Make this travel 7 strings multiscale lighter

[xamxixixo]

Hello everyone,

I have a travel 7 strings multiscale guitar that looks like this

Specs:
- Overall: 4kg
- Body: 32cm length, 5cm of thickness, 3kg weight
- Neck: 72cm length, probably 1kg weight.

Too heavy for a travel guitar and for my shoulder. So that I want to make it to be lighter.

I can only think about turning it into a headless with tremolo, because of cutting head and routing cavity. I quite want some effects from a tremolo/vibrator sometimes, but most of the time I don't. Anyway, I had bought a cheap tremolo bridge from Aliexpress and am waiting for it to arrive. But not to immediately add it to the guitar, I want to see how a multiscale tremolo looks like, then decide later.

That is the only way I can figure out. But I still want to ask you luthiers, do you know any way else to make this guitar lighter?
Thank you.

 

[spudmunkey]

Do you need a neck pickup?

Do you use the tone knob?

Could you off-load the volume control to a volume pedal?

If you don't need actives, you can jettison the battery.

Plastic knobs are way way lighter than the metal ones.

Plastic tuner knobs to replace the metal ones.

Gotoh Stealth lightweight tuners?

Looks like there's some more wood that could get carved off.

The body seems kinda thick, but you may need that full thickness with a trem.

I assume graphite saddles are lighter than metal, but I'm not sure on that...just a thought.

Right now all of your edges are squared. You could take a palm router with a 1/4" or 1/2" roundover or chamfer bit (at least in some areas)...that could remove a tiny bit of material.

 

[Hollowway]

I think Spud hit everything here, but damn, that's a heavy guitar for such a small body. Maybe chamber the heck out of it from the back, then screw on a back plate that covers the whole thing?

 

[xamxixixo]

Do you need a neck pickup?

Do you use the tone knob?

Could you off-load the volume control to a volume pedal?

If you don't need actives, you can jettison the battery.

Plastic knobs are way way lighter than the metal ones.

Plastic tuner knobs to replace the metal ones.

Gotoh Stealth lightweight tuners?

Looks like there's some more wood that could get carved off.

The body seems kinda thick, but you may need that full thickness with a trem.

I assume graphite saddles are lighter than metal, but I'm not sure on that...just a thought.

Right now all of your edges are squared. You could take a palm router with a 1/4" or 1/2" roundover or chamfer bit (at least in some areas)...that could remove a tiny bit of material.

Thank you for answering. Yes I need all things on this guitar, pickups, knob,... actually the knobs are like no weight at all, so I don't think about them as a problem. The problem is the body, or maybe, the pickups.

My guitar is passive.

I have been thinking about thinning the body a bit, too. But one of the ideas to make it this thick is to make a modular guitar, which I can turn into any body shape I want, by adding two pieces of wood to the edges. So the edge must be square, and the thickness... I will think about it.

I think Spud hit everything here, but damn, that's a heavy guitar for such a small body. Maybe chamber the heck out of it from the back, then screw on a back plate that covers the whole thing?

Thank you for answering. Well, it is that heavy, because of balancing the guitar, I made the body from ironwood... There are some interesting ideas like the revolving pickups from Gyrock, where it needs to route wider cavities for pickups, or just a tremolo cavity... I think my best bet is to go with chambering a cavity, but for adding some useful tools.

 

[odibrom]

Lace Alumitones are also an option for substantially lighter passive pickups (like 3/4 to 1/2 of overall pickup weight). If you're not into crazy wiring gymnastics and go just for neck, both, bridge, it's an idea to test...? They work great for multiscale guitars but their tone is said to be an acquired taste. They can be "split" too, but don't count on mixing them in series nor in reverse phase...

Rounding the actual edges wouldn't be a problem for the wings as long as they feature the negative shape... or not and the routing will look like some carved racing stripes...? That's all aesthetics and very subjective anyway.

Routing for weight relief cavities is the most obvious solution. If routing from the top, the immediate solution is to rout a pool and secure the pickups with a pickguard with different pickup positions from the actual ones? ou may need a pickup swap for that...? Something to think about.

I'm just pinching ideias, take them as you see fit, however, Multiscale trems are a rarity, more so on the headless business and most often "house use only" for the guitar brands that feature them. I'm not sure you'll find your way through that path...

 

[xamxixixo]

Lace Alumitones are also an option for substantially lighter passive pickups (like 3/4 to 1/2 of overall pickup weight). If you're not into crazy wiring gymnastics and go just for neck, both, bridge, it's an idea to test...? They work great for multiscale guitars but their tone is said to be an acquired taste. They can be "split" too, but don't count on mixing them in series nor in reverse phase...

Rounding the actual edges wouldn't be a problem for the wings as long as they feature the negative shape... or not and the routing will look like some carved racing stripes...? That's all aesthetics and very subjective anyway.

Routing for weight relief cavities is the most obvious solution. If routing from the top, the immediate solution is to rout a pool and secure the pickups with a pickguard with different pickup positions from the actual ones? ou may need a pickup swap for that...? Something to think about.

I'm just pinching ideias, take them as you see fit, however, Multiscale trems are a rarity, more so on the headless business and most often "house use only" for the guitar brands that feature them. I'm not sure you'll find your way through that path...

Thank you for answering.

Actually, I had gone through the "crazy wiring gymnastics" process. My guitar now has series/parallel pickups, activated by two push-pull pots in the knobs. A bit of a mess in the cavity of wires, but I can manage it.

About routing cavity, actually there is a solution, although not perfect. I still have a rectangle piece of wood with the same material - ironwood. I can still route a cavity, and if I don't like it, I can fill it back with that piece of ironwood, or any material that is lighter. But I quite likely doubt that I will fill it back.

 

[IwantTacos]

Check out alp guitar for some design ideas. Definitely make it headless.

 

[xamxixixo]

Check out alp guitar for some design ideas. Definitely make it headless.

Thank you for answering. I made this guitar from seeing it as one of the ideas. Mostly from TheBone guitar.

 

[LostTheTone]

4kg is a lot for so little guitar. That's more than a full bodied SG or flying V.

I think your big problem is that you're trying to make a travel guitar that retains all of the snazzy features of a full sized one. I genuinely don't see why you would need two pickups for a guitar that exists just so you can practice on the go. Having different settings in your amp sim will do 99% of the same thing, and doesn't add any weight.

Same for a tone and volume knob. No, don't wire them straight through, but you don't need the knob to have them wired like they are always at 10, and that's good enough to practice with.

You definitely don't need so much thickness across the whole body. The idea of modular bodies is cute, but it's actively working against the reason this guitar exists. Modular construction always adds weight and complexity, in all things. Trying to make something so that it can be compatible with something else you haven't designed yet means you always have to leave more in than you want.

I say just cut it back to the primary goal you have - You want it to be light and small. Take out anything that is not strictly necessary to be a functioning guitar.

 

[xamxixixo]

4kg is a lot for so little guitar. That's more than a full bodied SG or flying V.

I think your big problem is that you're trying to make a travel guitar that retains all of the snazzy features of a full sized one. I genuinely don't see why you would need two pickups for a guitar that exists just so you can practice on the go. Having different settings in your amp sim will do 99% of the same thing, and doesn't add any weight.

Same for a tone and volume knob. No, don't wire them straight through, but you don't need the knob to have them wired like they are always at 10, and that's good enough to practice with.

You definitely don't need so much thickness across the whole body. The idea of modular bodies is cute, but it's actively working against the reason this guitar exists. Modular construction always adds weight and complexity, in all things. Trying to make something so that it can be compatible with something else you haven't designed yet means you always have to leave more in than you want.

I say just cut it back to the primary goal you have - You want it to be light and small. Take out anything that is not strictly necessary to be a functioning guitar.

Thank you. I appreciate that. Yes I will cut it.

 

[Hollowway]

If the weight of the guitar is for balance, I assume you mean to prevent neck dive. If that's the case, and if you need to stand while playing, you could put the strap up over the headstock, like an acoustic guitar.

 

[concertjunkie]

OP, can you share where you got this travel, multiscale 7 string guitar in the first place?? Link? This is something that would be super useful for me!

 

[xamxixixo]

OP, can you share where you got this travel, multiscale 7 string guitar in the first place?? Link? This is something that would be super useful for me!

I made this from a piece of ironwood for the body and my old 7 strings, which I put the old body aside for backing up. Maybe you can look up for Strandberg guitar or some Aliexpress guitar then do some luthier/carpenter things (please don't do Strandberg)

 

[dmlinger]

ironwood

That is why it's so heavy

 

[bostjan]

That is why it's so heavy

Surprised Pikachu face!

Right, I was going through this thinking you must have made the body or neck out of the heaviest wood possible, and there you go! Ironwood is literally the heaviest wood you could have chosen!


You could make the body out of balsa wood. It doesn't really matter on a travel guitar. Just dip it in epoxy to protect it. If the body was pine instead of ironwood, the guitar would be 2 kg lighter!

 

[xamxixixo]

That is why it's so heavy

Surprised Pikachu face!

Right, I was going through this thinking you must have made the body or neck out of the heaviest wood possible, and there you go! Ironwood is literally the heaviest wood you could have chosen!


You could make the body out of balsa wood. It doesn't really matter on a travel guitar. Just dip it in epoxy to protect it. If the body was pine instead of ironwood, the guitar would be 2 kg lighter!

Thank you. I will try those woods when I get my hand on them.

Yes, Ironwood is the reason, I said it in #4, to prevent neck dive. Actually I made a body from Okoume before, in a bigger size. It was light enough, but the neck dive have me think about something smaller but heavier. I did not know much about wood for guitar and my last choice is to wait for a piece of wood to be shipped from Aliexpress (it usually takes 1 month plus). Coincidentally, they sell Ironwood in my place. Therefore I just bought it and did it.

And, I apologize for the wrong use of the word "travel". Indeed one of its purposes is for travel. But now I realized, that I want to make a guitar that "rule them all", "all-purpose", "all-in-one", or something like that. That explains the module, the multi-mode pickups, and the tremolo purpose.

 

[bostjan]

To prevent neck dive, I'd suggest:

1. Headless (shorter lever = less leverage)
2. Lighter neck material
3. Add a fixture to move the strap button farther away from the bridge.

As an example of #3, Anygig, a popular travel guitar, uses a long, thin aluminium bracket, screwed into the body. The bracket attaches to the strap and keeps the anchor point about 15 or maybe 20 cm away from the place where your anchor point is.

I hope that helps.

 

[dspellman]

A headless guitar with a standard body shape will weigh in at 5-6 pounds. Yours is 8.8 lbs?
A headless will be shorter in overall length for any given scale. A neck-through construction would eliminate the clunky neck heel, and a headless would help combat the neck-heavy condition of your current guitar. You might consider installing a single-coil size pickup in the neck position -- you can still have a humbucker, but the smaller size will also give you a bit more clarity.

 

[James W Thomas]

Thank you. I will try those woods when I get my hand on them.

Basswood is a good choice for a light wood that still retains good tonal characteristics. Strandberg uses it for at least some of their non-chambered models, for example.

 

[bostjan]

The Alp AD7 is made of aluminium and weighs 2.9 kg. My Anygig is maple and 1.5 kg. I suppose that's pretty solid evidence that the body material makes a pretty substantial difference in weight, even when the body is just a small slab to hold the electronics and bridge.

Weight issues aside, this is a pretty nifty idea for a travel guitar.