Bailout fails house vote

[7 Strings of Hate]

^free health care is one of the most brilliant ideas ever thought up, i have a wisdom tooth that is broken off and i have had to wait months till i had enough extra cash to get it pulled out. its a fucked up situation.

you'll find that americans are typically against ideas that make sense

 

[JJ Rodriguez]

I would never say MOST Americans are terrified of socialism, at least not the ones on here But I do see some posts on here, and comments on news articles and shit like that that is just like "ZOMG that's socialist! BAD!". I fail to see how distributing tax dollars that tax payers paid into the system is a socialist idea, it's basically just like a big tax refund, unless of course you distribute it to people who didn't pay their taxes or are so poor they didn't really have anything to file.

 

[Lee]

The S&P 500 is up 3.33%. Told you to wait, almost without historical fail whenever the market dives like this, the next day is a rebound. As mutual funds typically trade after the close of business for the marketplace, once a daily NAV is struck, all you did was lock in yesterday's loss without any of today's recovery.

Selling in the middle of a one-day panic is almost always a bad idea.

Well, a slight correction would be that I'm selling them today, as opposed to yesterday.

 

[7 Strings of Hate]

I fail to see how distributing tax dollars that tax payers paid into the system is a socialist idea, it's basically just like a big tax refund, unless of course you distribute it to people who didn't pay their taxes or are so poor they didn't really have anything to file.

i definatly wouldnt support giving money back to people who didnt contribute.

I just did the math, and there are roughly 300 million americans, divide 700 billion, by say 2/3 of americans, because all dont pay taxes, so 700bill divided by 200mill, and everyone in the country would get a check for about 2500 dollars. That would be a huge boost to the economy, credit card companines would be getting tons of cash comming in from people paying down their debt. it would probably be a win around the board

 

[Matt Crooks]

i have a crazy idea, how about giving the 700 billion BACK TO THE TAX PAYERS!!

How can you give something back that never existed? It's not like the government is sitting on stockpiles of money that they can spend. They will just print more money and devalue any savings we have.

 

[Matt Crooks]

^free health care is one of the most brilliant ideas ever thought up

It is NOT free. You would be paying for it out of your taxes.

 

[The Trooper]

Matt's right. It's most certainly not free, you're still paying for it.

As far as distributing that $700 billion among all Americans...worst idea possible IMO. We see how well the "stimulus checks" worked out. If you gave $2500 to all Americans, you'd basically watch $700 billion disappear so some of them could buy 50" HDTV's, some of them could put it in the bank and not spend it out of fear of the economy, and the rest could stave off forclosing on their home for all of one more month. The money would disappear as quick as it was sent.

Then what happens? No bailout money, more banks forclose, the economy tanks, people lose their jobs...and the govt is in dire straights because they just gave out $700 billion worth of taxpayers dollars for nothing.

 

[Matt Crooks]

Thoughts?

We don't need a bailout, we need a return of sanity. Let them fail. Quit rewarding corporations for bad decisions, and coddling individuals who made bad choices. The "bailout" will only postpone the inevitable, and the longer the wait, the more painful it will be when the correction occurs.

We had an economic crash in 1921, due to massive inflation after WW1, and it was worked out in a year with no regulatory oversight. The Great Depression took ten years to get out of because of government involvement. Do we need another New Deal?

 

[Drew]

i definatly wouldnt support giving money back to people who didnt contribute.

I just did the math, and there are roughly 300 million americans, divide 700 billion, by say 2/3 of americans, because all dont pay taxes, so 700bill divided by 200mill, and everyone in the country would get a check for about 2500 dollars. That would be a huge boost to the economy, credit card companines would be getting tons of cash comming in from people paying down their debt. it would probably be a win around the board

Hi Chris. Remember that "tax rebate" from a couple months ago, where they gave 600 to every American/1200 to every couple, for a total payoff of somewhere around 200 billion? Remember how that didn't do anything?

$2,300 isn't the difference between paying for your mortgage for the next two years or going into bankrupcy. What they're trying to do here is to combat a different side of the problem, getting these bad assets off the books to try free up the locked-down credit markets so that credit will loosen up and become available to businesses and private individuals, to boost corporate and personal spending, to attempt to generate some economic growth.

It's not a great idea, true, but it beats giving every American $2,300 and hoping that will magically fix everything.




...furthermore, the thing you're missing is the government is buying these assets at seriously distressed pricing. If we manage to pull through this, then those assets won't be worthless and the government can gradually introduce them back into the marketplace, and recoup a lot of this expenditure and possibly even profit.

EDIT - sniped by The Trooper/.

 

[Drew]

Well, a slight correction would be that I'm selling them today, as opposed to yesterday.

Better idea. You might even get one more day of recovery out of it.

Thursday's the variable now. If we manage to pass a bailout bill, and it doesn't suck, then we're looking at a short-term surge and possibly a long term rally. I'll be contemplating increasing my equity exposure based on what happens.

 

[Groff]

Hi Chris. Remember that "tax rebate" from a couple months ago, where they gave 600 to every American/1200 to every couple, for a total payoff of somewhere around 200 billion? Remember how that didn't do anything?

I never even got one, so a shit good that did for me

 

[Matt Crooks]

I never even got one, so a shit good that did for me

+1

 

[Metal Ken]

Hi Chris. Remember that "tax rebate" from a couple months ago, where they gave 600 to every American/1200 to every couple, for a total payoff of somewhere around 200 billion? Remember how that didn't do anything?

It was actually 300$

 

[Kagami]

It was actually 300$

or jack shit if you don't make enough

 

[Lee]

I never even got one, so a shit good that did for me

+2

 

[Drew]

It was actually 300$

It varied based on a number of factors. I think it was $300 for students, $600 for single adults, $1200 for couples, and then if you didn't pay any taxes the prior year you were inelligible, and if you made more than like $90,000 or something then they started prorating it down based upon your salary.

The idea was to target the most in-need taxpayers.

Either way, the fundamental reality remains that it didn't do very much, and that if you're in over your head on a mortgage, then $2500 isn't going to be enough to change that.

 

[Matt Crooks]

The idea was to target the most in-need taxpayers.

Yes, it was to each according to his need.

 

[BigM555]

...furthermore, the thing you're missing is the government is buying these assets at seriously distressed pricing. If we manage to pull through this, then those assets won't be worthless and the government can gradually introduce them back into the marketplace, and recoup a lot of this expenditure and possibly even profit.

This.

If the numbers bandied around by Obama in last weeks debate are correct the Iraq conflict will cost the tax payers about $1.2 Trillion this year. That money will never be seen again in the US.

Yet everyone is freaking out about a bit more than half that amount which has a much better chance of being recoverable, if not in totality then at least a good chunk of it.

All things said the Treasury Dept. the Administration and the media have all done a piss poor job of informing citizens of what the bill will really do and what the implications are. Apparently fear mongering gets better ratings.

 

[7 Dying Trees]

Apparently fear mongering gets better ratings.

How do you think the bush regime has managed tro cling to power for so long?

 

[BigM555]

How do you think the bush regime has managed tro cling to power for so long?

Forgive me, I keep trying to forget that abuse of the system.