SSO: Deep Thoughts

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Demiurge

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What's the recovery time on one of those? As someone entering his mid-30s and committed to not having any kids, it's definitely something I've thought of just to be 100% safe on my own end.
Just like the folks above indicate, the procedure is easy and recovery is fine unless it isn't. After icing for 3 days or whatever, it seemed like I was out of the woods, but there was some additional swelling and pain that lasted about 3 months. It was a nuisance, but certainly not a deterrent.

I did, however, buy a fretless bass while hopped-up on meds after surgery that I haven't learned to play.
 

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MFB

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Having been there, and having a best friend go there a few months before me, let me just recommend this be one of those things that despite being a man, you talk about openly with people before-hand. I researched the hell out of doctors in the area that did vasectomies, and asked around to get a vibe about who left the office screaming and who left feeling like, "meh, no big deal." I picked the later. My buddy made the mistake of letting his wife choose a doctor, and actually got laughed at when he passed out from the pain in the room, and was in such sorry shape they had to wheel him out the back to avoid scaring the other patients after.

Do your homework on this one. I recovered in about three days to the point of being able to sit at a desk again, and about two weeks later you'd never know the difference. My bud took a bit longer. Good luck.

I mean, if you're talking friends/family, then I'm SOL my man as all of them have 'drank the koolaid' on the kids wagon, with my step-brother having his first a few weeks back. My old roommate is about to have his second kid later this year, with his first going on 2-yrs old I think? Now his entire world is that kid, and the upcoming one, and all they do is hangout with other parents because their kids are the same age, and it's just that for the next ...18 years for him. Same for a couple other friends I used to hang with, and even some of my paintball teammates have kids and I just, couldn't care less about having one. All my cousin are Catholic and they can't stop popping them out, and all I can think is they're just giving that many more people the enjoyment to suffer as people continue to dunk on the world.

But if you mean doctors? Then yeah, I'd definitely be looking around at ratings and whatnot.

In addition to seconding everything said above, I'll give you the same full disclosure my doc gave me. About 10% of men develop chronic ball pain from getting a vasectomy. Sometimes reversing it fixes the pain, sometimes it doesn't. I was one of those 10%, and though my recovery time was about 3 days (but wouldn't recommend doing physical work for at least a week), I went through the next two years constantly feeling like I'd been kicked in the balls about six hours ago. I think it had to do with some scar tissue that developed on one side after the procedure. Anyway, the pain gone now, though the area of the scarring is still more sensitive than the rest. I'd make the same choice again for what it's worth.

Is it that high? I've heard people develop after pain for sure, so it's not entirely surprising, I just dont recall the exact % off hand, thought it was like 1/25-50.

Just like the folks above indicate, the procedure is easy and recovery is fine unless it isn't. After icing for 3 days or whatever, it seemed like I was out of the woods, but there was some additional swelling and pain that lasted about 3 months. It was a nuisance, but certainly not a deterrent.

I did, however, buy a fretless bass while hopped-up on meds after surgery that I haven't learned to play.

This sounds more in line with what I've heard as the usual, vs. the above, and if I did have the procedure I'd already be taking time off work for it just because I can; 3 months of swelling and just general discomfort would still be worth the price of not having a kid for the rest of my life. Plus, as long as I accidentally buy a lined fretless bass, I think I'd be OK with it.
 

budda

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In the spirit of shower thoughts; do bluejays know they are blue?
 

Briz

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Marx was lazy. He squandered inherentences and never created anything other than an idea. The proletariat become the bourgeoisie in his system, which history is replete with examples. Community matters more than ideologies. Work with your neighbors. Be builders, not takers. Learn how to survive if everything you rely on is removed from you. Divisiveness and class envy is a crutch. You own your future. You are unique and valuable. Choose to be the owner of your future. Divisiveness is a tool of those that want to control you for self-serving purposes.
 

TedEH

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Marx was lazy.
I feel like as soon as anyone has to resort to picking some historical name and going "nonono, THIS is what they originally wanted", the plot was lost long ago. Whether it's Marx, or Jesus, or the Founding Fathers or whoever else. It's one thing to reflect and ask "what can they teach us", but past that, time could be much better spent on modern perspectives and solutions. That kind of thinking is a fallacy. An appeal to tradition.
 

Randy

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I feel like as soon as anyone has to resort to picking some historical name and going "nonono, THIS is what they originally wanted", the plot was lost long ago. Whether it's Marx, or Jesus, or the Founding Fathers or whoever else. It's one thing to reflect and ask "what can they teach us", but past that, time could be much better spent on modern perspectives and solutions. That kind of thinking is a fallacy. An appeal to tradition.
I partially agree, although I do highly encourage listening to people in their own words. There's lots of ideas that get lost in translation, especially when you hear someone else's paraphrasing or interpretation of what a person said or did.

I'm less interested in people like that as some kind of icon, more curious of what they were like as actual people. Compare them to yourself or people you know. I think it's unhealthy to put anyone on a pedestal.
 

TedEH

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especially when you hear someone else's paraphrasing or interpretation of what a person said or did.
I'm being specific about deriving authority from what was originally said. "We have to do it this way, because that's what the founding fathers always intended." "I can't do this, because it goes against the teachings of Jesus."

Academically, they may be interesting, nothing wrong with that. I just don't grant that as enough reason to back up otherwise bad or irrelevant or outdated ideas. Interesting, sure. Useful, not as much, but it's contextual. A source of truth? No way.
 

Briz

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The
I feel like as soon as anyone has to resort to picking some historical name and going "nonono, THIS is what they originally wanted", the plot was lost long ago. Whether it's Marx, or Jesus, or the Founding Fathers or whoever else. It's one thing to reflect and ask "what can they teach us", but past that, time could be much better spent on modern perspectives and solutions. That kind of thinking is a fallacy. An appeal to tradition.
Modern thinking is self sufficiency. Marx was lazy and blew through his inheritance. He had money, yet pretended his ineptitude was a byproduct of something other than his poor stewardship. Facts are facts, no matter how much you don't want them to be true.
 

TedEH

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Modern thinking is self sufficiency. Marx was lazy and blew through his inheritance. He had money, yet pretended his ineptitude was a byproduct of something other than his poor stewardship. Facts are facts, no matter how much you don't want them to be true.
I'll be honest, I have no idea what you're trying to say. Some guy being bad with his money a long time ago doesn't (or shouldn't) have much bearing on the way we try to solve present problems. I don't deny Marx may have been lazy, but I have no need to judge his character because I don't hold him up as an authority in the first place. There are many modern ways of thinking, and some of them are centered around self-sufficiency, and many are not.
 

Briz

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I'll be honest, I have no idea what you're trying to say. Some guy being bad with his money a long time ago doesn't (or shouldn't) have much bearing on the way we try to solve present problems. I don't deny Marx may have been lazy, but I have no need to judge his character because I don't hold him up as an authority in the first place. There are many modern ways of thinking, and some of them are centered around self-sufficiency, and many are not.
I think I laid it out in a basic format. What I said is what I mean. Embrace community. Be a maker, not a taker. Remain at enmity with those seeking to sow divisiveness. You are unique, you are valuable. You have control over your future. Be self sufficient so that no one can remove your ability to provide and thrive. It doesn't take a large sum of capital to do this, just takes will.
 

TedEH

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Ok. but those are your ideas, not "modern thinking". Self-sufficiency is actually a very old idea. Subsistence farmers exist. And I don't know what that has to do with Marx and his spending habits.
 

Briz

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Ok. but those are your ideas, not "modern thinking". Self-sufficiency is actually a very old idea. Subsistence farmers exist. And I don't know what that has to do with Marx and his spending
Well, Marxism is on the rise over the past 50 years. Do with that statement what you will. You're valuable, you're unique. You may be part of a class, but you are not that class. You are you. If you have people or family that depend on you, invest in ways to be self sufficient. I choose to be at enmity with divisiveness.

Marx is an icon, but he's no more than a guy that had money, mismanaged money, and then cast blame because he squandered money. Those who practice his ideas always seem to elevate a few proletariat to authoritarian rule, and strangely enough, they live just like the bourgeoisie. That's it. It's historical fact. Not a dig, not provocative. Just a statement that's grounded in historical context.
 
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TedEH

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Well, Marxism is on the rise over the past 50 years
At the risk of diving into what should be in the politics threads, I think that some derivatives of socialism are what's on the rise, not literally Marxism. The only place I see the word Marxism come up anywhere that isn't art, is from right-wing talking points about "cultural Marxism" which is so loosely defined that it basically just means "whatever I disagree with right now" - in the same way that conservatives have always called whatever ideas they don't like "communism". These are all distinct and different and specific terms that aren't interchangeable. I'm not an expert in them, because I don't specifically subscribe to them or care about the labels themselves, but I know well enough not to conflate them.

If you have people or family that depend on you
But what if I choose to believe that the family that depends on me isn't my literal atomic family, but rather my adopted metaphorical family that is my community? And then what if I extend that community to include my whole city? My whole province? My whole country? And why stop there? Why not operate under a model of the world where every person, no matter how self-sufficient they may be, depends on other people in at least some small way? Then it would be in my best interest to make choices that support everyone, and not just myself.
 

Briz

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There are plenty of politicians that are sel proclaimed Marxists. Their words, not mine.

Edit: Not just politicians, average people too. Historically, it's never worked. Ever.

Engage your local community. Become self reliant. Take power away from those that want to control you. No matter how you spin Marxism, someone takes the helm while others suffer. There's a reason why his philosophy, when implemented, results in oppression, mass murder, othering, and a decline in quality of life. History is replete with examples.
 
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TedEH

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History is replete with examples of all kinds of things leading to those results - spirituality, dictatorial thinking, colonization, hierarchical essentialism, supremacy, etc.etc. Disconnecting from society doesn't solve society, it just removes you in particular from the problem set. That's one down, 8.1 billion to go.
 

CanserDYI

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There are plenty of politicians that are sel proclaimed Marxists. Their words, not mine.

Edit: Not just politicians, average people too. Historically, it's never worked. Ever.

Engage your local community. Become self reliant. Take power away from those that want to control you. No matter how you spin Marxism, someone takes the helm while others suffer. There's a reason why his philosophy, when implemented, results in oppression, mass murder, othering, and a decline in quality of life. History is replete with examples.
Capitalism is working out just great with zero examples of any of those negatives, you betcha.
 

nightflameauto

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Sometimes it's just better to let the guy setting up scarecrows to attack attack them in peace. Don't give them an audience. It only encourages them. And for fuck sake, don't try to defend the god damned scarecrows.
 
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