ESP 2021 New Models

[Dumple Stilzkin]

I’d wager no one here would even be able to tell the difference between them if they didn’t know beforehand, provided they were both polished.

Have you ever owned a guitar with stainless frets? They feel different to me even compared to highly polished nickel. That said I do prefer them, but I still buy guitars with regular frets. It’s not a dealbreaker.

 

[Spicypickles]

Currently own one, yes. They are smoother, sure, but I keep my guitars in pretty good shape, so they’re all polished up. There isn’t much of a difference at all.

 

[CovertSovietBear]

What's next, carbon fiber frets w/ choice of gold, steel or nickel weave/flakes?

 

[KnightBrolaire]

What's next, carbon fiber frets w/ choice of gold, steel or nickel weave/flakes?
View attachment 96619

nah m4 tool steel is where it's at

 

[mbardu]

ITT: there are people who prefer a certain feature on a guitar, so we're gonna make nazi jokes.

Godwin's rule is alive and well, even after all these years.

Also:

Have you ever owned a guitar with stainless frets? They feel different to me even compared to highly polished nickel. That said I do prefer them, but I still buy guitars with regular frets. It’s not a dealbreaker.

Don't bother... If it's not a feature on a used Ibanez prestige, you're not supposed to like it

 

[CanserDYI]

I absolutely ADORE stainless steel frets and genuinely believe it leads to a slicker fretboard feel and much easier bending. That being said, nickel is still perfectly fine if polished correctly.

 

[Jonathan20022]

Currently own one, yes. They are smoother, sure, but I keep my guitars in pretty good shape, so they’re all polished up. There isn’t much of a difference at all.

Right, the difference you're willfully choosing to ignore is that it takes infinitely more effort to maintain that smoothness on nickel over time.

Everything about Stainless is about long term playability, yeah my Caparison TAT Special has the most polished Nickel frets I've personally ever seen, but they still clouded up and became oxidized in less than a month of regular play.

But yeah for sure, Nickel at it's absolute best shouldn't feel that much different to Stainless. Unfortunately it doesn't stay that way for long periods unless you remove strings and literally polish your frets.

 

[Ross82]

Right, the difference you're willfully choosing to ignore is that it takes infinitely more effort to maintain that smoothness on nickel over time.

Everything about Stainless is about long term playability, yeah my Caparison TAT Special has the most polished Nickel frets I've personally ever seen, but they still clouded up and became oxidized in less than a month of regular play.

But yeah for sure, Nickel at it's absolute best shouldn't feel that much different to Stainless. Unfortunately it doesn't stay that way for long periods unless you remove strings and literally polish your frets.

Yeah I dont feel any difference between my Caparison nickel frets and my Mayones SS frets. I polish my frets maybe 3 times a year regardless and I've never had them be overly tarnished or feel rough

 

[I play music]

You'll pay someone who knows what they're doing to do both.

The problem is I haven't found that someone within reasonable distance to my home. So I continue preferring guitars that won't need work I can't do myself.

 

[bostjan]

Yeah I dont feel any difference between my Caparison nickel frets and my Mayones SS frets. I polish my frets maybe 3 times a year regardless and I've never had them be overly tarnished or feel rough

You polish stainless steel frets 3 times a year?!

 

[mbardu]

Calculation is pretty simple in my case.

Say I have 8 guitars with nickel frets, and I want them to feel like stainless all the time, I have to change strings every month or two and polish the frets a bit.
With stainless steel frets, not only do I have to polish them a grand total of zero times a year - I also have to change the strings way less frequently.
Stainless just doesn't damage strings as badly, especially when you rotate guitars.

So on the one hand, I could spend 20 hours of maintenance and ~400$ on strings per year.... Or on the other hand, I could save that time to practice and that $$$ to buy a 9th guitar after a while.

Alternatively, I could also play just one or two guitars with nickel frets and aggressively change strings with a quick polish every couple of weeks. I bet that's closer to the use case of most people. That would work too, and cost maybe just a bit less time/$$$. But having a bunch of guitars in different tunings, string count, bridge types and features (piezo/midi/sustainer etc) is just fun, especially when they remain effortlessly smooth to play after a day, two weeks or a couple of months. I'm lucky to be able to do so; with no intention to introduce hassle into that.

 

[Jonathan20022]

Yep, YMMV based on acidity of sweat and how conducive your environment is to cause oxidation to metals. But objectively Stainless Steel will require less routine maintenance than Nickel.

There's been so much push back, (less so nowadays) that I always thought it was hilarious how many excuses people make. It's not your problem to care as a customer about the logistics for innovation and improvement.

"Think of the tools!" - This was always the problem of the luthier/guitar tech working on guitars, there were genuine complaints about longevity of tools and needing to upgrade to diamond files just to work on Stainless Steel. Seeing techs vocally proclaim they would turn down work instead of just buying their tools and charging more for the services involving Stainless was incredibly funny to me.

"Guitar prices will increase!" - And here we are in 2021 paying 1.5k - 2.5k for guitars from Korea and Indonesia, and some (very few thankfully) of them don't even have Stainless Frets built into that absolutely massive cost increase in the last half decade!

Even as a consumer, just looking at the material cost of fretwire on Stewmac:
Nickel -

Stainless -

Just to save everyone the trouble, if we're comparing the two 68 of 82ft of Stainless runs about $106.43 (82.9%).

So your manufacturers are paying about 25% more for fretwire made from a better material and offsetting that cost onto the customer. Padding each guitar with a $10 - 20 upcharge for Stainless Steel covers the cost of the materials tenfold and you attract more clients that prefer it.

If you prefer nickel fretwire for some reason like the effect stainless has on your tone, I could buy that to some extent. But maintaining the status quo because it ain't broke is a pretty useless contribution to the conversation.

It's like gamers saying higher refresh rates are pointless when most high end phones now just feature >60hz displays as a standard. Yeah you didn't need it, but I guess there's a lot of things we didn't need in life that I'm sure a lot of us wouldn't want to lose

 

[FromTheMausoleum]

What's next, carbon fiber frets w/ choice of gold, steel or nickel weave/flakes?
View attachment 96619

You joke, but I'm pretty sure there's a guitar out there with diamond frets.

 

[Jonathan20022]

You joke, but I'm pretty sure there's a guitar out there with diamond frets.

Close enough but...



Famously a pain in the ass to work with (The business), and completely gone now. $1500 Fretjobs didn't help I'm sure

 

[CovertSovietBear]

You joke, but I'm pretty sure there's a guitar out there with diamond frets.

Well looks like you weren't wrong :0
Diamond encased diamond shape inlays would be sick though.

 

[FromTheMausoleum]

Close enough but...



Famously a pain in the ass to work with (The business), and completely gone now. $1500 Fretjobs didn't help I'm sure

Ayyy that's it!! Fun how the strings needed to be coated or the frets would destroy them instantly.

 

[narad]

Close enough but...



Famously a pain in the ass to work with (The business), and completely gone now. $1500 Fretjobs didn't help I'm sure

"You can have fatter fat lows, really crisp highs, and crunchy mids. And then the harmonic response is really cool too"

URGHHHHHH

 

[Jonathan20022]

"You can have fatter fat lows, really crisp highs, and crunchy mids. And then the harmonic response is really cool too"

URGHHHHHH

Boooooooomin lows brother

 

[Dooky]

If it doesn't have stainless steel frets on a Madagascar ebony fretboard with ivory binding then it's a piece of junk.

 

[Dumple Stilzkin]

Close enough but...



Famously a pain in the ass to work with (The business), and completely gone now. $1500 Fretjobs didn't help I'm sure

Where’s the crystal meth frets?