Game of Thrones

[pink freud]

The reason I think that Stannis killing his daughter is so incredible is because it sets up two contrasting viewpoints of Stannis that both can be simultaneously felt.

On one hand, Stannis seems to have gone over the edge, mentally and emotionally. When I was watching that burning scene I couldn't help but look at how horribly drained they made Stannis look. He's so haggard and at least on some level hates himself. It makes you hate Stannis and want to see him suffer.

However, it doesn't make you want to truly see him fail. Because if he fails, if he falls in battle with Roose or just abandons his quest for the throne, then everything, including the sacrificing of his daughter, will have been for nothing. I would personally rather see him march all the way to King's Landing and fulfill his journey than watch him fail at this point.

I thought this past episode was great with Stannis and I really like him as a character because his flaws are so apparent. I don't know why everyone is flipping out over him sacrificing his daughter, it's crazy but it so easily fits his character.

Also Team Dany.

They really need to reinforce him being on the throne = a king who cares about the White Walkers more in the show. Thus far the focus has been more on him "deserving" the throne through heredity and what-not, which gives his actions a selfish tinge, especially when mixing the religious chosen-one stuff in. His actions have been despicable but would be more understandable if they gave more depth to his motives. Surely if Sam can give a speech about why Jon letting Wildlings through the gate is a good idea somebody can give a speech on why Stannis offering up people as sacrifice is a good idea (beyond some deity wanting it).

 

[AliceLG]

All I could think about after watching the episode was what will Ser Davos do when he comes back? One could argue that he knew what was going to happen given his last scene in the episode but he's the one person that truly loved that poor child. Selyse immediately regretting her decision was also a little bit redeeming.

 

[theFraz]

How does it not make sense?

Stannis killed his brother with black magic to get what he wanted.
Stannis burned his wife's uncle at the stake to get what he wanted.
Stannis leeched his bastard nephew to get what he wanted.

Stannis is relentless in his what he is willing to sacrifice to put himself on the Iron Throne - he has been from day 1. Why is it just now crossing the line when he's already shown time and time again that killing/using his own family members is a means than justifies the ends?

Agree!
But I felt like "it's episode 9 something shocking must happen, let's look at Stannis"

P.S.: I saw this episode right after playing Dragon Age Inquisition and the final scene was awesome

 

[Sumsar]

All I could think about after watching the episode was what will Ser Davos do when he comes back? One could argue that he knew what was going to happen given his last scene in the episode but he's the one person that truly loved that poor child. Selyse immediately regretting her decision was also a little bit redeeming.

Hopefully Davos will do something drastic - him rebelling (or whatever it comes to) againts Stannis is what 3 seasons overdue?

 

[Deadnightshade]

Spoiler

When she killed Daeron and told the Kindly Man that it wasn't she who did it, but Arya Stark, she showed a disassociation from her identity that she had up to that point not shown. This disassociation of her identity was a vital pre-requisite to becoming a Faceless Man. Once she demonstrated this ability, her real training began. And the first part of her real training was being blinded to hone her other senses.

So when Arya kills Meryn Trant and tell Jaqen H'ghar it wasn't she who killed him, but Arya Stark, Jaqen will reward her with the first part of her real training - which involves her going blind.

Spoiler

Maybe I just didn't understand it correctly from the books on my first read when she killed the merchant, so in that case you're right.

But I have to say the disassociation makes no sense if Jaren accepts it after she's killed Trant. She had a grudge with that guy as Arya, what makes Jaren think that she understood anything at all from everything they have taught her if the first life she took wasn't the target she was assigned?

 

[vividox]

Spoiler

Maybe I just didn't understand it correctly from the books on my first read when she killed the merchant, so in that case you're right.

But I have to say the disassociation makes no sense if Jaren accepts it after she's killed Trant. She had a grudge with that guy as Arya, what makes Jaren think that she understood anything at all from everything they have taught her if the first life she took wasn't the target she was assigned?

Spoiler

Arya has been asked who she is since she arrived at the temple. When she answers "Arya Stark", she is giving the wrong answer because a Faceless Man is no one who simply wears identities to sneak around and give the gift.

By claiming she didn't make the kill but rather Arya Stark did, she's showing she's embraced the fact that she is no longer Arya Stark, while simultaneously using the identity of Arya Stark to give the gift of death. Which is exactly what the Faceless Men do.

Her mission doesn't really matter, it's just a means to an end. Rejecting the idea that she is Arya Stark and using the 'alternate identity' of Arya Stark to give the gift is all that really matters. That's the 'end'.

 

[OmegaSlayer]

I'm a horrible person, I didn't found that scene disturbing and it was announced for a good while, so it didn't shocked me at all.

 

[wankerness]

Yeah, after that scene with him telling her how he fought to keep her alive as a baby it was obvious it was coming with the way this show works.

 

[OmegaSlayer]

What bugged me more is that they were able to make an episode with Tyrion barely speaking

 

[pink freud]

What bugged me more is that they were able to make an episode with Tyrion barely speaking

He said a lot, just not in words. His facial expressions were on point this episode (as ever, really).

 

[groverj3]

<nerd>

I absolutely was expecting him to burn Shireen.

That's probably because I've read every fan theory on where the story is going.

</nerd>

 

[UnattendedGolfcart]

He said a lot, just not in words. His facial expressions were on point this episode (as ever, really).

He also killed a guy to protect Missandei. I yelled and fist pumped when that happened.

 

[groverj3]

I was thinking about this today. Isn't it kind of interesting that the story obviously describes The Lord of Light/Red God, and the Old Gods as having real power and nothing like that is ever shown about the majority religion in Westeros (The Seven)? It even seems like the Many Faced God (Death) is real in this story due to the abilities of the faceless men. Not sure about the Drowned God though, not much evidence in the story that I know of about any real power it has.

Wouldn't it be interesting if the majority religion in Westeros is false, but all these other fringe beliefs have some evidence behind them?

 

[PlumbTheDerps]

I think that's deliberate. All the "old world" stuff, like R'hllor, MFG, and the north's Old Gods, is derived from millennia of connections between men (or the children of the forest) and nature, whereas the faith of the seven is an artificial religious-political construct designed to bolster the religious legitimacy of the monarchy.

 

[vividox]

I was thinking about this today. Isn't it kind of interesting that the story obviously describes The Lord of Light/Red God, and the Old Gods as having real power and nothing like that is ever shown about the majority religion in Westeros (The Seven)? It even seems like the Many Faced God (Death) is real in this story due to the abilities of the faceless men. Not sure about the Drowned God though, not much evidence in the story that I know of about any real power it has.

Wouldn't it be interesting if the majority religion in Westeros is false, but all these other fringe beliefs have some evidence behind them?

I definitely think the Faith of the Seven is a false religion, as is the religion of the Drowned God.

I'm not completely sold on the authenticity of the other religions either, though. I think all you can say for certain is that some forms of magic are real and some people are really good at convincing you that their god exists. R'hllor has the most credibility by far, but even that could be blood magic and illusions.

 

[groverj3]

I think that's deliberate. All the "old world" stuff, like R'hllor, MFG, and the north's Old Gods, is derived from millennia of connections between men (or the children of the forest) and nature, whereas the faith of the seven is an artificial religious-political construct designed to bolster the religious legitimacy of the monarchy.

Agree with your point about it being a political construct. How fitting that it is now spiraling out of the monarchy's control.

I definitely think the Faith of the Seven is a false religion, as is the religion of the Drowned God.

I'm not completely sold on the authenticity of the other religions either, though. I think all you can say for certain is that some forms of magic are real and some people are really good at convincing you that their god exists. R'hllor has the most credibility by far, but even that could be blood magic and illusions.

I think this is likely.

Or perhaps R'hllor is based on something "real" and so is The Great Other that it is supposedly fighting. However, perhaps whatever things have inspired the religion are not "gods" in the sense of being a conscious being. Just like... opposing forces? People just worship them as gods (all of them, but R'hllor is the closest to the truth, hence the apparent evidence for it) because people are really great at anthropomorphizing things in nature.

Which, actually, is pretty much the same as what you said .

 

[AxeHappy]

It is interesting that all the magic stuff had stopped working until the Dragons were born. Some connections between magic and the dragons.

 

[Deadnightshade]

Yeah, after that scene with him telling her how he fought to keep her alive as a baby it was obvious it was coming with the way this show works.

Since this ventures towards stuff not yet released in the books (apart from the teaser extract), I thought the possibility of refusing to burn Shireen would be a hint that Stannis will lose the war. But when I saw that the scene between her and Davos started with almost half the screen being filled with a warming fire next to the little princess, I thought "well that's a future bacon I'm seeing".

EDIT: It was actually between Shireen and her father, and it starts with her playing with the stagg Davos gifted her.

 

[michblanch]

Big night tonite.

Hopefully we'll get a shocker like the Red Wedding.

 

[wankerness]

Beware of the internet today, lot of spoilers flying around since some jerk leaked pictures from post-production.