How do i convince my friend to buy albums and stop torrenting?

[ilyti]

Everyone I know Seems all young people these days are crazy about their itunes/ipod with 50,000 low quality downloaded songs that they will never listen to. At least some of them care to organise it nicely..

Idiots want to get caught and prosecuted. Let it happen.

 

[benduncan]

by trying to convince him that evolution is real

 

[Hollowway]

The fact that it is wrong does not prove that it hurts artists in any way. Did you read my post? There were no claims in there about right and wrong or entitlement, legality, maturity...

I'll grant that pirating is illegal and probably wrong, but the claim that it hurts content creators financially has never been proven. A billion people pirating your CD does not mean you lost a billion sales, that is asinine.

Wow, Troy we normally agree on stuff but I disagree with you on this one. I will say that people who torrent stuff torrent way more than they would normally buy. But I don't think you could also say that the kid who downloaded his entire music collection would literally have zero CDs or legal copies if he couldn't download. That would be like saying there were music fans in the 80s that had zero tapes, vinyl, CDs. Of course they would buy some. And if they do not buy those few, then it hurts the artist.
How much the artists are hurt is debatable, certainly, but it is illegal, and the artists don't approve of it (with exceptions) so the burden of proof should not be on those who claim it doesn't hurt, not that those who claim it does. Otherwise people would be free to break any law they want, and say its justified because they don't believe there is sufficient proof that the victims are truely hurt. For instance, if I speed its illegal, regardless of whether I hit someone.
Anyway, just my dos pesos.

 

[Osiris]

You're not gunna stop torrenting. Bands know that music is going to be illegally downloaded so they just make their stuff available for free on youtube (Sumerian), Soundcloud, Bandcamp, etc. I'm not dropping $10 on a CD because I heard one song I like and can't hear the rest - this is the trap of pop music. I am extremely selective with the music I listen to, I'm not one of those "yeah that one song is good" people, I need the whole album. Music downloads allow me to test-drive music. If it's a good album I buy it, if not I delete it and move on. So don't get too pissed off about music downloads (White Knight much?) when the simple fact is they aren't going anywhere, and for the majority of people they can actually be beneficial. There will always be jackasses who exploit the system, but that's inevitable regardless of what the system is.

this, for the love of god

 

[ilyti]

If we really want to get into the grey areas here - what if I say I preview an album on Youtube and then decide to buy it? Or to not buy it? Chances are, that album was up on Youtube illegally. So for all intents and purposes I just downloaded it, then deleted it. How right/wrong is that?

Just food for thought.

Either way, if some stupid kids are bragging about their illegal music collection on FACEBOOK for gods sake, they are asking for trouble.

 

[troyguitar]

Wow, Troy we normally agree on stuff but I disagree with you on this one. I will say that people who torrent stuff torrent way more than they would normally buy. But I don't think you could also say that the kid who downloaded his entire music collection would literally have zero CDs or legal copies if he couldn't download. That would be like saying there were music fans in the 80s that had zero tapes, vinyl, CDs. Of course they would buy some. And if they do not buy those few, then it hurts the artist.
How much the artists are hurt is debatable, certainly, but it is illegal, and the artists don't approve of it (with exceptions) so the burden of proof should not be on those who claim it doesn't hurt, not that those who claim it does. Otherwise people would be free to break any law they want, and say its justified because they don't believe there is sufficient proof that the victims are truely hurt. For instance, if I speed its illegal, regardless of whether I hit someone.
Anyway, just my dos pesos.

Oh I agree, I just don't know anybody out there downloading everything and buying nothing. It could be that I just haven't run into them, but everyone I know buys stuff that they care about and downloads or accepts copied cd's/mp3's of stuff that they're less interested in.

I know that I personally have bought more CD's and concert tickets with illegal downloading that I ever did before I started. My library went from ~100 CD's to ~1000 and I went as far as driving several hours to see random European power metal bands that I would NEVER taken chances on if I had not pirated their CD's before buying. So who am I hurting here? I take a risk of getting busted so I'm hurting myself a bit, but artists are getting more of my money - not less.

 

[morrowcosom]

Call the cops on your friend and get him sent to music prison.

 

[WhiteWalls]

I have a really hard time considering torrenting "stealing", because nothing gets lost in the process, it's just a duplication. If somebody steals my bike, I'm gonna be pissed because I don't have a bike anymore, not because somebody now has a new bike. The most common mistake is thinking that 100 torrent downloads would be 100 sales if torrents didn't exist, which is completely ridiculous because you can't simply decide what a person's budget is, in particular for non-vital things (you certainly have to buy food, but you can live without music)

Should the band be paid for their efforts? Of course, but many don't realize that pretty much everyone is in a band now, and so the pie is split in infinitely more pieces compared to years ago. How many bands were around in the early 90s compared to now?
The market is so saturated that if illegal downloads didn't exist, live shows couldn't exist too, because nobody would know of any of these bands, and people cannot simply roll the dice and drop 15$ on an album that they don't know if it's any good.
I always end up supporting the bands I love by going to their gigs, buying merch, buying their records etc, but from the band's economic point of view, it's better for me to torrent it than not hear it at all, because if I download it there's a chance I like their music and support them in the future.

 

[avenger]

Oh I agree, I just don't know anybody out there downloading everything and buying nothing. It could be that I just haven't run into them, but everyone I know buys stuff that they care about and downloads or accepts copied cd's/mp3's of stuff that they're less interested in.

I know that I personally have bought more CD's and concert tickets with illegal downloading that I ever did before I started. My library went from ~100 CD's to ~1000 and I went as far as driving several hours to see random European power metal bands that I would NEVER taken chances on if I had not pirated their CD's before buying. So who am I hurting here? I take a risk of getting busted so I'm hurting myself a bit, but artists are getting more of my money - not less.

I agree 100% with you on this one.

I think for more underground scenes *pirating* is usually beneficial to a band as it gives them way more exposure then they would have received without it.

Why people get such a mega boner over this whole thing is because of fuckwads who download, find awesome bands they love, and don't support them by purchasing their albums.

Also mainstream music has probably taken a HUGE hit. Why buy *trend of the months* album when I can download their one hit single for free?

AND is torrenting really that different then 80's tape trading?

I want to say "Fuck you Lars." but I am unsure of his tape trading past.

Call the cops on your friend and get him sent to music prison.

Explorer is that you?

 

[Konfyouzd]

Everyone I know Seems all young people these days are crazy about their itunes/ipod with 50,000 low quality downloaded songs that they will never listen to. At least some of them care to organise it nicely..

Ipod libraries are like facebook friends... Mostly just for show...

 

[Konfyouzd]

...the mind of a five-year-old.

Disagreeing with what they do is one, thing, but to say someone has the mind of a 5 year old is a bit ironic considering you wanna start name calling bc someone has a difference of opinion.

Also, to those who say they've bought more underground bands' music as a result of pirating, fair point I suppose. I can see that. At the same time, don't a lot of those bands put their albums up for free download anyway?

 

[troyguitar]

Also, to those who say they've bought more underground bands' music as a result of pirating, fair point I suppose. I can see that. At the same time, don't a lot of those bands put their albums up for free download anyway?

They do now, but I did most of this 10-15 years ago before that become popular and it has just become habit. No real reason to change outside of paranoia

 

[Konfyouzd]

Ahh fair enough.

 

[guitareben]

 

[Hollowway]

I know that I personally have bought more CD's and concert tickets with illegal downloading that I ever did before I started. My library went from ~100 CD's to ~1000 and I went as far as driving several hours to see random European power metal bands that I would NEVER taken chances on if I had not pirated their CD's before buying.

Yeah, that's a good point. And as has been pointed out above, bootleg versions of live shows back in the day were the equivalent of this today. I guess what we could say is that torrenting is not a priori bad, but downloading in lieu of legitimate purchasing, if you actually like the band, is bad. I remember back in the '90s when Tower Records was still around they had a policy where you could buy an album, listen to it, and exchange it if you didn't like it. I was getting into some obscure industrial at that point, and there were no other avenues to try out the songs to see if I liked them.

We, as a group, are probably not the people the RIAA, et. al., is after here. The people they are after are the ones who know full well what "Umbrella" from Rhianna sounds like, but decide to pirate it rather than buy it. That's one less sale for Rhianna when that happens. (Artist aside - I don't like Rhianna because she is just a figurehead for manufactured pop tunes. But the example holds.) I think the majority of us are probably under the "let me check out these super obscure guys that I have no chance of hearing otherwise, and if I like them I'll support them because I value this art form."

Anyone on here who believes that they shouldn't have to pay for digital music at all should either be prepared to work for free themselves or to admit to outright stealing. My guess is there isn't anyone on here like that, though.

 

[Luke Acacia]

What pisses me off is when fellow musician buddies of mine does it.

 

[Eric Christian]

As the name states, im sick of everyone on my facebook feed post their massive illigal music collections, then stating it isnt hindering the artist. And that its good for the music insutry..
Its really fucking pissing me off

I think the RIAA has a paramilitary group that could help your friend...