Pickups that track low end notes better/sound better when playing fast?

Discussion in 'Pickups, Electronics & General Tech' started by Alex79, Mar 4, 2019.

  1. Headbanger

    Headbanger SS.org Regular

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    sorry guys, but this pickup note tracking discussion is by far the stupidest thing I've ever read regarding guitar tone
     
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  2. mnemonic

    mnemonic Custom User Title

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  3. KnightBrolaire

    KnightBrolaire what is shred may never die

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    clearly you've never witnessed the ToAn Is In Ur HaNdZ argument, or the ToAnWoOdZ mAtTeR debate (or the 200+ pages of complaining about trump/politics on a guitar forum :nuts: )
     
    Last edited: Mar 12, 2019
  4. lewis

    lewis SS.org Regular

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    I mean,
    Please do go on?....
     
  5. Emperoff

    Emperoff Hasta la vista, Baby Contributor

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    Everybody knows left side tone is the most important factor to achieve supreme tightness.

    You don't hang around here much, do you? :lol:
     
    Last edited: Mar 12, 2019
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  6. LeviathanKiller

    LeviathanKiller Knee-shooting Archer

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    Agile Cepheus
    Bare Knuckle Aftermath (don't recommend this one though)
    Bare Knuckle Impulse
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    Guitarmory Atlas
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    All pretty tight pickups in my opinion
     
  7. Headbanger

    Headbanger SS.org Regular

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    Microphones aren't slow or fast. They don't "track" frequencies at different speeds. The fact that some of you can't agree if EMGs "track" bass slow or fast, or are saying that bolt on necks "track" faster makes it seem to me like you yourselves don't really even know what you are talking about and you are just throwing fancy sounding mumbo jumbo around in order to appear as some pickup tone connoisseurs.
     
  8. diagrammatiks

    diagrammatiks SS.org Regular

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    You are kidding right. They absolutely do have differences in tracking ability in relation to their frequency bandwidth.

    Actually thougjt about it for two minutes and decided that this is literally the stupidest fucking comment I’ve seen here in a long time.

    https://www.teachmeaudio.com/recording/microphones/responses/#transient
     
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  9. Lindmann

    Lindmann SS.org Rectangular

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    Your article is about dynamic microphones where the mass of the diaphragm is actually moving.

    Pickups are different though. It's magnetism and electric current. There's no faster or slower.

    I think it just perceived that way. Huge amounts of sustaining bass might seem slow. If the pickup is lacking bass then you don't get this blooming kind of sustaining note on palm mutes, which might seem "faster".
    In this respect an important factor is, in which area of the spectrum the pickup has its bass sitting. Whether it's more like 150 hz or if it's more like 80 hz (for example)
     
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  10. Headbanger

    Headbanger SS.org Regular

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    yeah I shouldn't have used the word microphones but your link talks about the differences between different types of microphones(condenser, dynamic etc) not pickups which are all essentially the same except for EMGs and Fishmans. I really doubt that the small tonal differences between different high output guitar pickups would cause audible differences in transient responses. Also you might want to consider your own comment for the tittle of "stupidest fucking comment I’ve seen here in a long time"
     
    Last edited: Mar 14, 2019
  11. mnemonic

    mnemonic Custom User Title

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    I don’t know much about Fishmans or how they work but iirc EMG’s are just kinda low output pickups with a built in preamp.

    I remember reading about different response patterns with different magnet types so I googled and found this:

    I know there are plenty of professionals on this forum, I’m sure there’s an electrical engineer or two who could clarify.

    My personal experience is that the amount of bass doesn’t necessarily determine the tightness. When I got a Lundgren M7, it has a large amount of bass on tap yet is much tighter sounding than many other pickups I’ve had.

    Bill Lawrence L500XL is also similar in this regard (and is also a cheaper pickup than most SD’s or EMG’s) though that pickup does have other interesting characteristics.
     
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  12. diagrammatiks

    diagrammatiks SS.org Regular

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    Bb I can’t be responsible if you can’t be bothered to pick a term.

    However the fact that you don’t understand or can’t intuit that a similar process is at work in pickups tells me all I need to know.

    I had a long explanation thought out but I really cba.

    Inductance is the measure of the susceptibility to change and rate of change of the electromagnetic field generated by a wound coil. Inductance is absolutely frequency dependent and determined by the material construction of the pickup.

    The induction of an ac waveform is a physical change in the magnetic field of the coil. It is bound by physical laws and doesn’t just happen magically at the speed of light.
     
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  13. Lindmann

    Lindmann SS.org Rectangular

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    Well...the magnetic field actually does travel at the speed of light. The electric current nearly does too.
     
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  14. Alex79

    Alex79 SS.org Regular

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    So since starting this thread I have been experimenting a bit and I have put both my guitars - an ESP Eclipse with EMGxs and a Gibson Voodoo Les Paul with an alnico Nailbomb - in the same D standard tuning with the same strings (D'Addario, 10-52, the same that Mille from Kreator uses). Up to now I had only kept the Gibson in D standard, the ESP was in standard tuning.

    Playing the same ridiculously fast songs (Enemy of God, Demon Prince) on both guitars side by side, the ESP comes out on top in terms of note definition on the low strings. It feels definitely easier to play the main chorus riff of Enemy of God on the ESP with the EMGs than on the Gibson; it's not a huge difference, but noticeable. Tonally, the Gibson sounds better, but the Nailbomb is one hell of a pickup that is just hard to beat.
    I tried boosts, but it didn't make a big difference.

    In regard to the question if this is primarily due to the pickups, I am still a bit unsure, as the ESP has a thinner neck (less mass to move), a titanium saddle bridge and an aluminium tail piece - all of which probably add to note definition.

    On slower songs/parts (From flood into fire, Phobia) there isn't really any discernible difference.

    So overall I think there is truth to the matter, and some pickups (e.g. ceramic, EMGs...) do track low notes better and more accurately.
     
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  15. diagrammatiks

    diagrammatiks SS.org Regular

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    Sure at dc. At ac we aren’t concerned with the travel speed. But the speed of change. Or are you going to argue that inductance doesn’t exist.
     
  16. Lindmann

    Lindmann SS.org Rectangular

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    But the change in this case is in the direction of the string movement /excursion which causes the chance of the electric polarity.
    The magnetic field itself remains unaltered. So the pickup does not play an active (no EMG pun) role in this.

    You could say that different strings track faster or slower depending on which material they are made of and stuff.
     
  17. ElRay

    ElRay Mostly Harmless

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    you forgot left-side toan—hollow body on the bass side, solid body on the treble.
     
  18. DudeManBrother

    DudeManBrother Hey...how did everybody get in my room?

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    I decided to make a little passive high pass filter in my guitar to cut some bass and see if it’s “tighter”. I settled on 88hz as I had a .022uf cap within reach, and found an 82k resistor. It made the guitar sound tighter to my ears. Someone else should try it too. It doesn’t have to be 88 hz like I did obviously. I’ve done a few 60hz filters on other guitars to eliminate hum and that’s always worked great.

    If anyone is curious to try, but don’t know how: I unsoldered the signal wire (+) from the output jack, and hooked that wire up to one leg of the capacitor. The other leg of the cap gets twisted together with one leg of the resistor; and those get soldered back onto the tip ring (+) of the output jack. The other leg of the resistor gets soldered to ground.
    A2C36240-C7D6-4223-97AF-727BD64C9204.jpeg
     
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  19. Mathemagician

    Mathemagician SS.org Regular

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    Please tell me this is an actual thing? This is so much better than “Tone Woods”
     
  20. TedEH

    TedEH Cromulent

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    While I actually quite enjoy the mic-tracking-transient-magnet-science-jargon-etc discussion, I feel like it's all down to semantics and the original question was probably answered around three posts in:
    :lol:
     

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