Reverb increasing their selling fee (3.5% to 5%)

[Demiurge]

^At first glance, 1.5% doesn't seem like much for smaller items, but it is a ~40% hike in fees. With that, the "grow together" line is a bit disingenuous because Reverb's benefit from this is obviously greater than any customer or seller benefit there could be.

 

[xzacx]

Those who are no longer using Reverb over this, which superior platform will you be using? Who has cheaper fees, wider user base, better support, and a superior interface? Not that I love Reverb that much, but $15-per-$1,000 in sales isn’t going to be the thing that stops me from using what’s still a better option in most cases. I’d sure rather take my chances there than deal with people playing PayPal games five and a half months after a sale through eBay. And it sure doesn’t have any impact on where I’d buy anything. Again, I don’t really say that to defend Reverb, as much as it is to say “that sucks but I don’t know a better alternative.”

 

[fantom]

I'm confused tho

WHY is there repeat sales tax on the resale of used items?

It depends on the laws of the buyer's location. In California, there is no "sales tax". It is technically a "use tax". This means anything you buy, used or new, that you intend to use within the state, regardless of where you bought it from, requires paying a tax. That includes internet sales, used items, etc. Online retailers who don't charge the tax can get into trouble with the CA government if they don't charge it. Residents are asked to give details on the state tax return for items they didn't pay the tax. Usually the mom and pop stores avoid the paperwork if you buy on the phone. But major sites like eBay and reverb can't avoid it without having politicians come after them.

 

[Adieu]

Those who are no longer using Reverb over this, which superior platform will you be using? Who has cheaper fees, wider user base, better support, and a superior interface? Not that I love Reverb that much, but $15-per-$1,000 in sales isn’t going to be the thing that stops me from using what’s still a better option in most cases. I’d sure rather take my chances there than deal with people playing PayPal games five and a half months after a sale. And it sure doesn’t have any impact on where I’d buy anything. Again, I don’t really say that to defend Reverb, as much as it is to say “that sucks but I don’t know a better alternative.”

What do people who sell privately on forums use, anyway? Paypal? Moneygram/WU?

What are these 5 month paypal games, and how does reverb prevent em?

 

[diagrammatiks]

But middlemen are VAT exempt though???

Does selling a used item mean you can request your old sales tax back or something???

I don't know how to works with vat.

but here technically you're supposed to report sales tax on in person transactions too if they're over a certain amount.

when you sell through reverb you become a store using their platform.

but the legality of it is pretty simple. when you buy a used house or a used car you also pay sales tax.

 

[diagrammatiks]

dbl

 

[Ordacleaphobia]

Eh, I feel like this isn't really that big of a deal. If it increased any more then I'd have an issue but maybe I'm just used to being taxed by living in Mass lmao

By itself, no- but when you look at the whole package, you kind of start to wonder why you bother.
When I list an instrument (usually in the ~$1000 range) I have to automatically write off 20%. Between payment fees, Reverb's fees, the bump fee you need to pay if you want your product to move, shipping, and the fact that literally no one on that platform will literally ever in a million years under any circumstances pay the sticker price on the listing, 20% is an optimistic projection. Not to mention, taxes that the buyer has to pay for on top of your listing price, which 9/10 times they will factor into their offer, expecting you to eat. Then, if you price higher to counter that, enjoy having nobody ever check your listing because they just assume you're out to gouge people.

Then when it sells, you need to source a box and packing materials, take time off work to go drop it off (because lol at the notion of the post office staying open a nanosecond past 5), which you'd need to do anyway if you were selling via a forum or something to someone far away, but it stings a lil' bit when the whole time you're doing so, you're painfully aware that you're getting paid likely less than the item is worth.

Or you could sell it for $1000 locally.
Shoot, of the last 4 guitars I've listed on Reverb, 3 of them sold offline locally- and that's after giving the Reverb listings a 3 month head-start.

Reverb was already at the threshold of not being worth the convenience for me personally, so any increase in fees like this really gives me pause.

 

[xzacx]

What do people who sell privately on forums use, anyway? Paypal? Moneygram/WU?

What are these 5 month paypal games, and how does reverb prevent em?

They use PayPal typically for private sales—it's the safest thing as a buyer. But as a seller it's risky, because people can (and do) file for refunds for up to six months after a transaction is over. Decide you don't want something after a few months? File an "item not as described" claim and get your money back—it's happened all too often. Reverb prevents it by allowing you to use its own payment system which doesn't have that, and occasionally sides with a seller in disputes (as opposed to PayPal basically never siding with the seller—which is why it's so safe as a buyer).

 

[Adieu]

They use PayPal typically for private sales—it's the safest thing as a buyer. But as a seller it's risky, because people can (and do) file for refunds for up to six months after a transaction is over. Decide you don't want something after a few months? File an "item not as described" claim and get your money back—it's happened all too often. Reverb prevents it by allowing you to use its own payment system which doesn't have that, and occasionally sides with a seller in disputes (as opposed to PayPal basically never siding with the seller—which is why it's so safe as a buyer).

What's safe-for-sellers, then, but doesn't automatically come with the assumption that you're most likely trying to be a scammer?

 

[Mathemagician]

Nothing yet. But if someone wants to step into the music sales market with a lower fee and similar usability for sellers that’s where sellers will go. And buyers will follow where product is sold.

 

[xzacx]

What's safe-for-sellers, then, but doesn't automatically come with the assumption that you're most likely trying to be a scammer?

My point was that Reverb is a better option for sellers because it doesn't open you up to the PayPal games. It's not perfect and has it's own issues, but I'm more comfortable selling something there than elsewhere.

 

[Seabeast2000]

You could just run a warehouse consignment system. Let the consigners harvest the % and assume all liability. Unless this is done already at scale somewhere, not sure. Probably be a heavier % though and you'd still have shipping to cover to the location. Maybe I just rephrased Guitar Center's used gear program.

 

[ramses]

Those who are no longer using Reverb over this, which superior platform will you be using? Who has cheaper fees, wider user base, better support, and a superior interface? Not that I love Reverb that much, but $15-per-$1,000 in sales isn’t going to be the thing that stops me from using what’s still a better option in most cases. I’d sure rather take my chances there than deal with people playing PayPal games five and a half months after a sale through eBay. And it sure doesn’t have any impact on where I’d buy anything. Again, I don’t really say that to defend Reverb, as much as it is to say “that sucks but I don’t know a better alternative.”

+1

Not excited about the increase, but not the end of the world. Reverb is still the best choice if you don't want to deal with scammers and other kinds of dishonesty.

 

[Frostbite]

By itself, no- but when you look at the whole package, you kind of start to wonder why you bother.
When I list an instrument (usually in the ~$1000 range) I have to automatically write off 20%. Between payment fees, Reverb's fees, the bump fee you need to pay if you want your product to move, shipping, and the fact that literally no one on that platform will literally ever in a million years under any circumstances pay the sticker price on the listing, 20% is an optimistic projection. Not to mention, taxes that the buyer has to pay for on top of your listing price, which 9/10 times they will factor into their offer, expecting you to eat. Then, if you price higher to counter that, enjoy having nobody ever check your listing because they just assume you're out to gouge people.

Then when it sells, you need to source a box and packing materials, take time off work to go drop it off (because lol at the notion of the post office staying open a nanosecond past 5), which you'd need to do anyway if you were selling via a forum or something to someone far away, but it stings a lil' bit when the whole time you're doing so, you're painfully aware that you're getting paid likely less than the item is worth.

Or you could sell it for $1000 locally.
Shoot, of the last 4 guitars I've listed on Reverb, 3 of them sold offline locally- and that's after giving the Reverb listings a 3 month head-start.

Reverb was already at the threshold of not being worth the convenience for me personally, so any increase in fees like this really gives me pause.

Maybe my local area just sucks ass but selling locally and getting an even respectable offer on anything is basically impossible. And personally I've never had to use the bump feature to get stuff sold

Those who are no longer using Reverb over this, which superior platform will you be using? Who has cheaper fees, wider user base, better support, and a superior interface? Not that I love Reverb that much, but $15-per-$1,000 in sales isn’t going to be the thing that stops me from using what’s still a better option in most cases. I’d sure rather take my chances there than deal with people playing PayPal games five and a half months after a sale through eBay. And it sure doesn’t have any impact on where I’d buy anything. Again, I don’t really say that to defend Reverb, as much as it is to say “that sucks but I don’t know a better alternative.”

This is basically where I'm at. Like I understand how the math breaks out to a 40% hike but I feel like that's sort of looking at it in the worst way possible. Not that it's even a good thing IMO. Regardless, I think we can all agree that the e-mail is complete suck ass and definitely being pissed on and telling me it's rain status

 

[ramses]

[...] Regardless, I think we can all agree that the e-mail is complete suck ass and definitely being pissed on and telling me it's rain status

Yeah, that email was kind of funny. But, what else would you expect from a marketing department?

They are not a scrappy startup anymore, and they haven't been for a while.

 

[protest]

so...back to eBay I guess. Well that was nice while it lasted. I'm sure eBay will go up to 5% in a few months though once they get an influx of music gear sales.

 

[tedtan]

They are not a scrappy startup anymore, and they haven't been for a while.

They're not even Reverb/Chicago Music Exchange any more; Etsy bought them a while back.

 

[Spaced Out Ace]

This is bullshit. Tell them. They started a seller survey, which I'm sure will end up in a folder in an email account somewhere on their servers that'll do next to Jack and shit, and Jack left town.

So sellers now have to: Get fucked up the ass for 8% sellers fees, let people haggle over price so they don't have to pay taxes (essentially; I've had people haggle on price, and I can see the total they paid. It's close to what I listed, but including taxes on their end), ship free, insure the package for free, AND give the people a fucking deal or risk being too close to new.

Reverb, you're absolutely moronic. And of all times... you can virtue signal, but think this is a great idea for the musicians who use your platform? Read the fucking room; we're on the verge of a fucking decade plus (by some estimates) economic crisis, and your response is... this? Tata, dickheads.

 

[Spaced Out Ace]

^At first glance, 1.5% doesn't seem like much for smaller items, but it is a ~40% hike in fees. With that, the "grow together" line is a bit disingenuous because Reverb's benefit from this is obviously greater than any customer or seller benefit there could be.

False. I think their "growth" is hypothetical and misguided. In fact, I see a lot of people unhappy about this and wanting to move elsewhere. I think this could actually result in them seeing a massive hit to their bottom line, which is, of course, ALL that matters for big corporate companies. And I feel like this is just the first seller fee hike. Didn't they try to force big time sellers into bumps, without necessarily wanting such?

 

[protest]

I wonder why they didn't mention boosting stock price with their reasons for the increase?