Korn 8 string

[jtm45]

Is it wrong that i find that picture very cool Alan?

What's that pic from dude?

 

[Naren]

Yes, it's true that I'm not a Korn fan, but I did agree with you to some extent and I just pointed that out. Your post is justified man, we all have our opinions

My only gripe with your post is the sentence "Why the fuck would they have gotten as far as they have if they'd never written a good tune?"

The Black Eyed Peas have gotten pretty far. Have they ever written a good tune? Hell no. What I'm trying to say dude is yeah, you're right, we're all entitled to our opinions, but popularity does not equal talent.

You don't think The Black Eyed Peas have talent? I hate their music and I don't listen to it, but I think they have quite a bit of talent. They succeeded in making one of the songs that has annoyed me more than any other song in 2005 ("My Lumps", I think it was called), but I have to say they have talent. Just not my taste. Korn also has a lot of talent and I do like a lot of their stuff and dislike a lot of their stuff. They definitely can write "good riffs" (although "good" is in the eye of the beholder).

 

[jtm45]

I agree about the Black Eyed Peas thing Naren.
I would never dream of buying anything of theirs but a few of the tracks they've released this year are un-deniably catchy,be it in a good or a bad way (and that Fergie chick is hot as too.Sorry to stoop to that level,but she is!).

'Appreciation' and 'liking' are two different things but i'd like to think that i can appreciate just about any 'good' or inteligently written(subjective)music even though it's not to my personal taste.

It's all about broadening your horizons

The most interesting artists are those with the most varied palettes.(imo,that is)

 

[Tubbs Mcgee]

I think I'm on the side that dislikes Korn, but likes the fact that they might be bringing 8 strings into production.

(Actually, they used to be my favorite band up until Untouchables, I didn't like Follow The Leader, but their debut, Life Is Peachy, and Issues were great. Now I've grown out of it.)

 

[Nik]

You don't think The Black Eyed Peas have talent? I hate their music and I don't listen to it, but I think they have quite a bit of talent. They succeeded in making one of the songs that has annoyed me more than any other song in 2005 ("My Lumps", I think it was called), but I have to say they have talent. Just not my taste. Korn also has a lot of talent and I do like a lot of their stuff and dislike a lot of their stuff. They definitely can write "good riffs" (although "good" is in the eye of the beholder).

For the record, I'm trying to have a perfectly civil and friendly argument with you guys, so if I accidently offend someone, I sincerely appologize

"Black Eyed Peas" have talent??? A lot of crap has been spewed in recent days from the music industry, but "My Humps" easily tops them all. Tell me this: did it take supreme talent to write the unbelievably "intricate" 4/4ths beat? What about the brilliant melodies (or rather, lack of melodies?) Or maybe you are refering to the genius lyrics:

What you gon' do with all that junk?
All that junk inside that trunk?
I'ma get, get, get, get, you drunk,
Get you love drunk off my hump.
What u gon' do with all that ass?
All that ass inside them jeans?
I'm a make, make, make, make you scream
Make you scream, make you scream.
Cos of my hump, my hump, my hump, my hump.
My hump, my hump, my hump, my lovely lady lumps. (Check it out)

Yes, the work of true poets indeed

I am very tolerant of other people's musical tastes (I've listened to that shit-pile excuse for a song dozens of times without complaining). But it's one thing to like this music, it's a totally different thing to actually claim that the people behind it have talent.

I'm sorry, but there isn't ONE aspect (melody, rhythm, or lyrics) of this song that would've taken any talent to write. The only reason it has appealed to the masses so widely is A) because you can dance to it (hell, you can dance to virtually any techno beat in 4/4s) and B) because the shitty lyrics have somehow struck a chord with today's braindead teenage population (I'm a teen fresh out of high-school, so I've met BEP fans first hand...)

Don't get me wrong, not all modern industry is pure shit. Hell, I don't like Korn, but yes, it did take some talent to write some of their songs, and I respect it, it's just not by bag of chips. But other bands, like Black Eyed Peas, are simply devoid of any talent.

I'm done ranting now, I hope you guys understand where I'm coming from.

 

[Roland777]

(and that Fergie chick is hot as too.Sorry to stoop to that level,but she is!)

Didn't think I'd see the day when someone would finally admit it.

 

[jtm45]

Didn't think I'd see the day when someone would finally admit it.

I tried to deny it but after seeing her in that 'Dont Funk With My Heart' video there was no doubting it in my mind.

She just looks like one of those gals who'd show you (or me,preferably)a 'real good time',if you get what i'm saying.

Apologies for the off-topicness of this post.

 

[Cancer]

Cause, um, Vai was never associated with the seven...

Assoicated yes, currently using and inspiring othher players to use a 7 ....no.

 

[Zane]

well since were talking about talent she has a awsome voice in some songs and she's dead sexy.

 

[MetalMike]

Although she's hot, she has this new song called "London Bridge" that my friend downloaded just to make fun of. If it one of the most awful things I've ever heard.

 

[Kotex]

I heard that song this morning. It wasn't that bad. And Roland, I admitted to you that I htought she was hot hella' long ago.lol

 

[Korbain]

but popularity does not equal talent.

In a way your right, but if they didn't have talent they wouldn't be popular. You write music that sounds good and feels good for you to play, when i make up music i don't go, ok i am gonna make up some super hard shredding riff here, then chuck in a solo, so i look good. I play what comes from my head to my fingers, or even from just jamming around, aslong as its from the heart and doesn't sound like a pile of shit, i say its good! We're all different, but being a musician, we all gotta think outside of the box sometimes. its not all about the weird timing and complicated riffs, timing there for a reason, to keep the song flowing correct, so use the timing that works, who cares if its 4/4. I find playing a 4/4 riff no harder than playing a 3/4, 7/8 etc. Anyways, Korn are popular, that is because they have talent, even if some don't like to admit it. Without having talent, would they be where they are now, promoting 8 strings for ibanez? And yes fergie is hot as!

 

[b3n]

I find playing a 4/4 riff no harder than playing a 3/4, 7/8 etc.

In fact, most would find it easier...

Anyways, Korn are popular, that is because they have talent, even if some don't like to admit it.

+1. While they obviously aren't as techincally proficient as the majority of metal bands (for example) there is a lot to be said for writing songs that people want to listen to. Lots of people want to listen to their songs which in my mind = songwriting talent.

And yes fergie is hot as!

 

[Naren]

Nik, I read your post. I agree that "My Lumps" is an incredibly annoying song with inane lyrics. I made fun of that song for a long time the first time I heard it. BUT I stick by my original statements. I think The Black Eyed Peas have talent. Maybe not the talent you or I think is impressive, but I think they definitely have talent. I think the Backstreet Boys have talent. You might say "Hey! They don't even write their own songs!" and I never said what kind of talent they had. They have talents for singing and for dancing. It's not the type of stuff I want to listen to or want to watch, but I have to say they have talent.

I don't listen to rap practically at all, but I can't say "They have no talent." That would just be writing off styles of music I don't like as not having talent simply because I don't like them.

In the same way, Korn has talent. Just because they aren't shredding or playing in 7/8 doesn't mean they lack talent. The lead guitarist for my band is a very skilled shredder. He does finger tapped sweeped arpeggios at 250 bpm. But all of our songs are in 4/4. In fact, I can't stand Meshuggah. Does that mean that we have no talent? Or what about some classical composers that wrote 80-90% of their songs in 4/4? No talent?

 

[Drew]

In fact, most would find it easier...

e-rep for the best delivered comeback I've seen here in ages, dude.

Naren, it's "My Hump." An annoying song, but I won't judge them for it - I hate to admit it, but what I've heard of their older stuff is actually quite good, hip-hop delivered by and large with live instrumentation. Not for everyone, true, and not for a metal forum certainly, but they wrote some pretty cool catchy tunes before Fergi decided she was Gwen Steffani (who, again, wrote some rather catchy material before she decided she was Christina Aguleria).

Also, listen to more Meshuggah until you CAN stand it.* Suck it up, foo!



*Ok, so I'm kidding, but seriously, while they're nothing I'd listen to 24/7, listening to them enough to figure out how they put music together will probably do you good on a theoretical level. and besides, the outro to "Straws Pulled at Random" is just gorgeous.

 

[Naren]

Yeah. The "I can't stand Meshuggah" is a little of an exaggeration. I really respect what they do, but I just don't care for their music. In a lot of the songs I've heard, it's just the same thing over and over again for 6 or 7 minutes in a really strange time signature. Never considered any of their stuff too impressive. When I heard some songs off their first album which had no strange time signatures and had a lot more changes instead of the same thing over and over, I thought it was a lot more interesting.

But, I think they are pretty talented guys.

And good point about The Black Eyed Peas, Drew.

 

[Nik]

Cool, I'm glad this civil debate continues

Nik, I read your post. I agree that "My Lumps" is an incredibly annoying song with inane lyrics. I made fun of that song for a long time the first time I heard it. BUT I stick by my original statements. I think The Black Eyed Peas have talent. Maybe not the talent you or I think is impressive, but I think they definitely have talent. I think the Backstreet Boys have talent. You might say "Hey! They don't even write their own songs!" and I never said what kind of talent they had. They have talents for singing and for dancing. It's not the type of stuff I want to listen to or want to watch, but I have to say they have talent.

I don't listen to rap practically at all, but I can't say "They have no talent." That would just be writing off styles of music I don't like as not having talent simply because I don't like them.

In the same way, Korn has talent. Just because they aren't shredding or playing in 7/8 doesn't mean they lack talent. The lead guitarist for my band is a very skilled shredder. He does finger tapped sweeped arpeggios at 250 bpm. But all of our songs are in 4/4. In fact, I can't stand Meshuggah. Does that mean that we have no talent? Or what about some classical composers that wrote 80-90% of their songs in 4/4? No talent?

I agree partially to this statement

This is what Pain of Salvation has taught me--I used to be a shred-freak that refused to listen to music unless it was 10+ minutes long, had an extended solo section with odd time-signatures, and insane shred solos.

But then I found this band Pain of Salvation, and they taught me that you just need to make music that just SOUNDS right, and not make a song complex for the hell of it. If a song calls for complexity, then by all means go for it, but don't insert insane shredding for no reason at all. A large portion of the songs I write are in 4/4s, but sometimes a melody or feel calls for something more intricate (plus I'm Bulgarian originally, so odd-time signatures are in my blood ) And I just finished writing a song that incorporates 11/16s, 13/16, and 14/16 alternating throughout the song.

Did I do it for the sake of making things more intricate? No--I was simply going for a specific ethnic Bulgarian feel in the song. I used to be a shred-obsessed freak for a while, but now I've learned that it takes a lot more talent to come up with a solo that embodies lots of melody and emotion, and that shredding is just a useful asset that is to be used sparesly to built tension, etc. I think that good technique is when your technique doesn't limit your imagination, but people should never let their technique lead their imagination.

So what I just said is that good songs write themselves and that we as musicians are simply the catalysts. To me, good music either has to have at least one of three components that are good: 1) either a good melody, 2) good lyrics, 3) or simply a good beat, and let me iterate that, IMO, "My Humps" fails all 3. I could write a shitty song like that after 2 weeks of studying music. I'm sorry, it's true.

And that is probably why it appeals to the masses; most people don't want to be challenged by music; they want to come home at the end of the day and dance or simply move to a simple rhythm and relax. And there's nothing wrong with this. I understand this, but this doesn't change the fact that it takes no talent to write a song like "My Humps." I'm not saying that there's anything wrong with enjoying this music, I'm just saying that actually crafting this music takes no skill whatsoever.

Oh well. I guess I'm by myself in my stance on this issue Drew, how could you?

 

[Metal Ken]

Without having talent, would they be where they are now, promoting 8 strings for ibanez?

Sure, if they were popular. Tom Delonge is a mediocre guitarist at best, but he as a signature guitar. Why? Cause kiddies want shit that he endorses. You dont have to be 'good' or anything to endorse a guitar. you have to be a public figure that will encourage people to buy a product. You could be the best guitarist ever, and if you dont move a product, they dont give two shits. You could be the shittiest guitarist EVER, and if your band is popular, and they play you on TV, guess who gets a sig model or an endorsement?


Skill =/= Promotion. Thats the bottom line

 

[Naren]

^Tom Delonge is a perfect example there. Hard to argue with. I would maybe say "mediocre guitarist" (at best) for him, like you said.

 

[Chris]

In a way your right, but if they didn't have talent they wouldn't be popular.

Disregarding Korn, that statement is flawed.