quality is good. My only issue is that no matter how much you put into a build spec wise, it will ALWAYS be the same quality.
Do you play out live in rough areas? IF so go Agile.

 

[Carl Kolchak]

Honestly. Kiesel quality is good. My only issue is that no matter how much you put into a build spec wise, it will ALWAYS be the same quality.
Do you play out live in rough areas? IF so go Agile.

Home/PC recorder only.

I've played/owned a number of Agiles before. so I'm pretty familiar with their build quality (the occasional buzzing/dead frets, the meh electronics, etc.), but not with Kiesel's. You said Kiesel's build quality is good? Would you say it's 1K better than the Agile's?

 

[budda]

Thats for you to decide.

Law of diminishing returns and all that.

Which one makes you want to play more? Buy that one.

 

[GXPO]

I know where you're coming from but you already know the answer. If you're willing to put the extra money into bridging the quality gap, then assuming the wood is of a good enough quality, of course, you can get the agile to compete in terms of playability. The money you have left over is basically the price difference between the factory locations and effort needed to ensure the quality is better out the door.

 

[Carl Kolchak]

I know where you're coming from but you already know the answer. If you're willing to put the extra money into bridging the quality gap, then assuming the wood is of a good enough quality, of course, you can get the agile to compete in terms of playability. The money you have left over is basically the price difference between the factory locations and effort needed to ensure the quality is better out the door.

Appreciated. Thank you.

 

[diagrammatiks]

Are they roughly the same though.

The Kiesel is neckthrough, hipshot hardware, and Kiesel pickups.

That’s probably not 1200 dollars difference but it adds up to a few hundred at least.

 

[KnightBrolaire]

They're different guitars, with varying quality differences. I've yet to own an agile that was as nice as my kiesels in terms of fit/finish/initial setup. Agiles are great for their price points and can hold their own against some more expensive guitars (if you get a good one and get it all set up/etc), but they'd be more in line with a higher tier LTD or schecter than kiesel imo.

 

[Señor Voorhees]

Something people like to overlook is that when you buy American, you have to help pay American workers. American labor isn't cheap, and as such, you'll end up paying more for American products. This is why companies are shipping jobs overseas. A lot of people are finding the pill hard to swallow that you're paying a huge premium for something you can get largely the same for cheaper. You can say hipshot and whatever is more expensive, and it is, but it doesn't really outperform the agile cepheus (or whatever it's called) bridges so it's more of the same. Pay more for similar products.

Agile are decent and after a setup and pup swap will sound just fine. Kiesel will use name brand parts, and their pickups are some of my favorites. You are largely, however, just paying for the more expensive American labor. I'd personally choose Kiesel if money wasn't the issue. I like kiesel necks more, and there are a few models I just really like from them. I love my aries and Vader, nobody else makes them. If they did, then chances are that the neck carves would be different and thus not the same.

 

[Jeff]

Agiles are hit or miss, quality-wise. Not only does Kiesel make their guitars here, but someone actually looks at them before shipping. Rondo takes the box off the shelf and ships it.

 

[Carl Kolchak]

Something people like to overlook is that when you buy American, you have to help pay American workers. American labor isn't cheap, and as such, you'll end up paying more for American products. This is why companies are shipping jobs overseas. A lot of people are finding the pill hard to swallow that you're paying a huge premium for something you can get largely the same for cheaper. You can say hipshot and whatever is more expensive, and it is, but it doesn't really outperform the agile cepheus (or whatever it's called) bridges so it's more of the same. Pay more for similar products.

Agile are decent and after a setup and pup swap will sound just fine. Kiesel will use name brand parts, and their pickups are some of my favorites. You are largely, however, just paying for the more expensive American labor. I'd personally choose Kiesel if money wasn't the issue. I like kiesel necks more, and there are a few models I just really like from them. I love my aries and Vader, nobody else makes them. If they did, then chances are that the neck carves would be different and thus not the same.

Are you using the Kiesel Lithiums or Holdsworths?

 

[Carl Kolchak]

Agiles are hit or miss, quality-wise. Not only does Kiesel make their guitars here, but someone actually looks at them before shipping. Rondo takes the box off the shelf and ships it.

Something I thought about as well...

That said, there are enough Kiesel CSR horror stories posted here to give me a little pause when considering placing a custom order with them.

 

[budda]

Agiles are hit or miss, quality-wise. Not only does Kiesel make their guitars here, but someone actually looks at them before shipping. Rondo takes the box off the shelf and ships it.

How do you feel about their return policy?

 

[Mike]

just be patient and buy a used prestige.

 

[KnightBrolaire]

Something I thought about as well...

That said, there are enough Kiesel CSR horror stories posted here to give me a little pause when considering placing a custom order with them.

then don't buy new. buy a used one instead, there's usually a bunch floating around guitar center/reverb

 

[Carl Kolchak]

just be patient and buy a used prestige.

This was my first thought as well. But I figured if I'm going to be paying more than a 1K for used Prestige with extraordinarily limited options then I might as well go the semi-custom route with Kiesel and get more of the guitar I wanted.

 

[Mike]

This was my first thought as well. But I figured if I'm going to be paying more than a 1K for used Prestige with extraordinarily limited options then I might as well go the semi-custom route with Kiesel and get more of the guitar I wanted.

You can easily find used prestiges under 1k. If you want a fixed bridge 7, look for a 752fx variant to popup. I just sold mine a few months ago for like $750.

 

[Mathemagician]

The kiesel will be better build quality and finishing touches right off the bat. I didn’t look at specs but I think kiesel does SS frets by default now too.

That said if you don’t mind doing a pickup swap and want to keep cash on hand for something else the Agile is likely going to be a really solid guitar.

Do you have a preference on scale length?

 

[Señor Voorhees]

Are you using the Kiesel Lithiums or Holdsworths?

Lithiums. Probably worth mentioning that I have zero experience with any other pickup from them, but I really REALLY liked the lithiums. I miss my Kiesels and wouldn't have sold them if I didn't need to. (hooray moving long distance!)

Another thing worth noting is that yeah Agiles get pulled from a shelf and shipped, but more often than not all that means is that you'll need to adjust saddles, truss rod, intonation, etc. I've owned somewhere between 10 and 20 different Agiles, and most were well enough out of the box. One or two needed a truss rod adjustment (not unheard of with mailed guitars), and only one that needed "drastic" work. (intonation, truss rod, and noodling around in the control cavity due to iffy wiring.) And that was an old douglas explorer thing, so like... sub $200 like 8 or 9 years ago.

Somebody else mentioned it earlier, though. Diminishing returns. A $6000 guitar won't play or feel THAT wildly different from a $1k-$2k guitar. A large part of inflated prices is the cost of labor. (and with Kiesel, part of that is *hopefully* good quality control... Agile just gets them from the factory and sends them out basically leaving you to do the QC.)