Independent Scotland Referendum 2015

[Varcolac]

Is there some specific reason Scotland would have to have a different currency? Does the UK government restrict the use of the GBP to the UK alone? I know the USD is the official currency of more than just the US (East Timor, El Salvador, Ecuador, and one of two officials in Panama), is that not possible with the GBP?

It's possible, and the Chancellor's talking out of his arse when he says the Scots can't use it - I don't think the US had any involvement when Ecuador decided to scrap the sucre and convert to dollars. Or they could just keep printing Scottish money and peg it to the pound at a 1:1 ratio, which'd have about the same effect. China pegged the Yuan to the dollar for ages and it didn't hurt them in the slightest.

 

[maliciousteve]

The GBP (Pound Sterling) is used (at this moment) in England, Wales, Scotland and Northern Ireland. It's not used any where else.

As far as I can make out, the current UK government doesn't want Scotland to become independent. So they have set out terms that Scotland would have to also be financially independent too, should people vote in favor of independence.

It's really a way of trying to influence the Scottish to not vote in favor, a sort of scare tactic. Worrying people into thinking that if they no longer have the Pound, Scotland would either have to come up with their own currency, which may or may not work out so well or go with the Euro. Some one else has already pointed out, is not doing so well.

The way I see it, if you want your country to be independent then why not be financially independent too. You can then control your own national interest rates and stimulus packages etc

 

[Repner]

The GBP (Pound Sterling) is used (at this moment) in England, Wales, Scotland and Northern Ireland. It's not used any where else.

As far as I can make out, the current UK government doesn't want Scotland to become independent. So they have set out terms that Scotland would have to also be financially independent too, should people vote in favor of independence.

It's really a way of trying to influence the Scottish to not vote in favor, a sort of scare tactic. Worrying people into thinking that if they no longer have the Pound, Scotland would either have to come up with their own currency, which may or may not work out so well or go with the Euro. Some one else has already pointed out, is not doing so well.

The way I see it, if you want your country to be independent then why not be financially independent too. You can then control your own national interest rates and stimulus packages etc

They haven't stopped other countries from using the pound after independence, at least before transitioning to their own currency over time.

I'm no expert, but from what I've seen the reason why it's seen to be the best choice is because it'll benefit both Scotland and rUK when it comes to trade (I'm hoping someone who knows more about this can chime in). Also, from what I've seen, despite what the naysayers say, we couldn't join the Euro even if we wanted to (which no one does, of course).





EDIT: Just saw this. The scare tactics are getting really comical now.

 

[The Reverend]

Is driving on the right that big a deal? I just can't believe that this is supposed to scare people. Where's the doom and gloom? Where's the impending collapse of society?

 

[Repner]

Is driving on the right that big a deal? I just can't believe that this is supposed to scare people. Where's the doom and gloom? Where's the impending collapse of society?

People would have to exchange their cars for left hand drive ones, but the fact they think they can decide what side of the road we can drive on is what's ridiculous. Is anyone gullible enough to believe this shit?

 

[123321123]

I'm eligible for citizenship should Scotland secede so I don't really care. I don't think much would really change, Ireland is still culturally more or less identical and they've been independent for nearly a century. Likewise with the economy, it would be more or less the same, it's an issue of coviction really.

I'd rather see Kernow recognised as a constituent nation of the UK on some level, if we're talking about the constitutional makeup of the country.

 

[slowro]

I don't know why but I am not convinced at all that independence is a good idea. I will be voting no, I'm pro royal, pro union, I don't read the papers propaganda but I just have a gut feeling about my mistrust for the SNP and Alex Salmond.
Things could be a lot fairer that is undeniable, even the north of England gets treated like the ugly sister.

I think if we as a united nation got our affairs in order and remembered that, in the unsettled times that we are living through, we are just a small island with the Atlantic Ocean on our doorstep. we are stronger standing side by side. A somewhat romantic view I know.

I can't help but feel that Salmond is riding the oil money train for his own glory. But I suppose that in politics it's the devil you know vs the devil you don't

I do not want to inflame anyone on the issue and I apologise for the poor grammar.

 

[C2Aye]

Here's one of my simplest complaints about the current situation. Scotland is a country of 5.3 million whereas England is about 10 times that at about 53 million. In the last general election, almost all of Scotland bar one constituency voted for any party not named the Conservative party. However, due to the much smaller population size, Scotland's vote had little effect on the result of the election (to put this into perspective, London has 79 Westminster constituencies while Scotland only has 59 which is fair as there are more people in London than in Scotland). So the mainly Tory policies (let's face it, the Lib Dems are just propping up the coalition and maybe stopping the worst of the Tory ideas getting through) are not what the people of Scotland voted for. We already have devolved power over healthcare and education yet our policy on welfare, defense, the economy, etc, is being decided by a government totally unrepresentative of the voting population of Scotland. And even if the government in Westminster represents Scotland's voting exactly, that will be completely down to chance. I am willing to argue that the current state of affairs is bordering on disenfranchisement of an entire population, especially if the Tories keep at it the way they're going and UKIP somehow manages to win more seats.

 

[asher]

Related economic musings:

http://krugman.blogs.nytimes.com/20...Opinion&action=Click&pgtype=Blogs&region=Body

 

[blanco]

That article sums up some things people are forgetting.


I think Scotland should get their independence. They already have the Scottish pound and their own parliament so just float the currency even with the british pound and let them hash out the details to do with oil, defense contracts, national debt, EU joining etc.

Personally i don't think Salmond should be the person to lead the change he doesn't seem to understand that what he wants is unreasonable. He seems to think he can dictate everything and anyone that tells him no, wether it be EU commission or british politicians, are just bullies or scaremongering. I don't think he will ever get the pound without accepting that economic policy/budgets are going to be made from Westminster and the Bank of England maybe just with more input from the scottish parliament.

 

[C2Aye]

They already have the Scottish pound

And herein lies one of the main issues. We don't actually have our own currency. If you read any Scottish bank notes, be it from the Bank of Scotland, the Royal Bank of Scotland or the Clydesdale Bank, they all have the same sort of thing written on them; "I promise to pay the bearer on demand the sum of £xx". To put it plainly, Scottish money is not legal tender, even in Scotland. They are more akin to a cheque rather than anything else. Our currency is still the UK Pound Sterling and all the Scottish banknotes in the world won't change that.

If we really wanted to make a full show of independence, we'd need to either join the Euro or make our own currency, neither of which are particularly appealing, although the later is probably doable given a large enough timeframe. Salmond's alternative is to stay with the UK Pound but he doesn't actually seem to have consulted anybody over at the Bank of England about it (which is the centralised Bank of the UK, as opposed to the Bank of Scotland and the Royal Bank of Scotland which are commercial banks). Also, it has the same problem with the Euro where our currency is centralised in another nation and completely out of our control. This is going to be one of the key sticking points I feel leading up to the referendum on all sides.

 

[Pooluke41]

I'd rather see Kernow recognised as a constituent nation of the UK on some level, if we're talking about the constitutional makeup of the country.

Please no. As much as I'd like the councils to be better equipped and all the supposed pros of Cornish Independence that you hear about; I've had too many old Cornish men drunkenly speak to me about an Independent Cornwall while I try to buy a packet of crisps, that I have developed a very sour taste in my mouth when I consider the idea.

(seriously, just let me get my crisps)

 

[blanco]

I'll be honest i've never actually held a Scottish bank note. I think i'm too far south .

That would also explain why Salmond wants the british pound, creating a new currency is quite a feat and even harder when your having to speculate at how strong the country creating the currencies economy is. The EU is even harder to join with any of the participating countries being able to veto your application.

 

[123321123]

Please no. As much as I'd like the councils to be better equipped and all the supposed pros of Cornish Independence that you hear about; I've had too many old Cornish men drunkenly speak to me about an Independent Cornwall while I try to buy a packet of crisps, that I have developed a very sour taste in my mouth when I consider the idea.

(seriously, just let me get my crisps)

'recognised as a constituent nation' doesn't have to mean anythig more than having the same status Wales did before devolution.

 

[Tommy Deaks]

I'd be all for supporting an independent Scotland if it weren't just one poisonous little toad of a man's diatribe against England. Salmond is an absolute prick.

He wants an independent Scotland, yet wants to remain in a currency union? He also presumed Scotland would have immediate entry into the EU. The guy is a short sighted pillock, who is naive and completely self serving (which politician isn't?), and I think that an independent Scotland will be bad for the rest of the UK as well as themselves.

 

[Dan]

Here's one of my simplest complaints about the current situation. Scotland is a country of 5.3 million whereas England is about 10 times that at about 53 million. In the last general election, almost all of Scotland bar one constituency voted for any party not named the Conservative party. However, due to the much smaller population size, Scotland's vote had little effect on the result of the election (to put this into perspective, London has 79 Westminster constituencies while Scotland only has 59 which is fair as there are more people in London than in Scotland). So the mainly Tory policies (let's face it, the Lib Dems are just propping up the coalition and maybe stopping the worst of the Tory ideas getting through) are not what the people of Scotland voted for. We already have devolved power over healthcare and education yet our policy on welfare, defense, the economy, etc, is being decided by a government totally unrepresentative of the voting population of Scotland. And even if the government in Westminster represents Scotland's voting exactly, that will be completely down to chance. I am willing to argue that the current state of affairs is bordering on disenfranchisement of an entire population, especially if the Tories keep at it the way they're going and UKIP somehow manages to win more seats.

It's not just Scotland though. Everywhere bar the south east has been affected by ridiculous cuts and political propositions that baffle the mind of the normal, sane human being. What's turned the tables in England somewhat is the issues that the south west are facing and the governments inability to get it under control (which i believe is in part to the fact that the area is rife for fracking and by not doing anything private companies can purchase the land at a cut price from desperate farmers, but that's another story)

People are slowly remembering again how bad it was in the Thatcher era and more and more people (including the Scottish) want the government out. No-one wants Labours Ed Milliband in charge, he's just as crooked as Cameron, so we are left asking who is the lesser of two evils? I think that if we had the right government in Scotland wouldn't feel so inclined to leave us.

Personally i would have no issue with Scotland being able to make it's own decisions and having its own parliament. Our current government will make it very, very hard for it to go ahead though, Cameron and his cronies will act like spoiled children spitting their dummies out if they lose out on their north sea oil

 

[123321123]

It's not just Scotland though. Everywhere bar the south east has been affected by ridiculous cuts and political propositions that baffle the mind of the normal, sane human being. What's turned the tables in England somewhat is the issues that the south west are facing and the governments inability to get it under control (which i believe is in part to the fact that the area is rife for fracking and by not doing anything private companies can purchase the land at a cut price from desperate farmers, but that's another story)

People are slowly remembering again how bad it was in the Thatcher era and more and more people (including the Scottish) want the government out. No-one wants Labours Ed Milliband in charge, he's just as crooked as Cameron, so we are left asking who is the lesser of two evils? I think that if we had the right government in Scotland wouldn't feel so inclined to leave us.

Personally i would have no issue with Scotland being able to make it's own decisions and having its own parliament. Our current government will make it very, very hard for it to go ahead though, Cameron and his cronies will act like spoiled children spitting their dummies out if they lose out on their north sea oil

This is why I'm in favour of compeltely abolishing the UK and replacing it with small civic states. Completely serious.

 

[C2Aye]

It's not just Scotland though. Everywhere bar the south east has been affected by ridiculous cuts and political propositions that baffle the mind of the normal, sane human being. What's turned the tables in England somewhat is the issues that the south west are facing and the governments inability to get it under control (which i believe is in part to the fact that the area is rife for fracking and by not doing anything private companies can purchase the land at a cut price from desperate farmers, but that's another story)

People are slowly remembering again how bad it was in the Thatcher era and more and more people (including the Scottish) want the government out. No-one wants Labours Ed Milliband in charge, he's just as crooked as Cameron, so we are left asking who is the lesser of two evils? I think that if we had the right government in Scotland wouldn't feel so inclined to leave us.

Personally i would have no issue with Scotland being able to make it's own decisions and having its own parliament. Our current government will make it very, very hard for it to go ahead though, Cameron and his cronies will act like spoiled children spitting their dummies out if they lose out on their north sea oil

All fair points and definitely agreed on Miliband's 'New' New Labour. I do have to remind myself that the Conservatives did not get a majority in the general election so essentially anything they push through is not truly representative of the voters. I almost feel like a minority government where no one is able to push anything through without widespread popular support through all the parties would have been more beneficial because it stops the ideologically driven policies from happening. Also I don't know how widespread it is but it seems that some people who would normally vote Tory are now going to vote UKIP which is worrying because immigration is what I call a 'Daily Mail' issue, in that it's not really a problem but the Daily Mail make it seem so ('They're taking our jobs!' ad nauseam).

Anyhow, Scotland (possibly due to a very strong dislike of anything to do with the Tories) has taken quite a progressive and socially fair stance as much as it's in the power of the Scottish government to do and I feel that an independent Scotland can continue to follow those ideals. However, as always, it always boils down to money!

 

[Repner]

Any Scots watch that debate on STV? Christ that was irritating. Constantly talking over each other. The whole point of that was to try and sway undecided voters to their sides, but I don't think anyone could learn anything from that.

 

[123321123]

it's not really a problem but the Daily Mail make it seem so ('They're taking our jobs!' ad nauseam)

Thanks for clearing that up.