Mastodon's songwriting...

[MJB]

Hey,

This is my first real thread at SS.org Don't know if it belongs in here or not.

So I was wondering if any of you guys ever analysed Mastodon's songwriting, harmonics, etc... Please post any detail you know.

It would be of great help to me.

Thanks!

MJB

 

[7 Strings of Hate]

i dont like'em!!

 

[sakeido]

i dont like'em!!

Now that is a completely worthless post.

Mastodon's stuff isn't as technically complex as you would think. A lot of riffs are easy and just in 4/4 and they phrase them oddly to get a cool off time sound even though they are not. Their really cool stuff is in weird time signatures... there are a couple bits in Colony of Birchmen where they play four bars of 4/4 then one bar of 2/4 to throw you off and then they suddenly move into the next part of the song without filling in those two "missing" beats. I think its March of the Fire Ants intro that is in 7/4, the way I wrote it down anyway. Its just lots of stuff like that. If you don't know what a time signature is, you will need to learn if you want to write this kind of stuff

The big thing is the change in time signatures though. A lot of the time the riffs you write will be in odd time signatures like 15/16 or 7/8 anyway but if you play a whole song that way it doesn't sound that weird. Sudden and drastic shifts in time signatures (like Mastodon) or frequent changing between half time (half tempo breakdown style riffs), normal time and double time (really really fast frantic riffs) like Lamb of God are what make this new kind of compressed prog metal interesting to listen to. The effect is deepened if you anchor it in a 4/4 hook or intro like these guys do because this is easily recognized as "normal" even by people who don't play music, and then a drastic segue into something like a half time 7/8 riff would be dramatic even to these people who aren't students of music.

 

[MJB]

Thanks alot for all the information, you rule!

Yeah I do know what time signatures are
But I think I never used anything else then 4/4...

Any insight in their harmonies?

MJB

 

[swedenuck]

Their harmonies are usually just Bill coming over top of something that Brent has written and doing the 'slayer' thing and adding just the same pattern a fourth, fifth, or an octave above the original line. It's really quite simple but since the original lines are very exotic sounding initially it comes across more well thought out.

Their writing seems to me to be based around Brent getting really stoned and going out into left field playing off the cuff, then the band arranging the riffs in a logical progression around a song idea. Then comes Brann's rediculous drum patterns that really define the feel and tempo of the song, (he really is my favorite drummer he adds such a free flowing feel to the material) and Troy's solid basslines that slighty walk around but tend to stay with the guitars. Bill pretty much tags along for the ride, adds harmonies where more space needs to be filled, and fills out the background behind some bitchin chicken pickin' solos. Then the vocals and lyrics come from the theme of the album and are built around the form/feel of the song.

Or at least that's how it seems like they put shit together to me.
Bryan


oh yeah....REMISSION FUCKING OWNS!

 

[sakeido]

That describes it pretty well. The key part to Mastodon though is definitely the drumming. That guy is unbelievably sick, the craziest drummer going in my opinion. He adds a lot of that crazy feel to Mastodon songs because I can't recall a time where I heard a totally stock drum pattern in one of their tunes.

 

[Mastodon]

I remember that Bill said in Guitar World that he wants to take a music theory class at some point so that he can understand whatever the hell it is that they're doing.

 

[Kotex]

Sakeido, could you maybe explain more about time sigs and how to count and recognize them?

 

[sakeido]

I will write something out for you guys tomorrow over lunch break.

 

[MJB]

Yeah, Brann is unbelievable...

I will write something out for you guys tomorrow over lunch break.

Wow that would help alot!

Thanks!

 

[guitarplayerone]

Now that is a completely worthless post.

Mastodon's stuff isn't as technically complex as you would think. A lot of riffs are easy and just in 4/4 and they phrase them oddly to get a cool off time sound even though they are not. Their really cool stuff is in weird time signatures... there are a couple bits in Colony of Birchmen where they play four bars of 4/4 then one bar of 2/4 to throw you off and then they suddenly move into the next part of the song without filling in those two "missing" beats.

you mean 6/8 but not using a triplet/dotted half feel lol?

 

[distressed_romeo]

you mean 6/8 but not using a triplet/dotted half feel lol?

No, that's not what he's talking about.

Another way of looking at that would be three bars of 4/4 and one of 6/4.

It's a similar sort of effect to the beginning of 'Spirit of the Radio' by Rush. Think of the opening pull-off riff; on one of the repeats, they cut the time signature in half, in the way Mastodon describes here, and it has the effect of subtly 'throwing the rhythm off'.

 

[swedenuck]

I can't think of a particular example but Metallica used to employ this a bit on And justice for all as well as master of puppets.

 

[distressed_romeo]

I can't think of a particular example but Metallica used to employ this a bit on And justice for all as well as master of puppets.

The most obvious bit in their back catalogue that uses this technique would be the opening of 'Welcome Home...Sanitarium'.

 

[swedenuck]

True enough, I'm just horrible when it comes to old thrash catologues, since I don't really own any old thrash cds.

 

[DDDorian]

I know it seems obvious, but going back and listening to the bands Mastodon cite as influences is an easy way to get a different look at where some of their stylistic features originated and how Mastodon altered them to create their unique sound. For instance, they're huge fans of Thin Lizzy (hit the file-sharing networks for their cover of "Emerald") who have had an obvious influence on Mastodon's twin-guitar interplay. They've also cited doom bands like Acid Bath and Neurosis as influences, as well as Metallica and Slayer and country/rockabilly guitarists like Brian Setzer, Reverend Horton Heat and The Hellecasters. Also, check out the previous bands of the Mastodon members, Lethargy and Today Is The Day to hear them pushing different influences to the fore.

 

[sakeido]

I just had a bunch of shit written out on time signatures and then I accidently hit fuckin refresh and lost everything. Ugh....