Help me decide which head and cab to buy

[MetalHead40]

Speakers make more of a difference than almost any change you can make to your rig. You can dial in a just about any two high gain heads and get close in tone, but change the cab/speakers and it sounds VERY different.

From my experience, I respectfully disagree. I've had several different cabs/speaker combos side by side and the same amp through all sounds essentially the same to my ears. Brighter or darker for sure...Greenbacks vs. K100s...but the amp still sounds quite the same. Uber still sounded like an Uber through Bogner v30 412, Whitebox K100 loaded 2x12, or EVH greenback loaded 412. Same for every other amp I've had. But put two different amps next to each other through the same cab, vastly different or could be dialed in similar.

 

[USMarine75]

From my experience, I respectfully disagree. I've had several different cabs/speaker combos side by side and the same amp through all sounds essentially the same to my ears. Brighter or darker for sure...Greenbacks vs. K100s...but the amp still sounds quite the same. Uber still sounded like an Uber through Bogner v30 412, Whitebox K100 loaded 2x12, or EVH greenback loaded 412. Same for every other amp I've had. But put two different amps next to each other through the same cab, vastly different or could be dialed in similar.

It's like the debate over EL34 vs 6L6. The circuit matters far more than the tube. I've put both in the same amp and it sounds slightly different. Mostly it's that EL34 breakup sooner and have less bass especially at lower volumes. Otherwise, the amp sounds like the amp. The least changes come from tubes and pickups IME, yet guitarists often spend the most time on these. YMMV

 

[G_3_3_k_]

It's like the debate over EL34 vs 6L6. The circuit matters far more than the tube. I've put both in the same amp and it sounds slightly different. Mostly it's that EL34 breakup sooner and have less bass especially at lower volumes. Otherwise, the amp sounds like the amp. The least changes come from tubes and pickups IME, yet guitarists often spend the most time on these. YMMV

Speakers and amp Circuit will always affect the tone the most, other than scale of the guitar. The litmus test of this is plugging a sick guitar into a shitty amp and cab. Then plug a shitty guitar with shitty pickups into a really nice amp and cab. Which will sound better 9 times out of 10? The shitty guitar plugged into the really nice amp and cab. However, there is the sum of the parts. Each thing being a slightly different filter stacking up on each other. Pickups CAN have a pretty drastic affect. Most don't. When you stack up short scale, bassy pickups, oversized cab, hemp cone speakers, and a dark amp, you're going to end up with mud city. The sick guitar, with really clear pickups, into the really good amp with the best cab and speakers is going to sound better than either of the two previous options. @MetalHead40 that's not to say that each part doesn't add its own unique flavor. They all do. A speaker isn't going to make a Soldano not sound like a Soldano. But the wrong speaker/cab will keep a Soldano from sounding its best.

 

[MetalHead40]

It's like the debate over EL34 vs 6L6. The circuit matters far more than the tube. I've put both in the same amp and it sounds slightly different. Mostly it's that EL34 breakup sooner and have less bass especially at lower volumes. Otherwise, the amp sounds like the amp. The least changes come from tubes and pickups IME, yet guitarists often spend the most time on these. YMMV

Clips are clips and I don't take anything from them aside from entertainment...not meant to be insulting.

I agree with your tube statement 100% both preamp and power. Always sounds like the same amp to me as opposed to the claims of many: "I swapped tubes and it's like a completely different amp" I've swapped tubes to beat the band and I hear/feel the same as you...minor minor difference. Pickups...I tend to notice significant change in tone/feel with pups. Many of these component changes have minimal impact on amp tone IMHO; its there but nothing drastic to these old ears.

Despite my previous experiences with speakers/cabs, I plan on trying a new cab/speaker combo soon with the same amp, so I'm curious to see if I hear/feel a significant change. Don't get me wrong, I definitely hear differences between speakers/cabs, but it's more just like...less highs vs. more highs, mids in a slightly different place, different low end for sure. But the amp always sounds like the same amp to me more or less regardless of speaker/cab. Maybe this next cab/speaker experiment will prove different.

 

[MetalHead40]

Speakers and amp Circuit will always affect the tone the most, other than scale of the guitar. The litmus test of this is plugging a sick guitar into a shitty amp and cab. Then plug a shitty guitar with shitty pickups into a really nice amp and cab. Which will sound better 9 times out of 10? The shitty guitar plugged into the really nice amp and cab. However, there is the sum of the parts. Each thing being a slightly different filter stacking up on each other. Pickups CAN have a pretty drastic affect. Most don't. When you stack up short scale, bassy pickups, oversized cab, hemp cone speakers, and a dark amp, you're going to end up with mud city. The sick guitar, with really clear pickups, into the really good amp with the best cab and speakers is going to sound better than either of the two previous options. @MetalHead40 that's not to say that each part doesn't add its own unique flavor. They all do. A speaker isn't going to make a Soldano not sound like a Soldano. But the wrong speaker/cab will keep a Soldano from sounding its best.

Good points. I'm curious to try the Wizard through a particular Randall v30 loaded 412. My local shop has some of these cabs and I'll be damned if every amp I hear through it sounds great. I traded an Uber in at this shop and the manager plugged it in to that Randall to test it and I swore I never heard that amp sound so good. That was straight in where to get it where I liked it I needed an eq in the loop and a boost out front.

 

[G_3_3_k_]

Good points. I'm curious to try the Wizard through a particular Randall v30 loaded 412. My local shop has some of these cabs and I'll be damned if every amp I hear through it sounds great. I traded an Uber in at this shop and the manager plugged it in to that Randall to test it and I swore I never heard that amp sound so good. That was straight in where to get it where I liked it I needed an eq in the loop and a boost out front.

That call also be the player. Bone tone is a thing. EVH sounds like EVH no matter what he plugs in to. Same with me. Most actual tone issues can be fixed with technique.

 

[WarMachine]

5150/6505s are great but you'll literally sound like everyone else. 6505 in to something with v-30s.

This is why an EVH 4x12 is awesome with a 5150. You aren't getting V30's and it doesn't sound like everyone else. It sounds like it could eat everyone else.

 

[USMarine75]

Clips are clips and I don't take anything from them aside from entertainment...not meant to be insulting.

I agree with your tube statement 100% both preamp and power. Always sounds like the same amp to me as opposed to the claims of many: "I swapped tubes and it's like a completely different amp" I've swapped tubes to beat the band and I hear/feel the same as you...minor minor difference. Pickups...I tend to notice significant change in tone/feel with pups. Many of these component changes have minimal impact on amp tone IMHO; its there but nothing drastic to these old ears.

Despite my previous experiences with speakers/cabs, I plan on trying a new cab/speaker combo soon with the same amp, so I'm curious to see if I hear/feel a significant change. Don't get me wrong, I definitely hear differences between speakers/cabs, but it's more just like...less highs vs. more highs, mids in a slightly different place, different low end for sure. But the amp always sounds like the same amp to me more or less regardless of speaker/cab. Maybe this next cab/speaker experiment will prove different.

Hmm... usually its the other way around. Most producers I've read opinions from say Speakers/cabs (especially matching to your amp) make a huge difference. Maybe you're using similar speakers when swapping and that's why you don't hear a difference?

Here's an example of a cheap Marshall Lead 12 head into a cheap Peavey cab (combo used as cab) with a good speaker.



Absolutely nails Kiss' first live album tone.

 

[budda]

Do I need to cab roll in the axe fx