Holy Intonation Batman

[Zehailiu]

I put a 65 on my ibby and tuned it to B standard, and something just sounded fucked up about it. I hook up a tuner and checked the intonation, it turns out the open B is giving me a C at 12th and a higher than C# at 24th, so I moved the saddle all the way back, but it's still really bad, it's probably half way between B and C at 12th and C# at 24th.
What do I do?

How come I didn't have this problem with a 70 I had before? @_@

 

[Shadow_6667]

What gauge strings are you using?

 

[Zehailiu]

standard 9s I believe.

 

[GazPots]

How high is the action at the 12th in millimetres?

 

[MF_Kitten]

gahh, i always hated intonation issues!

it's one of the reasons i love baritone scales. they intonate reeeeally easily

but yeah, it has alot to do with the strings apparently. something about where the "middle" of the string is compared to the windings and stuff. i hope someone here can explain

 

[dpm]

stretch the crap out of the string until it has no stretch left, then reintonate starting with the saddle just behind the E string saddle where you'd expect it to be.

What brand string is it? It could be a faulty string. Loose windings will screw with intonation and basically make it impossible to adjust correctly.

 

[CrushingAnvil]

stretch the crap out of the string until it has no stretch left, then reintonate starting with the saddle just behind the E string saddle where you'd expect it to be.

What brand string is it? It could be a faulty string. Loose windings will screw with intonation and basically make it impossible to adjust correctly.

^this

also

fuck

.65 is pretty fuckin' big for B

 

[technomancer]

fuck

.65 is pretty fuckin' big for B

What Dan said... and I'm using a 68 for B

 

[Zehailiu]

Action is about 1.5mm at 12th and 2mm at 24th.
Thanks for the tip, I'll stretch it out some and see.
Like I said I had a 70 on here before and it didn't behave this way, the only difference was for the 70 I cut off the ball end and stuck that into the saddle.
For the 65 I cut off the unwound end and stuck it into the saddle, could that make a difference?

 

[DaveCarter]

Im having the same problem at the moment on my 7321. Ive put the saddle as far back as I can without the screw coming out, but the fretted note is still sharp. I think Im going to have to tweak the truss rod, which scares me!!

 

[dpm]

Truss rod adjustment is not intonation adjustment. The truss rod's job is to counteract string tension and is adjusted to a point of minimal relief (there's a small acceptable range of relief depending on playing style etc.)

65 -> 70 is common for a low B and balances out nicely with a 52 E string.

Action is about 1.5mm at 12th and 2mm at 24th.
Thanks for the tip, I'll stretch it out some and see.
Like I said I had a 70 on here before and it didn't behave this way, the only difference was for the 70 I cut off the ball end and stuck that into the saddle.
For the 65 I cut off the unwound end and stuck it into the saddle, could that make a difference?

Depending on the string construction you may have effected the windings. It's doubtful though. Some brands are wound on a round core so the windings loosen as soon as either end is cut. With hex core strings the windings kind of lock into the core so they're less prone to loose windings. Sometimes a dud string just gets through the quality control process regardless of construction.

Im having the same problem at the moment on my 7321. Ive put the saddle as far back as I can without the screw coming out, but the fretted note is still sharp. I think Im going to have to tweak the truss rod, which scares me!!

If you can move the saddle 1/4" back past the end of the scale length you should have enough adjustment range (so on a 25.5" scale the point where the string leaves the saddle is 25.75" from the nut). You might need to shorten or remove the spring.

 

[Zehailiu]

It's a D'addario.

 

[Pingu]

65 -> 70 is common for a low B and balances out nicely with a 52 E string.

I use a 54 for my low B on a 24.75". But I like my lower strings floppy.

 

[XeoFLCL]

What Dan said... and I'm using a 68 for B

.68 for my low B here too! We should start a Fatass string brigade

Action is about 1.5mm at 12th and 2mm at 24th.
Thanks for the tip, I'll stretch it out some and see.
Like I said I had a 70 on here before and it didn't behave this way, the only difference was for the 70 I cut off the ball end and stuck that into the saddle.
For the 65 I cut off the unwound end and stuck it into the saddle, could that make a difference?

It could.. and you said it was a D'addario right? IIRC those are roundwound w/ roundcores.. so it could've come loose. I've had a similar issue happen with me with a .52 low E on my old 6 string (believe it was a D'addario aswell), it came unwound at the saddle a week later and that was what the problem was, weak windings

I use a 54 for my low B on a 24.75". But I like my lower strings floppy.

Jesus. Thats ridiculously small for me If I can put medium pressure on my low B while fretting and knock it slightly out of intonation with aforementioned pressure, then it's too light for me

 

[Daemoniac]

What Dan said... and I'm using a 68 for B

^this

also

fuck

.65 is pretty fuckin' big for B

These, and Dans

And i use a 70 for C

 

[DaveCarter]

If you can move the saddle 1/4" back past the end of the scale length you should have enough adjustment range (so on a 25.5" scale the point where the string leaves the saddle is 25.75" from the nut). You might need to shorten or remove the spring.

But it needs to go the other way! The fretted note gets closer to the 12th fret harmonic the more i loosen the screw (saddle moves closer towards the neck), but before the note is spot-on the screw comes out the back of the saddle! I needs longer screw?

 

[dpm]

Which string is it? The most forward position a saddle could possibly intonate is slightly longer than the scale length itself. Treble E strings intonate somewhere around 1mm past the end of the scale length depending on the string, action, etc.

Make sure it's not just your tuner playing tricks on you. Some tuners get confused by harmonic content or are just plain inaccurate. Use your ears to compare the fretted note, the harmonic, and the open string.

Again, it could just be a shitty string

 

[CrushingAnvil]

These, and Dans

And i use a 70 for C

Sorry Zakk Wylde ....

 

[DaveCarter]

Which string is it? The most forward position a saddle could possibly intonate is slightly longer than the scale length itself. Treble E strings intonate somewhere around 1mm past the end of the scale length depending on the string, action, etc.

Make sure it's not just your tuner playing tricks on you. Some tuners get confused by harmonic content or are just plain inaccurate. Use your ears to compare the fretted note, the harmonic, and the open string.

Again, it could just be a shitty string

Its happening on my low B, and its definitely not my tuner. I can hear its at least 3/4 of a tone out when I play the fretted 12th, but there is no more room at all to move the saddle, otherwise the screw comes out

 

[dpm]

Move the saddle back to where you'd expect it to be, stretch the string (is it a new string?) and start over. Lower your pickups if they are particularly close to the strings because the magnets can screw with intonation.

If it's still not possible to intonate replace the string or take it to a good tech.