Finding a guitar with the right construction - questions

budda

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My first requirement is “do I find the neck shape comfortable?” Followed by “does it balance properly (not parallel to the floor/closer to classical position) on a strap?” If neither of those things happen the rest doesnt matter.

Also not mentioned: preferences change over time. In 5 10 or 20 years what may be your perfect guitar might look different.
 

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Moongrum

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which, to my mind, has coincided with an increase in tendonitis and complaints of pain from guitarists.
interesting. A big thick neck is more comfortable for me, but I also wonder if the player who gravitates towards shredder necks tends to have techniques/practice regimens that would lead to an RSI.
 

Alberto7

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Also not mentioned: preferences change over time. In 5 10 or 20 years what may be your perfect guitar might look didifferent.
This is big. Some people take longer than others. For me, I don't know what I will like tomorrow. 😅 I kinda have to ride it out with a guitar I feel I'm not vibing with for long enough to make sure I actually don't like it. I didn't vibe with my Ibby AZ for months, until one day for some reason it was my absolute favorite guitar once again, and now I know I friggin love it, but it's a slow burning flame that will often take a background seat for something hotter and newer for a bit... but I keep going back to it.

On the other hand, I had to wait for two years of not vibing with my RGA121 to know that it just wasn't for me. Sold it a few months ago and I haven't looked back. Can't say the same for my AZ.
 

Rubbishplayer

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interesting. A big thick neck is more comfortable for me, but I also wonder if the player who gravitates towards shredder necks tends to have techniques/practice regimens that would lead to an RSI.
Correlation does prove causation, but it is interesting.
 
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90% is how cool it looks
5% is pickups/quality electronics
5% is construction/hardware
True metal, this is the way...


... a guitar that makes on smile is the one that makes one perform better, tone comes with it, that's why tone is in the fingers, and also why it's subjective as each one of us' moods day by day.
 
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jaxadam

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Also not mentioned: preferences change over time. In 5 10 or 20 years what may be your perfect guitar might look different.

You say that, but look at this PM someone sent me over 15 years ago:

IMG-0469.jpg
 

gnoll

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It's hard to completely predict what will work. I can have an idea of things I like, but even the individual piece of wood a guitar is made from makes a difference. Two guitars of the same model can be quite different.

So at the end of the day I need to have a guitar in my hands to know what I think of it. And then it's down to a combination of things. Sound first, then playability, stability, looks. And almost always I can find some things about an instrument that I really like, and some things I don't.

If you're gonna record and you have some guitars to choose from, pick the one that works best. If you only have one guitar, use that one and don't worry about it.
 

AwakenTheSkies

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If you're gonna record and you have some guitars to choose from, pick the one that works best. If you only have one guitar, use that one and don't worry about it.
Actually I like to switch it up when recording something. The idea is to get every layer to sound ""slightly"" different. If you do something drastic like changing your amp, cab or IR then that's gonna throw off the whole mix. But a different guitar or a different mic position is just different enough to make it stand out without breaking the mix.
Some guitars are better with chords, other solos, others cleans, etc
 

gnoll

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Actually I like to switch it up when recording something. The idea is to get every layer to sound ""slightly"" different. If you do something drastic like changing your amp, cab or IR then that's gonna throw off the whole mix. But a different guitar or a different mic position is just different enough to make it stand out without breaking the mix.
Some guitars are better with chords, other solos, others cleans, etc

Yeah that's not a bad idea. I didn't mean that you have to limit yourself to using just one guitar.
 

electric

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I hate this "sHuT uP aND jUsT pLaY yEr gUiTteR" attitude". It's a gear question, it needs a gear answer. Yes, i play my instruments, but i also like them well built, and pass on it or return it if i see flaws in the wood, un-correctable assembly problems, or it just doesn't ring. It's not even exclusive to low-end guitars, i've seen plenty showy, expensive guitars that just look thrown together in a hurry yet might of fooled some enthusiastic newb.

To answer you question, if it's new, i first look at the wood's grain wherever it shows, like usually on necks. Manufacturers nowadays just use whatever lumber comes off the rack, but some pieces are just better than others. I am particularly picky with the grain being straight throughout the neck, in an ideal world, going right across its length but in the world of mass-produced asian gutiars you can't be TOO picky. If possible i avoid knots and burls where they are not supposed to be, i don't want the necks to warp in all sorts of weird ways in time. Recently i returned a perticular acoustic model two times until i found a third magical one. The second one was particularly bad, like it was thrown together on friday, out of the worst scraps they had left. I felt bad about doing it, but i simply had to return it. I also knock on the body in several places to see if they are certain "dead spots" that sound lifeless and hollow. You could also listen for the note they ring in, how they match to the neck, or simply how the body responds to it. If it's a semi-transparent body, i look for certain wood patterns i like and so on. I couldn't write a treatise on it, but years of experience taught me what to look for.

Just for fun, for folks who miught not be familiar with it: in violin and classical guitar making there is a thing called tuning the soundboard, and even other parts of it. You can even go to great lengths with it, measuring it with devices, or feeding sine waves into it experimenting with chladmi patterns an so on. Point is: they are not all made the same.
 
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BabUShka

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I have guitars that has really bad unplugged resonance (like the JP6) which sounds abdolutely monster plugged. Unplugged I would rather play my Epiphone, but plugged the JP6 slays.

I do think that some of the string through guitars I've had gives a very specific touch to the sound.. I do think the the resonance and vibrations matter. But not the loud ones the we hear - the ones that the pickups pick up.

Over time I've stopped overthinking this and buy guitars that look good, comfortable to play for me and sounds good plugged. Always a bonus if they are satin black.
 

gnoll

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I hate this "sHuT uP aND jUsT pLaY yEr gUiTteR" attitude". It's a gear question, it needs a gear answer. Yes, i play my instruments, but i also like them well built, and pass on it or return it if i see flaws in the wood, un-correctable assembly problems, or it just doesn't ring. It's not even exclusive to low-end guitars, i've seen plenty showy, expensive guitars that just look thrown together in a hurry yet might of fooled some enthusiastic newb.

To answer you question, if it's new, i first look at the wood's grain wherever it shows, like usually on necks. Manufacturers nowadays just use whatever lumber comes off the rack, but some pieces are just better than others. I am particularly picky with the grain being straight throughout the neck, in an ideal world, going right across its length but in the world of mass-produced asian gutiars you can't be TOO picky. If possible i avoid knots and burls where they are not supposed to be, i don't want the necks to warp in all sorts of weird ways in time. Recently i returned a perticular acoustic model two times until i found a third magical one. The second one was particularly bad, like it was thrown together on friday, out of the worst scraps they had left. I felt bad about doing it, but i simply had to return it. I also knock on the body in several places to see if they are certain "dead spots" that sound lifeless and hollow. You could also listen for the note they ring in, how they match to the neck, or simply how the body responds to it. If it's a semi-transparent body, i look for certain wood patterns i like and so on. I couldn't write a treatise on it, but years of experience taught me what to look for.

Just for fun, for folks who miught not be familiar with it: in violin and classical guitar making there is a thing called tuning the soundboard, and even other parts of it. You can even go to great lengths with it, measuring it with devices, or feeding sine waves into it experimenting with chladmi patterns an so on. Point is: they are not all made the same.

Actually I also like seeing the wood grain. I'm not gonna say I know 100% how much of a difference it makes in the end but I like seeing what I pay for. And there's a lot of vagueness when it comes to guitar wood. A lot of the time it's even hard to know what species of tree the guitar is made from, let alone what the particular piece is like.
 
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As someone who records all the time and has tested several different types of guitars in mix tests to figure out this very thing I've come to a conclusion which can be summed up by Carl very simply



Get a guitar you like and that feels good to play and the rest works itself out. Unless you have a super shitty guitar, it'll do what you want. Everything else (bridge, pickups, etc) are all just a matter of personal taste and ultimately won't make or break your sound, again unless defective. I have played the mix test game with lots of guitarists who swear on specific woods, specs, etc..and not a single one has ever been able to correctly figure out the guitar used or the specs of it just from hearing a full mix.

I'm beginning to say this all the time here but, spend more time on being a better player and songwriter and you'll discover magically that all the super nitpicky tone chasing shit no longer matters.
 

AwakenTheSkies

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I'm beginning to say this all the time here but, spend more time on being a better player and songwriter and you'll discover magically that all the super nitpicky tone chasing shit no longer matters.
Why not both? Just because I want to learn more about one doesn't mean I'm neglecting the other.
 

AwakenTheSkies

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It's not like the two are completely separate things. Songwriting is very intertwined with sound and playability. A guitar that's easy to play makes it a lot easier to write tricky and creative stuff. And a guitar that sounds well helps you focus on writing and you can make things work that wouldn't work with a guitar that doesn't sound well.
I've seen this happen, guys get frustrated because nothing sounds right, so they'll look at their interface, amps, plugins, but won't bother changing the setup of the guitar or upgrading any of the hardware. Because the tone is in the fingers, right?
 

AwakenTheSkies

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Because songwriting and playing ARE important and will drastically change how a song sounds, what type of wood a guitar has or whether or not it's bolt on or neck through won't.
I disagree 🤷 Character & atmosphere are important, and they will make a difference. A solo will not sound the same on a superstrat compared to a LP, even if the performance is the same. Cleans won't sound the same on a strat compared to a 2 humbucker guitar.
One gives you the right harmonics that will make you get all emotional and the other one just sounds okay. These details are important...
 

gunch

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I smiled when I read your post, as it reminded me of the lost knowledge of the ancients (ancient being the 70s).

I remember my surprise when I first tried an Ibanez Blazer bass back in 1981, having played other basses up until then, and wondering "why does this bass sound like the bass of god?" This led me to study solid body luthiery.

What was conventional wisdom then seems to have been forgotten in the rush to produce guitars that sell well and have high margin potential. That wisdom used to be:

1. Through necks are better than set necks, which are better than bolt-ons. The top of every range of guitars was almost exclusively through neck guitars, followed by set necks (witness the catalogues of Ibanez, Aria and even the original Roland synth guitars). Bolt necks were always considered inferior for tone and sustain. All of that went out of the window with the advent of the superstrat and through necks are rare now.
2. Mass is good. Thick bodies, thicker necks, heavy brass bridges were the order of the day to get great tone and sustain. However, with superstrats becoming popular, this turned attention away from heavily-anchored bridges to locking trems. This also was accompanied by a move to slimmer bodies and necks, ironically in the latter case leading to ultra-thin Wizard necks which, to my mind, has coincided with an increase in tendonitis and complaints of pain from guitarists.
3. Wood matters. Necks have remained predominantly made of maple, but bodies that were once exclusively made of ash or mahogany on the then-premium guitars have increasingly been made of cheaper woods, such as basswood.
4. Star-alignment. Yep, you can get two identical guitars, same make and model off the same line, and one will be dull and the other will come alive. This is down to the variability if tonewoods and other accidents. Acoustic luthiers understand this very well and will "tap test" candidate top wood to check for tonal neutrality and even response. I don't even know how you would do that for 50mm thick body wood, though I'm sure it's feasible with the right equipment. But who would do it? This is why trying guitars in the shop is critical. But of course, manufacturers and even shops don't like this, preferring that you buy online or accept a boxed guitar from their store room. Yet my experience has always been that my best sounding guitars have been selected firsthand, in person.

Even more interestingly, we've begun to see these wisdoms being reintroduced: mahogany bodies, brass sustain blocks, "Gibraltar" bridges, (slightly) thicker necks, etc. Were I to commission a no-limits custom build, I'd almost certainly be ordering a through-neck design with an ash or mahogany body and a "heavy" trem (quite probably a Kahler).

Now that's not to say superstrats are pants. Indeed, I agree with many of the responses to this thread that advocate simply choosing a guitar that makes you smile and focusing on your performance. And Carlos Santana put it best when asked what proportion of his tone comes from his fingers versus his gear. His response: 10% from his fingers and 90% from his thighs. 🙂

And let's not forget that superstrats more easily allowed a more advanced school of playing, even if there were technical compromises to tone and sustain. After all, playing guitar is less physics and far more physicality. Plus, of course, you might just prefer the sound.

Rather, it is a matter of trade-offs: between playability and tone, and even affordability. After all, through-neck, premium wood guitars are more expensive to make than basswood bolt-ons.

But FWIW, I think your goal to understand why one guitar sounds better than another is a worthy one and will help inform your choices if you commission a new custom build. And while I'm sure you already know that it won't make you sound like anything other than you, at least you'll be that little bit more happy doing so. 🙂

I kind of bought into this idea around the time Mayones and specifically the Regius started getting popular online, like YOU HAVE to have a strong ass multi ply neck
 
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