Captain Shoggoth
Gotoh 1996T shill
The choice to relegate the neck pickup to the ripped jean stripes and satin finish is absolutely maddening
ESP 2024
The choice to relegate the neck pickup to the ripped jean stripes and satin finish is absolutely maddening
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Emperor Guillotine
The Almighty Ruler
I never said that. Nowhere in my comment whatsoever did I say or infer that ESP didn’t pay good money to its artists.You think Metallica would be playing ESP if ESP money were low when they can't even make Hetfield a properly shaped guitar?
Or that Children of Bodom as the biggest Jackson fanbois would have sticked with ESP if it weren't such good money?
ESP is perhaps the biggest guitar brand in the world right now, which means that they probably have the largest pockets in terms of money to burn. We all know that ESP has an absolute stranglehold on the Japanese market; but here in the West, ESP is also perhaps THE biggest brand in the European countries, and ESP is one of the big brands (alongside Gibson, Fender, Ibanez, Schecter, etc.) here in North America with a solid, more than ample foothold in the American market and American artist pool. (Keep in mind that Joe is an American artist even though he originally was from France before immigrating to NYC.) Also, in addition to owning multiple other brands that are under the ESP umbrella (such as: LTD, Takamine, Lakland, ENGL, etc.), ESP still offers OEM contract work for manufacturing instruments for multiple other brands, both Japanese and foreign (non-Japanese) companies.
Sure, Fender and Gibson have a foothold in the market as massive, easily recognizable brands; but because they are these “proudly American” companies, their resources are mostly tied up in the USA domestic market with not much of a focus globally nowadays.
Fender USA now controls Fender Japan operations; but Fender Japan still seems to function as its own entity (at least, that’s what I have observed from a distance) as the Fender Japan products target the Japanese domestic market and aren’t available in the USA without importing through a third-party proxy or a Japanese store that is a dealer for FJ instruments and happens to offer international shipping.
Meanwhile, Fender owns Jackson, Charvel, EVH, and other brands that maintain a global presence. But I think we can agree that they are not as inescapable as Fender itself is as a brand.
Anyway, Fender and Gibson are more so “legacy” or “lifestyle” brands at this point, with a focus more on establishing themselves in non-music-related ventures to inundate our lifestyles. Examples: clothing, consumer-level speaker products, outdoor supplies, etc. In fact, because Fender and Gibson inundate the average American musician’s life to such an inescapable degree, it might shock Americans who venture out to see that Fender and Gibson aren’t as big in terms of global presence metrics compared to a company like ESP.
So, yeah, in all likelihood, ESP probably rewards the artists on their roster better or looks out for their artists better. Granted, none of us here know the details of Joe’s artist contract with the company.
You mean Charvel?
Preach!
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HeHasTheJazzHands
Well-Known Member
Yeah I did. But aren't Jackson's and Charvel's CS In the same place? Or are they separate? I coulda swore that was the case, but I rather have confirmation before I'm called a drama-spreading rumor shit-stirrer again.
Emperor Guillotine
The Almighty Ruler
Wait…[…] but I rather have confirmation before I'm called a drama-spreading rumor shit-stirrer again.
Wait…
WAIT…
…@HeHasTheJazzHands, you drama-spreading rumor shit-stirrer.
There. Done.
Oh, so you meant the same as me. I read it as the opposite, sorry.
groverj3
Bioinformagician
Artists switch brands all the time. ESP and Charvel have wildly different structures, not the least of which is that Charvel is basically Fender's "hard rock, but not just EVH clones" sub-brand. Their custom shop is mostly the same people as Jackson's, and not very many people at that. It's a smaller operation than ESP, unless you compare that you have more leniency to play other FMIC brands in addition to the one you primarily endorse.
Sometimes the artists spin their movement as "I always wanted to play brand X" or "brand Y wouldn't build this for me" or "I had this issue with brand Z," and sometimes that's true, but often they just get a good deal on a cut from their signature gear. Sometimes the reason for switching brands is that the market is saturated with your current sig model and it's not selling that well, the brand doesn't want to produce as many cutting into your pay, your deal is up, and you hop companies to make a different model that will hopefully sell better again. Rinse and repeat.
I liked Joe's Charvel better than this, but neither are really my thing.
Sometimes the artists spin their movement as "I always wanted to play brand X" or "brand Y wouldn't build this for me" or "I had this issue with brand Z," and sometimes that's true, but often they just get a good deal on a cut from their signature gear. Sometimes the reason for switching brands is that the market is saturated with your current sig model and it's not selling that well, the brand doesn't want to produce as many cutting into your pay, your deal is up, and you hop companies to make a different model that will hopefully sell better again. Rinse and repeat.
I liked Joe's Charvel better than this, but neither are really my thing.
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groverj3
Bioinformagician
Most of the Alexi models are too 2000s teenage edgy for me. When they weren't so over the top though, I thought they looked pretty good.
groverj3
Bioinformagician
They're in the same place, in a corner of the Fender facility, and mostly the same people building them, too. Unless I'm mistaken.Yeah I did. But aren't Jackson's and Charvel's CS In the same place? Or are they separate? I coulda swore that was the case, but I rather have confirmation before I'm called a drama-spreading rumor shit-stirrer again.
Is it a–hopefully hollow–aluminum body? In that case cool. Otherwise how did they make it look so metallic and will it actually look good in real life? It's one thing in a photo and another how it'll hold over time. I like the concept but find it odd that he went to ESP for this shape when Jackson seems to have tried bringing back the surfcaster and such shapes back for a while.
ESP Welcomes Joe Duplantier (Gojira) to Artist Roster
Over the past nearly 50 years since ESP opened our doors, we’ve been blessed with some of the world’s most respected and influential guitar and bas...www.espguitars.com
There it is.
HeHasTheJazzHands
Well-Known Member
The press release says it's a chrome finish. Warwick/Framus and Ibanez have done several chromed-out guitars as well, but if it ever becomes a production model it'll definitely be reserved for the custom shop level stuff since the finish is supposedly expensive and requires some work. An LTD and/or E-II version will probably just be standard metallic silver
Emperor Guillotine
The Almighty Ruler
Absolutely not. Joe has never played an aluminum instrument. So, he wouldn’t magically start out of nowhere at this point, especially with a new brand hop. It’s literally just a chrome painted XJ model, dude.
ESP has never offered aluminum bodies and never will. That is not ESP’s niche. There are companies out there like EGC, RGI, Baguley, TTTides, etc. that specialize in machining aluminum guitar bodies and necks; and most of their products are generally outside of the price range of the common consumer’s wallet. ESP (as a big brand) would want to target a wide audience in the market, not some extremely tiny, niche sector of experimental player that makes up not even close to 1% of guitarists and who would want a product that requires a lot of manufacturing time and cost.
Furthermore, the bodies used for the products of said companies that work with aluminum (like the companies that I listed above) are all solid because a hollow or semi-hollow “shell” of aluminum for a body is not a good idea in terms of basic guitar design.
As @HeHasTheJazzHands said above, multiple companies have offered chrome finishes for decades at this point. It’s nothing new. But all instruments that have had chrome paint jobs have commanded a very high price-tag because the process of applying, finishing, and polishing chrome paint is very intensive in terms of the labor required.
It actually sucks looking at the required work and cost for a chrome paint job because chrome paint jobs inevitably deteriorate over time as the player racks up more and more wear to the final, polished finish. It’s just unavoidable.
If anything were to come of this as far as a chrome painted guitar becoming an option within the massive ESP catalogue, it will more than likely remain as a custom shop option, or potentially operate on some type of limited “made-to-order” system that is built on one-by-one basis with some aspects of prefabrication (to cut cost and time) in order to be rushed out quicker than a custom shop build (like the “made-to-order” Edwards models and O.Z.Y models that ESP offers exclusively in Japan). But given that Joe is a USA artist, I cannot see this happening.
Like any other USA artist, Joe will maybe down the road get a basic signature model with a ESP version and a LTD version. It will be bland and boring with nothing special to it, as is par-for-the-course with pretty much all signature models for artists on the ESP roster nowadays.
narad
Progressive metal and politics
I'm not sure if this is true or how to test/confirm this, but just my own observation in Japan is that ESP is not particularly big here. When I'm in a shop with mixed gear, young people are usually checking out Ibanez or strandberg stuff, playing some mix of botched polyphia, fusion, and anime songs. The people most excited about ESP seem to be tourists.
Emperor Guillotine
The Almighty Ruler
Really? It interests me to hear this as an outsider, because from an outsider’s perspective, ESP seems to have a big presence in Japan.
Maybe it’s like how Fender and Gibson are here in the USA. Not many folks are particularly caring to play or even look at ‘em on store shelves, just because those domestic brands have inundated our market and our culture here to such an ostentatious degree as being “THE American brands” and encouraging us to “play America” (amongst other dumb sloganeering). Nothing is special about ‘em as a domestic brand. Maybe it is the same with ESP in Japan? Or nah, ya think, @narad?
I wish I could “like” your comment more than once just for this.
narad
Progressive metal and politics
Not sure to be honest. Guitar is weird because there are so many sub-demographics and what interests each of them is all so different, and I don't have many data points outside of ESP stuff.
If I have to wager a guess though, and this has very little to do with first-hand experience, but who are the guitar heroes? They've almost always been outside of Japan. If you're chasing those guys, and you want similar gear, then you're probably not going to go to ESP for any of it. This is especially true now as ESP seems to be splitting -- it's pushing the original series up to well beyond the means of a typical player in Japan, so these all go overseas, and then expanding all their offerings in the lower range but none of the upcoming guitarists are playing those models. So I don't think young JP guys are getting inspired or drawn to them.
Obviously ESP has blown up on forums/social media the past few years, but it seems like mostly guys like myself chasing older models. I can't say I have any desire to get a purple sparkle HH E-II 7-string.
