Reaper questions regarding amp sims

[fassaction]

Losing my mind here...have been google searching for some sort of answer for a while now, but havent had much luck. Thought I would try my luck with the 7string gurus.

Currently I am recording direct USB from my RP1000 straight into an Asus laptop that I am running the latest version of Reaper. I have been doing a master track with the amp and cab sims (using Poulin amp sims, LeCab and KeFir for my jj powertube cab impulses), and then running a send from each of my dry guitar tracks to the track set up with the VST sims.

My two questions are:

1. I cant seem to get the dry tracks out of the mix when I play it back. Recording monitoring on each track is off, but when I play back its much louder than the amp sim coming through my headphones. How do I get the dry tracks to not be heard in the playback?

2. While I really dig the poulin lecab vst, I seem to have a bit of trouble getting the panning the way I like, and would like a little more control on a track by track basis. I tried removing the LeCab vst from the master amp sim channel, and tried to run KeFir impulse vst on each individual dry guitar track. It sounds like the cab impulses are not working with the individual tracks. I am assuming this has something to do with the track send that I have set up. Is there a way to make this work? Or do the cab impulses have to be sent from the master track?

If anybody could help me out, it would be greatly appreciated.

 

[Winspear]

It's because you're doing a send. A send creates a copy, it is not an output.
You could use the output on the dry track rather than inserting a send.
However, I do actually do the same as you because I have multiple tones on different busses, and one dry track with 2 sends - one for each tone.
However, you have to set the sends to "prefader" and then turn the fader down so the dry track isn't getting output anywhere. So yep, prefade sends and fader down is the answer. You can also Mute the track but in my DAW files exported like that the sends get muted too even though it works on playback.

 

[Winspear]

Cab impulses have to come after the amp sim as you have identified.
What do you need help with regarding Lecab panning?

However, I advise you set up like so:
One amp sim, set the amp sim to stereo.
One Kefir, make sure both L and R are enabled so it's in stereo mode.

Then two dry guitar tracks, panned hard left and hard right.

Then if you want to narrow the panning, you'll have to insert a stereo imager AFTER the cab sim - you cannot turn the pans in on the dry tracks else they will be using eachothers amplifier.

 

[Winspear]

With regards to Lecab, you would set up exactly the same. Dry tracks Hard panned L and R into stereo amp sim. Into Lecab. Then the 3 slots on the left you want to select Left input, the three slots on the right you want to select right input.
Then you can have individual pan controls on Lecab as you see, rather than having to use a stereo imager after Kefir to change the panning.

 

[fassaction]

It's because you're doing a send. A send creates a copy, it is not an output.
You could use the output on the dry track rather than inserting a send.
However, I do actually do the same as you because I have multiple tones on different busses, and one dry track with 2 sends - one for each tone.
However, you have to set the sends to "prefader" and then turn the fader down so the dry track isn't getting output anywhere. So yep, prefade sends and fader down is the answer. You can also Mute the track but in my DAW files exported like that the sends get muted too even though it works on playback.

Ive tried to run two amp sims on two different tracks, but for some reason my system stutters way too much when I do it, which I am not sure why. I have an Asus with an i7 and 8 GB of ram, it should be able to handle all the vsts....at least I hope it should.

I hate to make you type a bunch....but could you explain to me like i am an idiot (because I am when it comes to recording) on how to set the sends to prefader?

i appreciate your help!

 

[Winspear]

Yeah you don't need to run two amp sims, I just mentioned I do that for dual tone
You'd be surprised, sims and convolution impulses are damn demanding. In a blank project with low latency you should definitely be able to handle a couple, but in a full mix even on a good system you'd be surprised by how you have to up the buffer setting. If you can makedo with just one tone in stereo then that's great.

Did you understand everything else?

I don't know Reaper but apparently there is track routing window with the options
http://www.reaper.fm/userguide/ReaperUserGuide430C.pdf
You can see it on page 49

However if you're only using one amp sim you might as well just use the track outputs rather than a send

 

[fassaction]

Yeah you don't need to run two amp sims, I just mentioned I do that for dual tone
You'd be surprised, sims and convolution impulses are damn demanding. In a blank project with low latency you should definitely be able to handle a couple, but in a full mix even on a good system you'd be surprised by how you have to up the buffer setting. If you can makedo with just one tone in stereo then that's great.

Did you understand everything else?

I don't know Reaper but apparently there is track routing window with the options
http://www.reaper.fm/userguide/ReaperUserGuide430C.pdf
You can see it on page 49

However if you're only using one amp sim you might as well just use the track outputs rather than a send

sigh....looks like ill be reading up on this. It just sounds so foreign to me though. I read documentation and I just sit there staring at the page because I dont fully understand the whole concept i suppose.

Ive been having much better luck with my recordings without the amp sims. I just record my tracks with just using the RP1000 patches I have with no cab settings, and then use a cab impulse in the FX chain on each track. I get the tone I want, so I am not exactly sure why I am so hot about the amp sim thing.

 

[Andromalia]

I hate to make you type a bunch....but could you explain to me like i am an idiot (because I am when it comes to recording) on how to set the sends to prefader?

I'm doing it another way, personally.

-Setup a track with you DI recording.
-Use whatever mps sims etc on that track to get the sound you want.
-Record the result on another track.
-Mute DI track

To record: set the receiving track to "record, mono", by right clicking on the red record button.
then press record and your processed tone will be recorded on the track without modyfying the DI track, which you can just mute until needed later.

 

[Winspear]

The concept of pre and post fade sends is this:
You have a signal, lets say a vocal. As the engineer you want to hear it nice and loud with some reverb so you turn the fader up and apply some effects. However, the singer in the booth just wants to hear a bit of their dry voice. So you set a send, PRE FADE PRE FX - they hear just the input signal of their voice at a level unaffected by your fader.

This is just one example of typical send use. Here your use of a send is pointless as you could just use the output.
My use of multiple sends was just a way to achieve multiple outputs for multiple amp sims.

Another typical use of a send:
Sending a snare to an external reverb unit. This way you have your dry snare on one track and pure reverb signal 100% wet on another. By setting the send post-fade, you can turn the reverb down too when you turn down the dry snare fader.

 

[G27DUDE]

I usually put my effects chain on the track that I recorded the DI on. I render it to a WAV file and then work with it. It may be boring to listen to dry guitar tracks while recording but it forces you to be a lot cleaner. And when you finally put that power behind it, it sounds so much better. Andromalia has a similar idea, which I will probably start using! xP

 

[ArrowHead]

The "listening dry while recording" is not quite how most do this.

You're just not going to play the same with a dry signal.

Instead, you should be running a wet signal to monitor your recording, while recording a second dry track for re-amping.

Secondly, it sounds like you're recording multiple tracks of guitar, then re-amping them through the exact same amp sim/track? Typically you don't want multiple tracks together all with the identical effects and guitar sound. Instead re-amp each track individually with separate instances and sounds from your VST. If your computer is bogged down by multiple instances (IR's take massive processing power) freeze or render each track after you re-amp it.

 

[Winspear]

Secondly, it sounds like you're recording multiple tracks of guitar, then re-amping them through the exact same amp sim/track? Typically you don't want multiple tracks together all with the identical effects and guitar sound. Instead re-amp each track individually with separate instances and sounds from your VST. If your computer is bogged down by multiple instances (IR's take massive processing power) freeze or render each track after you re-amp it.

You can do that as long as it's set in stereo like I described