Live performance rates - what do you charge and why?

[wheresthefbomb]

As the title states. Especially interested in the difference between solo/multiple solo acts/band rates. Very often I'm playing for a cut of the door/cover charge of which I'll usually tip 20% out to door person/bartenders as applicable/if they're not already getting a cut.

As for flat rates, $300 for 2 hours is what I've settled on based on what I've been able to negotiate in the past few years. $450 for myself plus a solo opener.

Most recently I asked for $650 for myself and two other solo acts plus providing our own PA (and then implicitly also either running sound ourselves or hiring a fourth person). That feels high, but when I think back on what I'm able to pay myself with no other acts, the pie is still cut smaller with each additional person. I'm only playing a 45min set in this scenario, but I'd be sharing sound duties with the other performers the whole time as well.

I try to only book other solo acts because by the time I pay every member of a 4 piece band what I think is a fair rate I end up with the least pay for the most work. That's probably on me to negotiate better rates if I'm booking larger acts, but obviously smaller numbers are always going to be easier for the venue to stomach. As an individual I've never made any appreciable amount of money playing in bands, even when we did really well at the door, and I couldn't imagine venues around here paying every member of a 4 or 5-piece band $150/hr. But maybe that's lack of imagination on my part.

Anyway, I'm curious to hear y'all's experiences and thoughts on this.

 

[tedtan]

People are still getting paid to play these days?

 

[ArtDecade]

50,000 tickets at 100 bucks a pop. Venue fees, promoters, and the cost of crew (road, lighting, etc) eats up half of that. By the time we get slapped by taxes, each guy in the band brings home about 200-300 grand a night.

 

[ZXIIIT]

I made $150 one time for playing acoustic guitar at a city fest for 20 mins. When I was doing a full band, we charged $450 for one hour. Once I went solo with my one man black metal act, it was anywhere from $50 to $200 for a 40 min set, still, it was not enough to live on but covered getting there and back.

I knew a guy that played guitar and sang with backing tracks at a bar in Catalina island that was making $100 an hour + tips.

 

[GunpointMetal]

TL;DR - $150 for in town shows or $250-$450 for travel shows when we're being asked to play as an original band (30-45 minute set, max).

I have no idea what covers or covers + a few originals get paid these days. As an all original act it's usually a door cut or $150 in town, $250-$450 out of town depending on the drive or show. I ask for way too much if it's a show I don't want to play or if I know it's going to be a slog (58 band local festival or something) so that way if they say yes it's worth the time and if they say no it's not me saying no, lol. If I want to get on a show for whatever reason we'll usually take whatever we can get unless it's some weird buy on/ticket requirement.

 

[SalsaWood]

I just give it all to the one guy in the band we all picked to run off with it when the band breaks up.

 

[Screamingdaisy]

Bars locally pay about $800/night.

If it's a private show, I charge $1200 + sound & lights, which I bill separately (runs from around $250 to $450, depending on who I go with and how much of their own gear they have to provide).

I found billing for sound separately made people understand that it cost us money to put on an event.

 

[wheresthefbomb]

edit: double post

 

[wheresthefbomb]

I found billing for sound separately made people understand that it cost us money to put on an event

This is where I'm at right now, this person asked if I will be bringing my own PA, which implies they do not have one, and the answer is yes I can but more work=more money.

I think we're sorting it out but in the future I reckon I will do as you've described and if I get asked something like that I'll just quote them my rate and then what my friend who does sound for a living charges as two separate rates. This just feels like them trying to get out of paying for a sound tech, and it muddies the water when I quote previous rates I've been paid at for comparison and they're lower.

Speaking of comparisons, the friend I mentioned is already contracted long-term at the other venue we've booked, they run their shit really professional and the only rate I ever discuss with them is that for me to show up and play music, i.e the service I reached out to them to provide.

Incidentally, the amount I quoted is the exact amount the other venue typically pays me for two, 1 hour solo acts plus the rate they pay my friend to run sound. So really, this other place is already getting an extra hour of music and a whole third act for free.

I think the real lesson here is if you wanna be cheap just put a fucking cover charge on the door like everywhere else. I didn't ask them for a flat rate, I just asked to book a show.... aaaaaand I'm ranting.

 

[Screamingdaisy]

If you broke it down as $300 for yourself, $150 for the opener, and $200 for the PA it'd simplify the pricing.

It also makes other add-ons like lights, staging, travel, hotel, etc easier to bill for, and when you break it all down instead of spit-balling numbers it makes you look professional.

 

[sleewell]

I honestly don't give a fuck as long as I know it's show where it's going to be a rowdy crowd that will mosh and get violent. I keep hearing from bands that our tiny diy spot is way more fun than bigger shows where they've probably made more money bc our crowds always go nuts.


Im doing this for the memories, not a few dollars. My job pays well. Music is for fun. Making a few hundred bucks split a few ways to lug around a PA and play other people's music for hours sounds like a chore that's not worth it.

 

[spawnofthesith]

These types of threads really should be split into whether or not we're talking about originals vs. covers because it makes a HUGE difference.

There's not going to be a lot of common ground in what pay is/should be between a bar entertainment cover band playing for 4 hrs vs an original blackened snog-core band playing 30-1hr, nor should their be

 

[JSKrev]

I get paid $500 per note. I'm on tour doing two nights no-repeat with Anselmo's Pantera and 5FDP supporting.

 

[Screamingdaisy]

Biggest difference for me was that originals tended to pay the door. The more tickets you sell/people you draw, the higher your payout. Flat rate pay when offered tended to be much lower, but you could make up the difference with merch.

That, and parties tended to be free/DIY because we could never afford a soundman.

That said, unless you're just doing it for the art/experience/fun of it/etc I still think it's a good idea to be organized. A lot of bands fail because they don't have the business side in order.

 

[ArtDecade]

I get paid $500 per note.

Let me guess - you are performing John Cage's 4'33".

 

[JSKrev]

Let me guess - you are performing John Cage's 4'33".

Zappa's Black Page.

 

[wheresthefbomb]

These types of threads really should be split into whether or not we're talking about originals vs. covers because it makes a HUGE difference.

There's not going to be a lot of common ground in what pay is/should be between a bar entertainment cover band playing for 4 hrs vs an original blackened snog-core band playing 30-1hr, nor should their be

This is a good point. I play almost exclusively originals, though I'll often choose one cover that I feel adds something to the particular set I'm putting together. I do have a pretty well established history of what my services are worth in this capacity, and my friend who plays in a disco/dance cover band makes more than I would ever imagine charging. They're probably the highest paid band in town. As someone else mentioned, I'm more used to getting paid via cover/door charge as an original act, but some places offer flat rates and in this recent case I was asked for a flat-rate estimate right out the gate.

I honestly don't give a fuck as long as I know it's show where it's going to be a rowdy crowd that will mosh and get violent. I keep hearing from bands that our tiny diy spot is way more fun than bigger shows where they've probably made more money bc our crowds always go nuts.


Im doing this for the memories, not a few dollars. My job pays well. Music is for fun. Making a few hundred bucks split a few ways to lug around a PA and play other people's music for hours sounds like a chore that's not worth it.

Totally respect your position and when it comes to DIY shows this is exactly my thought process. If we make money great but that's not what I'm in it for. A venue though is a business, and if I don't treat my services similarly I'm just setting myself up to be exploited and making it harder for everyone else trying to get paid fairly. I play music for the love, but I definitely don't play it to make charitable donations to the mortgage on someone's McMansion.