God, Aliens and Astronauts

[Jakke]

All these discussions end up in heated debates. I have not seen any good coming from them.
I imagine on these forums a true Christian is "fresh meat" for those vocally opposed to the message of Jesus.

I'm curious, what arbiters a true christian? There are about 41000 different christian denominations in the world, it's very statistically unlikely that one denomination outside of the major ones would sit on The One Truth.

Speaking biblically, didn't Jesus give the mission to Paul to build his church (you are the rock on which I will build my church, and so forth)? Thus logically following of course that catholicism would be the one true faith, provided there is need for one.
I would imagine that you are not a catholic though, being from Texas and all.. Southern Baptist, or Pentecostal would be my guess, especially with that particular bible verse in your sig, catholics are generally not really followers of the Book of Revelation. They tend to view the extreme vagueness of it and just consider it allegorical.

I don't know anything about "fresh meat", I would imagine that any arguments speaks for themselves, and I certainly hope that everyone are intellectually honest enough to not attack you out of a knee-jerk.
We have a number of very christian people on this board, and I respect them deeply, because they are nice people, and they are very capable of defending their faith. What they don't do is pull the persecution card, which I find is unfortunately far too common from believers these days.

However, my belief is people believe what they want to hear.

But you have no actual logical or physical evidence that people chooses their beliefs?

There is of course a documentet phenomena where we unconciously select facts as important that happens to side with our beliefs, that's called confirmation bias. That bias acts on behalf of our beliefs however, not on them.

 

[flint757]

All these discussions end up in heated debates. I have not seen any good coming from them.
I imagine on these forums a true Christian is "fresh meat" for those vocally opposed to the message of Jesus.

I will answer PM's, and I am willing to talk about Jesus to anyone. However, my belief is people believe what they want to hear.

Heated debate how? You expressed your opinion and how you have come to hold that opinion and then a few of us posted the same. It is barely a debate at all.

The discussion is no more 'heated' than it was prior to your entry.

 

[Jakke]

^Also this, I have seen more heated debate on this forum on actives vs. passives or Axe-FX vs. proper amps (and the proper amps are of course the superior one).

And while we're at that, I don't really see what is wrong with heated debate. Just because something gets heated doesn't mean we forgo all civility and get banned

 

[facepalm66]

You can find anything, if you seek for it, wether it exsists or not. If you find it too difficult, some acid always helps.. Just kidding.
But the whole god thing is as funny as 1970 horror movies. Stating that there's an invisible man, living in the sky, watching your every move and listening to your every word is just too silly to belive in.

I, personally, belive that God is I, so basically I belive in myself. And it brought me way more than mr So-called-god did, while stupidly kneeling in the church, bursting into tears for a crusified statue asking for a pair of better quality pink socks...
I thought humanity is actually learning something.. Part of it doesn't, i assume.

 

[flint757]

I think it all goes back to what I had stated previously. 'True believers' (as if there is such a thing) feel blasphemous discussing these sort of topics and feel like we are filling their heads with blasphemous thoughts by even discussing such things. So to them these discussions are personal. The thing seemingly forgotten is conversation doesn't have to have an end goal. When discussing religion it shouldn't be (and isn't) my goal to convert someone to be a non-believer and it shouldn't be someone else's goal to convert non-believer's. If the conversation does sway someone then so be it, but that should never be the end goal IMO.

That being the case there is zero reason for anyone to take it personally. If different religions can converse without feeling 'threatened' then so should believers and non-believers. I do find it funny that Athiest's are practically persecuted (religious followers outnumber Athiest's publicly) in the real world and yet religious folk are somehow always the victims. I've heard people blame terrible events on Athiesm, we won't have an openly Athiest president any time soon and it is an uphill battle for most other positions as well. By many religious folk we are summed up as immoral creatures for whatever bizarre reason. Even so I don't think anyone should play the victim card as it solves nothing.

Everyone has the right to feel and believe whatever makes them happy. Everyone has the right to express those view points publicly and discussion should be allowed openly. Nothing more and nothing less.

 

[The Omega Cluster]

Of course, I believe science may never be able to disprove the existence of a superior being, as there will always be the possibility of better technology, further observations, etc.

We may never know if the flying spaghetti monster exists or not. Those who wish to believe find it, I guess.

In fact, some recent works (like this one Project MUSE - Functional Salutogenic Mechanisms of the Brain) show that the belief in a higher authority, or "spirituality" might have been evolutionary chosen for their benefits on the self.

So yeah, God exists... in your head.

 

[jl-austin]

I don't feel threatened, not at all. I have enjoyed reading your responses. This has not been a heated debate, however these things tend to turn ugly.

None of the responses has shaken my view of "a person believes what he wants to believe". There are atheist who post stuff, then there is the Bible, the choice is, what do you want to believe. That is the whole key, what a person wants. You can lead a horse to water, but if it doesn't want to drink.

The original post asked what my beliefs where, I shared them. Do I think I am going to convert someone because of a post over the internet? Of course not. There is little for me to gain my debating my personal beliefs.

 

[jl-austin]

Every thing in the universe acts on the laws which govern that object. An object will always fall at the same rate due to gravity, water will always freeze at the same temperature, etc. I don't see any acts of randomness in our universe. I see every thing following the laws that govern that object.

Yet, atheists would have you to believe that something as complex as the human body was formed out of "randomness". Were is your god of randomness today?

Scientist do not even fully understand the working of the human body, yet they claim that it was formed out of randomness. Its comical. The theory of there being a God is just as believable as any other theory, it just gets back around to what a person WANTS to believe.

 

[The Omega Cluster]

Every thing in the universe acts on the laws which govern that object. An object will always fall at the same rate due to gravity,

If you don't take into account air resistance, yes.

water will always freeze at the same temperature, etc.

On Mt Everest, water boils at 71°C, and would boil at 290°C at the bottom of the Marianas Trench.

I don't see any acts of randomness in our universe. I see every thing following the laws that govern that object.

Roll a dice.

Yet, atheists would have you to believe that something as complex as the human body was formed out of "randomness". Were is your god of randomness today?

Randomness needs not a god to be explained. Nor does life. Nor does the universe.

Scientist do not even fully understand the working of the human body, yet they claim that it was formed out of randomness. Its comical. The theory of there being a God is just as believable as any other theory, it just gets back around to what a person WANTS to believe.

We're getting to it, do not worry! Scientists and researchers all around the world are working hard in order to fully comprehend the role and function of every protein, every gene, every molecule in your body. Do you know the exact position and momentum of every atom present in a glass of water? Yet, water was not created by any intelligence.

 

[HaMMerHeD]

It is very, very probable that there is no God.

It is very, very probable that there is intelligent life elsewhere in the universe, and quite likely that there is life much, much more intelligent than we are.

I think life probably came to Earth in the form of organic molecular soup from a comet impact, followed by hundreds of millions of years of stewing as the Earth cooled and became friendly to life. As for what triggered the difference between organic molecular soup and life itself, I don't know. I am quite certain that the answer is not God, and I am content to wonder and think about how it actually went down. I am confident that careful observation and experimentation will eventually lead to a real answer.

 

[HaMMerHeD]

...The theory of there being a God is just as believable as any other theory...

Except that there is no evidence for it.

 

[Jakke]

^I would also rank it as an hypothesis, not a theory

 

[HaMMerHeD]

^I would also rank it as an hypothesis, not a theory

Quite so.

 

[Jakke]

Indeed

 

[HaMMerHeD]

Pip pip, cheerio.

 

[Jakke]

Tip top old chap.

 

[UV7BK4LIFE]

I think that Aliens performed a genetic experiment on monkeys and we're the result. And religion helps us deny it.

And so far we did pretty good. Heavy Metal, Guitars, Muscle cars, Beer. Life is awesome.

 

[flint757]

I don't feel threatened, not at all. I have enjoyed reading your responses. This has not been a heated debate, however these things tend to turn ugly.

Good to hear. While I wrote that because of your comment, it was also just general commentary that I feel people should do when having such conversations (the second half anyhow).

None of the responses has shaken my view of "a person believes what he wants to believe". There are atheist who post stuff, then there is the Bible, the choice is, what do you want to believe. That is the whole key, what a person wants. You can lead a horse to water, but if it doesn't want to drink.

The original post asked what my beliefs where, I shared them. Do I think I am going to convert someone because of a post over the internet? Of course not. There is little for me to gain my debating my personal beliefs.

Precisely. That being said, I wouldn't say there is nothing to gain in you joining in on the discussion. There is much to gain. The only issue is you might not like what people have to say.

Every thing in the universe acts on the laws which govern that object. An object will always fall at the same rate due to gravity, water will always freeze at the same temperature, etc. I don't see any acts of randomness in our universe. I see every thing following the laws that govern that object.

Yet, atheists would have you to believe that something as complex as the human body was formed out of "randomness". Were is your god of randomness today?

Scientist do not even fully understand the working of the human body, yet they claim that it was formed out of randomness. Its comical. The theory of there being a God is just as believable as any other theory, it just gets back around to what a person WANTS to believe.

The other side of the coin, that people seem to forget, is random does not mean roll the dice once and if it works you got us and if not then you don't. Metaphorically, say we need 5528 6's. There'd be millions of die being rolled all at once. Whatever works sticks around and this process continually happens until we get our where we are today. We are not perfect either. We have organs that are useless, body parts that don't always function right, common health conditions, not the best sense of smell or sight, etc. I'm no evolutionary biologist though, so anyone feel free to correct me.

I can respect where your coming from, but to say it is ridiculous that it is random makes me think you haven't taken any classes on statistics/probability/chemistry or considered the scope at all.

It is very, very probable that there is no God.

It is very, very probable that there is intelligent life elsewhere in the universe, and quite likely that there is life much, much more intelligent than we are.

I think life probably came to Earth in the form of organic molecular soup from a comet impact, followed by hundreds of millions of years of stewing as the Earth cooled and became friendly to life. As for what triggered the difference between organic molecular soup and life itself, I don't know. I am quite certain that the answer is not God, and I am content to wonder and think about how it actually went down. I am confident that careful observation and experimentation will eventually lead to a real answer.

That is actually highly probable IMO as well. Comets transfer all kinds of material all across the universe and it seems perfectly reasonable that some biological matter hitched a ride ending up here. Even if that wasn't the case I'd be hard pressed to say this hasn't happened at all. I imagine some lifeforms, whether bacteria, virus, single celled organism or whatever, have come here this way at some point even if there was no link between them and us.

 

[Jakke]

We have organs that are useless, body parts that don't always function right, common health conditions, not the best sense of smell or sight, etc. I'm no evolutionary biologist though, so anyone feel free to correct me.

I have two words: wisdom teeth

 

[HaMMerHeD]

People who are inclined to boil evolution down to pure random chaos are people who do not understand the theory at all.