RGA8 discussion. All input/comments/ideas is encouraged.

[ryaneatsbrains]

I've spent the last two decades drumming, and at the end of June 2010 I purchased an RGA8. Does anybody know the cutoff b/t the first and second generations? I still have to swap out the pups [I have soldering experience, but I've never worked on a guitar]. I plan on purchasing a set of Lundgren M8s and removing the mid scoop toggle switch. I've been reading the trials and tribulations a lot of RGA8 owners have gone through regarding the bridge and that really sucks [sorry guys, that HAD to have been heartbreaking].

Luckily I have not had any issues with my Ibby thus far, although I'm afraid to even look at the bridge wrong, let alone try and lower the action, as well as a few other adjustments. I've already changed the strings from the .009 - .065 stock config to .010 .013 .017. .026 .036 .046 .056 .070 [Ernie Ball Medium Slinky, not the sound I was going for]. So I'm going to change the strings to a 7 string DR Tite Fit set along with a .075 bass string for the F#. My whole point for this thread is, if you were me what would you do? [With the mid scoop, would you add anything else?] I realize some people are not too pleased with the product and that's cool by me. Oh, and can I use the RG2228/Lundgren wiring diagram for the RGA8?

When it comes to drumming and percussion I know my way around no problem, but in the realm of guitars I'm as blind as a bat...thanks for your time.

 

[alexguge]

I've been reading the trials and tribulations a lot of RGA8 owners have gone through regarding the bridge and that really sucks [sorry guys, that HAD to have been heartbreaking].

Mine didn't break untill a guitar tech set it up. When he tuned the new strings, the bridge popped out of the wood.
Be careful man.

 

[Eric Christian]

My whole point for this thread is, if you were me what would you do?

In a nutshell why don't you just play it and enjoy it the way it is? You start doing all this tinkering and its gonna blow up in your face and you'll have a nice $800 wall decoration at your house instead of a playable guitar. I imagine this guitar is just fine right out of the box, just leave it alone and play it is what I would do.

Reason being, I'd just stick with the stock string setup or something real close because you're probably gonna need to drill the tuning peg out just to fit a .075 plus I can't imagine all that extra tension is gonna do the defective bridge screw any good. Plus the fact that another guy on here put some big thick strings on and it stripped out the locking nut because the screw was to short.

 

[ryaneatsbrains]

You bring up a very valid point. That has crossed my mind many times over, even re-drilling the hole for that screw has entered my thought process a few times. It all comes down to curiosity; well if I do this it will yield that type of result etc. etc. I noticed one guy even built a completely new body for his RGA8. As far as the string buzzing is concerned I'm under the impression that thicker gauges will reduce that [maybe not 100%, but it's better than no improvement] but you need to find a middle ground and not overdo it like you said. For the F# when I re-strung it with a .070 bass string I had to unwind a decent percentage of it to fit the tuning peg.

I've had a little bit of time to experiment with the mid scoop toggle switch. It's prime for clean tones but I just cut it out when I play distorted. So deductive reasoning and logic entered the fray once more, and I was thinking about an additional tone knob, or even a kill switch, depending on whether or not that is even doable with the Lundgrens.

 

[coreysMonster]

In a nutshell why don't you just play it and enjoy it the way it is? You start doing all this tinkering and its gonna blow up in your face and you'll have a nice $800 wall decoration at your house instead of a playable guitar. I imagine this guitar is just fine right out of the box, just leave it alone and play it is what I would do.

Reason being, I'd just stick with the stock string setup or something real close because you're probably gonna need to drill the tuning peg out just to fit a .075 plus I can't imagine all that extra tension is gonna do the defective bridge screw any good. Plus the fact that another guy on here put some big thick strings on and it stripped out the locking nut because the screw was to short.

that isn't really very good advice. an 800$ guitar should AT LEAST be able to be set up properly without shit breaking out of the wood. We're talking about guitars here, instruments that can be taken on the road, survive tours and live settings. If a simple string change will rip stuff out of the wood, then for god's sakes, return this guitar immediately.

Also, you dont have to do any drilling to fit a .75 into a tuning peg, you can just unwind the string a little and then fit it in.

 

[drmosh]

In a nutshell why don't you just play it and enjoy it the way it is? You start doing all this tinkering and its gonna blow up in your face and you'll have a nice $800 wall decoration at your house instead of a playable guitar. I imagine this guitar is just fine right out of the box, just leave it alone and play it is what I would do.

Reason being, I'd just stick with the stock string setup or something real close because you're probably gonna need to drill the tuning peg out just to fit a .075 plus I can't imagine all that extra tension is gonna do the defective bridge screw any good. Plus the fact that another guy on here put some big thick strings on and it stripped out the locking nut because the screw was to short.

are you saying people shouldn't set up their guitars to their liking? That's ridiculous

 

[JaeSwift]

Hi, I'm the guy thats building the replacement body

Sticking to the stock strings is not a feasible option, they are WAY too slim and will cause absolutely horrible feel and playability. Most shops dont bother to give a guitar a good set up after it arrives there, so don't count on being able to pick it up and play it as it is because it will suck badly, though admittably it was worse with the RGA 8 than it has been with many other guitars I purchased (most likely due to the fact its an 8 string and they require a bit more attention in set ups).

The bridge I am impartial about; on one hand the screws shouldnt snap out (was it just the screw, or the insert with the screw? if its the insert then that is not good), on the other hand you shouldnt raise the bridge without raising the setting screw with the allen head. IMO Ibanez should also have Epoxied the inserts in, something I made sure to do with my replacement body.

It's really not a bad guitar for the money, the neck borders on exceptional for it's price, but the stock pickups and strings are just terrible.

 

[Eric Christian]

that isn't really very good advice. an 800$ guitar should AT LEAST be able to be set up properly without shit breaking out of the wood. We're talking about guitars here, instruments that can be taken on the road, survive tours and live settings. If a simple string change will rip stuff out of the wood, then for god's sakes, return this guitar immediately.

Also, you dont have to do any drilling to fit a .75 into a tuning peg, you can just unwind the string a little and then fit it in.

I'm just making the observation that the tuning peg hole diameter and the size of the locking nut are the factory limitations of the guitar. Drilling the hole out, unwinding a string and putting a longer screw in the nut probably wouldn't be classified as "set up" either, just modification thats my point.

As far as the string buzzing is concerned I'm under the impression that thicker gauges will reduce that [maybe not 100%, but it's better than no improvement] but you need to find a middle ground and not overdo it like you said. For the F# when I re-strung it with a .070 bass string I had to unwind a decent percentage of it to fit the tuning peg.

A larger diameter string may or may not have more tension it just depends on the brand. Some manufacturers actually list this in their spec sheets. Also a larger diameter string sits closer to the frets so it could buzz more unless you adjust the bridge up, adjust the truss rod, shim the bridge or a combination of all three.

are you saying people shouldn't set up their guitars to their liking? That's ridiculous

Its not "set up" its modification. OP asked for "all input/comments/ideas encouraged". My opinion is put the heaviest set of strings that will fit normally on the guitar, make sure the strings arent fretting out, set the intonation and just play the guitar for a couple months.

 

[AVH]

You certainly can. Here's a basic wiring diagram I've made for those installing Lundgren M8's into RG2228's...You could just remove that EQ switch and add a tone pot to make it the same as the 2228, or just leave it out of the circuit entirely. Your call...but you won't regret putting in an M8 - it smokes.

Mine didn't break untill a guitar tech set it up. When he tuned the new strings, the bridge popped out of the wood.
Be careful man.

How unfortunate, that wouldn't have happened from my shop

I've had enough experience in the past doing this exact repair for customers with the Edge 3FX8 bridge...here's my usual explanation:

The problem is usually caused by the internal channel for the bridge leveling screw not being drilled deep enough to allow for enough clearance when lowering the leveling screw farther down for extra low action. Therefore, the screw goes through the brass anchor, 'bottoms out' in the channel, then acts as a jack, raising the anchor up and out of the body - sometimes quite suddenly - much to the horror of the owner.

These brass anchors are just seated as a press-fit into the wood by Ibanez, and really should be glued into the body - especially considering how much pressure it's under from upward string tension. Although not under pressure, for years Gibson uses almost the identical same press-fit brass anchors for mounting it's P-90 pickups into the mahogany bodies of Les Paul/SG Specials & Juniors - and this similar problem happens there too. Curious, isn't it?

First, assess the damage. Obviously, the methods and amount of repair work will be directly dependent on the actual damage if any. Is there any wood splintering or missing? Usually there isn't, it's just a clean hole remaining after the anchor's popped out, but there's been two cases where there was wood splintering (mahogany in the RGA8 is way more prone to this than the basswood RG2228), which required reinforcement with doweling and re-drilling.

The usual, basic repair is to completely remove the bridge, drill down (preferably with a proper drill press for straightness) inside the existing cavity at the bottom with a drill bit about 1mm larger in diameter than the bolt itself, about 5-7mm deeper into the body. Blow/vacuum all dust out. Thread bolt into the brass anchor all the way through until flush with the bottom of the opening in the anchor. Cover (just) the bottom end of bolt and anchor with wax, to prevent glue from entering the threads. Now mix up good, 24hour (NOT cheap 5min) Epoxy, which stinks like shit but holds strong for this, and cover the outside of the anchor and the inside of the cavity using a Q-tip applicator or similar. Don't go overboard with the glue, use just enough to layer over the whole area of contact. Holding the bolt end, slide the anchor into the channel and push it down. It should be tight - not wobbly - and if too tight to do it by hand, use a bit of dowel or wood and gently tap it in with a small hammer until the top of the anchor is flush with the face of the body - no further. Let sit and harden for 24 hours. Remove bolt, and replace the bridge and bolt. Re-setup and you shouldn't ever have this issue again.

 

[NoSaintNick]

I recently setup one of these bastards for a customer and here are a few observations.

1. Ibanez needs to invade Indonesia and teach them how to fret guitars. Every newer Cortek guitar with Ibanez printed on the headstock I've seen has terrible fretwork. If every fret isn't uneven then they're at least scratched all to hell and so low they'll only take a single fret level and crown. This problem was especially evident on the RGA8 I just setup

2. As others have alluded to but not come out and said, the scale length is too short. The stock low strings feel like wet noodles. I used an Ernie Ball .80 bass string for the F# and it still feels a little loose for my taste. You don't have to drill out the tuner since these stings are tapered at the end, you do however need to pay attention to where you cut the ball end off. There is a small distance between to low F# tuner and back end of the locking nut so pay attention that you cut the ball end off at the right spot, giving you enough slack for a couple wraps around the post.

3. The nut lock on the two low strings does fit awkwardly if you use an .80 but it doesn't strip. The previous commenter may have overtightened it though who knows, maybe the threads were junk from the factory.

4. You don't necessarily have to widen the F# saddle to hold an .80. It does sit above the bottom of the slot but it did intonate just fine. With the rest of the string heights set comfortably it was a little high but since it still felt pretty loose it wasn't difficult to fret and considering the it would be more likely to buzz given it's low tension (even after a proper fret leveling) I felt this was acceptable (the owner agreed once he tried it).

So there it is, Ibanez needs to take over a country and make longer guitars.

 

[JaeSwift]

Side note, I measured the distance from the end of the nut until' the heart of the bridge bolts and came to 71cm, or 28". Keep in mind the saddles are in front of the bolts, albeit not by a lot.

 

[AVH]

The scale of both the RGA8 and the RG2228 is 27", and is a very tired subject on this forum...but agreed, it's generally a bit short for most folks. It was Ibanez's compromise to still satisfy the needs of lead players and appeal to the widest market.

 

[NoSaintNick]

I forgot to mention that I did have to widen the nut slot to accommodate the larger string.

 

[ryaneatsbrains]

I've learned a considerable amount of info from this thread Looks like I have quite a bit of work ahead of me, and I welcome it with open arms. I've been looking for a Luthier with a solid reputation in the Metro Detroit area. On a side note, does anyone use DR Tite Fit strings with their 8? I can imagine the amount of "dead"/lifeless strings they produce is higher than other companies, but I wasn't satisfied with the tonality of Ernie Ball or D'Addario. Currently my string config. is .010 .013 .017 .026 .036 .046 .060 .075, might up the F# to an .080.

I haven't had any issues with the bridge of my RGA8, I'm just a tad hesitant to lower the action/mess with the settings at all since there have been so many issues with said bridge. Anybody know the cutoff b/t gen. 1 and gen. 2 RGA8s? I got mine in July of 2010.

 

[NoSaintNick]

I don't know when they addressed the bridge issues but the one I worked on recently was purchased around the same time and everything seemed fine.

If you go up to an .80 it should be tapered at the tuner end and you'll have to compress the saddle end with pliers to fit it in. Also file the nut slot out a bit. I didn't think it was necessary to file the saddle but depending on your action preference you might discuss doing so with your tech.

 

[mr coffee]

I have to admit, I'm really happy to see this thread - like ryaneatsbrains, I've had some reservations about the RGA8 after reading all the horror stories here...so now it seems it may be back on the wish list!

-m

 

[xmetalhead69]

with regards to the mid boost switch, when I put blackouts in my rga8, I rewired it into a killswitch, which is far more beneficial imo.

 

[ryaneatsbrains]

Mr Coffee I highly recommend the RGA8. It's unfortunate that Ibanez didn't spend more time developing this guitar into what it could/should be [same goes for the RG2228 imo] but they're on the right track. 2011 looks to be very promising for Ibanez ERGs [I'm sure Rondo/Agile has something up their sleeve too].

Despite the RGA8's reputation as of late I don't regret buying one, and from this point on I can only improve it/make it even better.

 

[Eric Christian]

2011 looks to be very promising for Ibanez ERGs [I'm sure Rondo/Agile has something up their sleeve too].

Do you think its possible they will make a tremolo bridge for the RGA8? I'm looking at either a Agile or Guerilla with a Kahler but I don't really like Kahlers so I'm still on the fence waiting to see what might come out.