noodles
Contributor
Korg DTR-2000, $258, precision +/- 1 cent
Peterson StroboRack, $360, precision +/- 0.1 cent
I'd spend $100 more for ten times the precision.
Now this is a rack tuner...
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Korg DTR-2000, $258, precision +/- 1 cent
Peterson StroboRack, $360, precision +/- 0.1 cent
I'd spend $100 more for ten times the precision.
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Plus Buzz Feiten offsets pre-programmed, and a host of other options? I'm sorely tempted - if I didn't already have a StroboStomp...
noodles
Contributor
If I had the money, I'd get one. Since we're not playing live anytime soon, though, I have a while to save.
Maybe I'm missing something, and if so please pardon my ignorance, but do you really need something that advanced to have everyone in proper tune? I have a Korg DTR-1000 rackmount tuner and it tracks the low notes very well and it's pretty easy to keep your guitars in proper tune. I mean, yeah its not as sensitive, but all the notes fretted or otherwise are right in the middle and everyone sounds in perfect unison.
Perhaps if all the guitars are tuned that accurate, everything just sounds that much better, especially with harmonies, etc? I'm not slagging on that Peterson, it looks awesome, but I just am having trouble figuring out how one could need to spend that kind of coin on a tuner. Feel free to tell me I'm wrong, just curious.
Perhaps if all the guitars are tuned that accurate, everything just sounds that much better, especially with harmonies, etc? I'm not slagging on that Peterson, it looks awesome, but I just am having trouble figuring out how one could need to spend that kind of coin on a tuner. Feel free to tell me I'm wrong, just curious.
noodles
Contributor
Studio: the one place where being that perfectly in tune makes a real difference.
I'm sure you're right....I'm sure it would sound a bit sweeter that way. I think there are mega-accurate software tuners you can get if you're going to be recording via ProTools or something of the sort though.
HotRodded7321
Well-Known Member
I don't think anything is better than a strobe tuner...but then again, working around them all the time, I don't ever trust computers (as far as the software tuners go)
However, I can't really see a use for these save for in the studio, as noodles said. There are good tuners out there for alot less that are accurate enough for normal everyday use.
noodles
Contributor
Studio costs rack up quick when you are halting the engineer's progress to intonate and tune three instruments.
Peterson made a software strobe tuner for a bit, maybe it's still around. I really wouldn't suggest it, though.
While it would be amazing to be that precise, it's not worth $360 to me, especially when guys like Sneap are doing fine with stuff like DTR-1's.
While it would be amazing to be that precise, it's not worth $360 to me, especially when guys like Sneap are doing fine with stuff like DTR-1's.
Jason
Forum MVP
Like do you have Sneap on the brain 24/7?
Sneaptastic! Sneapleriffic! Teh Sneapz0rz!
noodles
Contributor
Maybe some of us aspire to be better than the overrated hack who is destroying metal with his horrible production work. I refer you to the latest Into Eternity disc.
Wow... And you think none of that could have been due to tracking? That's a pretty ignorant statement - He didn't produce jack shit in that, just mixed/mastered it. Ask Crooks - he'll tell you that tracking is a good 70% of the sound.
I'll assume you think albums like Masterplan's Aeronautics and DHIADW are horrible, as well?
I refer you to the latest Chimaira CD... his work on it is amazing.
Richardson, Murphy, and Kernon have all relied on Korg tuners for the most part, but I wouldn't assume them to be as well known as Sneap.
HotRodded7321
Well-Known Member
Good stuff, I finally got the full promo this morning. noodles
Contributor
Honestly, he has been going downhill since DHIADW. Godless Endeavor is horrible in comparison. The latest Into Eternity disc is almost unlistenable, thanks to that horrible kick drum patch. Andy Sneap has been leading the charge in metal for all levels spiking, squash the shit out of it with compression, and frankly, I sick of it. It fatigues the ears.
I'm going to agree on a lot of points... The kick drum on IE was absolutely horrible, and everything but the drums were pretty shit on TGE.
That said, I'd hardly call the guy an overrated hack. And, if you compare a waveform of his stuff vs. someone like Colin Richardsons work, you'd find it about the same.
The only people I think that don't squash a ton in metal are Jens Bogren at Fascination Street (Daylight Dies, latest Opeth, Katatonia, and Amon Amarth) and Finnvox (Masterplan MAS'ing, Evergrey, Sonata Arctica, Edguy).
That said, when Sneap fully tracks a project (With the latest Nevermore being the exception, for some reason), I find it to come out great.
Take a listen to Kreator's Enemy of God. Not squashed at all, actually very quiet in comparison to other records, but great sounds overall.
The new Chimaira, while more squashed than Kreator, has great separation and tones all around, as well.
Masterplan's Aeronautics turned out absolutely amazing - it's a pleasure to listen to.
Doomsday Machine sounds awesome, albeit squashed, but still sounds huge and clear.
Hell, even the new Cradle of Filth sounds pretty damned good.
It's not like everything he's done since DHIADW sucked - there's been quite a few jems.
That said, from what I've read, you dig a pretty old-school sound, no?
That said, I'd hardly call the guy an overrated hack. And, if you compare a waveform of his stuff vs. someone like Colin Richardsons work, you'd find it about the same.
The only people I think that don't squash a ton in metal are Jens Bogren at Fascination Street (Daylight Dies, latest Opeth, Katatonia, and Amon Amarth) and Finnvox (Masterplan MAS'ing, Evergrey, Sonata Arctica, Edguy).
That said, when Sneap fully tracks a project (With the latest Nevermore being the exception, for some reason), I find it to come out great.
Take a listen to Kreator's Enemy of God. Not squashed at all, actually very quiet in comparison to other records, but great sounds overall.
The new Chimaira, while more squashed than Kreator, has great separation and tones all around, as well.
Masterplan's Aeronautics turned out absolutely amazing - it's a pleasure to listen to.
Doomsday Machine sounds awesome, albeit squashed, but still sounds huge and clear.
Hell, even the new Cradle of Filth sounds pretty damned good.
It's not like everything he's done since DHIADW sucked - there's been quite a few jems.
That said, from what I've read, you dig a pretty old-school sound, no?
noodles
Contributor
It's not that I dig an old school sound, because I think the equipment available today is better than anything you could get back in the 80s. I'm talking across the board: amps, guitars, pickups, speakers, mixing decks, software, drums...everything. There is more variety and more quality in everything from the budget lines to the expensive custom stuff.
I just don't think it's being used properly. Subtlety and dynamics are lost on modern recordings. When listening to Led Zeppelin, I constantly ride the volume knob. Instruments constantly change in volume in the mix. "Over the Hills and Far Away" is a great example, as it starts extremely quiet, and slowly builds as instruments are added. When the drums and electric guitar come in, it is like someone kicked down the door.
Go listen to "Master of Puppets" by Metallica. Smack in the middle of the song, everything just stops, and this really quiet guitar part comes in. They slowly build it back up.
Recordings don't do that anymore. If one acoustic guitar is all that is going on at that point in the song, then it has to be the same volume as the band would be full up later on. Why? That's ridiculous. That's not how music is live. Why does everything have to be on eleven all the time?
I know I'm unfairly singling out Andy Sneap, since damn near everyone is guilty of this. However, when you're the big name producer in metal, then you are in a position to do something different, effecting positive change. Instead, it just seams like he gets lazier every year. Come on, Andy, don't you think you could have found a kick drum sample for Into Eternity that didn't sound like it came from a 1986 model Casio keyboard?
I'll see if I can dig up the link to an article about modern recording and ear fatigue. It is quite illuminating.
I just don't think it's being used properly. Subtlety and dynamics are lost on modern recordings. When listening to Led Zeppelin, I constantly ride the volume knob. Instruments constantly change in volume in the mix. "Over the Hills and Far Away" is a great example, as it starts extremely quiet, and slowly builds as instruments are added. When the drums and electric guitar come in, it is like someone kicked down the door.
Go listen to "Master of Puppets" by Metallica. Smack in the middle of the song, everything just stops, and this really quiet guitar part comes in. They slowly build it back up.
Recordings don't do that anymore. If one acoustic guitar is all that is going on at that point in the song, then it has to be the same volume as the band would be full up later on. Why? That's ridiculous. That's not how music is live. Why does everything have to be on eleven all the time?
I know I'm unfairly singling out Andy Sneap, since damn near everyone is guilty of this. However, when you're the big name producer in metal, then you are in a position to do something different, effecting positive change. Instead, it just seams like he gets lazier every year. Come on, Andy, don't you think you could have found a kick drum sample for Into Eternity that didn't sound like it came from a 1986 model Casio keyboard?
I'll see if I can dig up the link to an article about modern recording and ear fatigue. It is quite illuminating.
noodles
Contributor
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Loudness_war
http://mixonline.com/mag/audio_big_squeeze/
Both of these are excellent reads.
http://mixonline.com/mag/audio_big_squeeze/
Both of these are excellent reads.
Drew
Forum MVP
Yeah, but I don't usually gig with my desktop.
A VS-SAM has been on the list for rather a while. Is $249 a lot for a tuner? If you're comparing it to my $15 Korg pocketsized, then yes. However, it can't touch a Peterson for accuracy. And since, in addition to home recording, I do most of my own setup work, the extra accuracy for intonating is worth the price, too.
DSS, seriously dude. Do you ever pass up a chance NOT to mention Sneap?
darren
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If my Strobostomp broke (for whatever reason) i would not hesitate to buy another. The tuning accuracy makes intonation and everyday playing SO much more enjoyable. I couldn't figure out why my guitars sounded so awful when i was using a BOSS TU-2 pedal tuner. It turns out their intonation was out and they just weren't in tune.
