"stimulus" so far

[RenegadeDave]

Visual Evidence the Obama Team Completely Misjudged the Stimulus Impact - Jim Geraghty - The Campaign Spot on National Review Online

The light blue line is what unemployment would have been if we didn't pass the Stimulus.

The dark blue line is what they expect to be unemployment with stimulus passed.

The brown dots are where it actually panned out to be.

Criticism of the stimulus aside, this is what happens when you trust the people trying to pass the legislation to round up the facts and data. That graph came from the Whitehouse. I thought there were non-partisans that were responsible for this data? Anyway, think about this next time someone projects the impact of their legislation.

 

[Zehailiu]

So ...Is that change we need or don't need?

 

[Randy]

The National Review, and also... comparing theoretical unemployment to actual unemployment? Thanks, but no thanks.

 

[RenegadeDave]

You can't just discount it flat out, the only thing that they did was overlay the actual data over the theoretical data proposed by the whitehouse in an effort to cram this bill down the people's throat. My point is you shouldn't use "data" prepared by legislation authors in considering legislation as impetus.

Here are other places that this same graphic showed up. If that's not valid, I dont' know what is.

FactCheck: Did the Stimulus Really Create 150,000 Jobs? | Newsweek Politics | Newsweek.com

FactCheck.org: Making Sense of Stimulus Spending

and it's original source before being reported on NRO:

Correction to the May Unemployment Chart Innocent Bystanders

You can't just plug your ears because you don't like what's being said when it's factual. The fact is that projections that helped ramrod this legislation down our throats were terribly inaccurate.

 

[Zehailiu]

Looking more and more like a case of rich people fucking us in the ass to get richer to me.

 

[Ckackley]

So what if it's legit ? I'm sure it's real. It's a projection. A forecast.. If not for the stimulus unemployment might have shot even higher than it is now . The only fact is we don't know what would have or could have happened. That graph might as well say that in April space aliens were going to land and hand out gold.
They made a choice based on what info they had. I'm not really saying the stimulus was a great idea, but forecasting the economic future of a country ruled by the media is like forecasting the weather two years out. It isn't gonna be right no matter what you do.
Just looking at the graph , keeping a little over 1% of the population working seems like a solid idea. That's a damned ton of people.
This administration doesn't possess magical powers of economic restoration, or peacemaking. They'll make mistakes just like the last administration, and the administrations yet to come. No one will know for at least 10 years how all of this is going to shake out.
You want to be mad at someone about job losses and a failing economy ? Blame the media for skewing stories to make everything sound horrible. Blame news anchors for caring more about ratings than news and scaring the country into economic fear. Freedom of the press shouldn't mean freedom to sensationalize.

Sorry . Got a little ranty there ..

 

[polydeathsphere]

when will anyone realize with or without the stimulus, no matter who is in office running the country, rich people will fuck poor people. just play music and ignore it

 

[Zehailiu]

^ Wrong.
France, Canada, Sweden, etc.

 

[polydeathsphere]

^ Wrong.
We are currently discussing the USA

 

[RenegadeDave]

So what if it's legit ? I'm sure it's real. It's a projection. A forecast.. If not for the stimulus unemployment might have shot even higher than it is now . The only fact is we don't know what would have or could have happened. That graph might as well say that in April space aliens were going to land and hand out gold.
They made a choice based on what info they had. I'm not really saying the stimulus was a great idea, but forecasting the economic future of a country ruled by the media is like forecasting the weather two years out. It isn't gonna be right no matter what you do.
Just looking at the graph , keeping a little over 1% of the population working seems like a solid idea. That's a damned ton of people.
This administration doesn't possess magical powers of economic restoration, or peacemaking. They'll make mistakes just like the last administration, and the administrations yet to come. No one will know for at least 10 years how all of this is going to shake out.
You want to be mad at someone about job losses and a failing economy ? Blame the media for skewing stories to make everything sound horrible. Blame news anchors for caring more about ratings than news and scaring the country into economic fear. Freedom of the press shouldn't mean freedom to sensationalize.

Sorry . Got a little ranty there ..

You're right, they have no great way to make predictions with respect to the economy, as evidenced in that graph. That said, why do you use dodgy predictions as impetus to pass legislation? If you recall, or dig on this board, CBO had predictions that flew in the face of the whitehouse's predictions on this stimulus well in advance of it passing.

My gripe is if you're going to use facts and figures as grounds for legislating, DO NOT go off the facts and figures of the people who made the policy in the first place. The numbers are skewed to make the legislation look more favorable in stead of what is more probable.

I'm not mad at anyone for the economy other than the people who's fault it was, individuals and businesses that bought and built on property they could not afford due to ridiculously lax lending guidelines.

Now there's another issue on the horizon where there are already projections from the CBO, but they're favoring Whitehouse #'s because the Whitehouse numbers hurt less. Care to take a guess how much that program is going to cost? I'll go ahead and give my position away and side with the CBO.

We made a bad decision based off of bad information in the last presidency, but that doesn't give this administration a pass to make decisions on bad information especially when more accurate statistics are available from a non-partisan entity.

 

[JakeRI]

not for nothing but most of Obama's stimulus money hasnt even gotten out.

I predict it will right as the economy naturally starts to fix itself, and he'll take some credit, and then in the long term we are FUCKED from all the money the FED printed.

Its so fucked up. I'm getting fucking sick of capitol hill

 

[Zehailiu]

^ Wrong.
We are currently discussing the USA

^Wrong, you're saying you should just sit there and take it up the ass because it's always happened. I'm saying there are alternatives.

 

[synrgy]

^Wrong, you're saying you should just sit there and take it up the ass because it's always happened. I'm saying there are alternatives.

Short of violent revolution, I'm not really sure what you mean unless you're saying we should have voted for Nader or something, and that was NEVER gonna happen...

'We' tried to vote in a change of policies during the last election. (arguably during the last 3 elections, but I think I'm almost over that now.) See where it got us?

The problem is basically that money talks. The vast majority of the populous will eat whatever our media feeds them. Until or unless people like you and me can buy out all the media outlets and forceably change their 'reporting' tactics, it's highly unlikely that the collective conscious is going to change.

I mean, you gotta figure for every 100 unhappy Americans, there's probably only one who's not too busy sitting on his ass stuffing potato chips in his mouth to do anything about it.

 

[sevenstringj]

The whole thing is a con. And they found the perfect way to wiggle out of it every fucking time.

I remember last year during the campaigns when Obama quietly changed his slogan from "my plan will create 3 million jobs" to "my plan will create or save 3 million jobs." I immediately thought to myself, What bullshit--so we could lose 20 million jobs, and the Obama team can turn around and say, "See? My plan worked! Without it we would've lost 23 million jobs!"

Just a couple weeks ago, there was FINALLY an article about this very bullshit in the WSJ. McGurn: The Media Fall for Phony 'Jobs' Claims - WSJ.com

It's utterly sickening that they can get away with such a con and almost no one holds them accountable. The media should be all over this shit. Oh wait... the media... BWAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!

 

[Zehailiu]

Short of violent revolution, I'm not really sure what you mean unless you're saying we should have voted for Nader or something, and that was NEVER gonna happen...

'We' tried to vote in a change of policies during the last election. (arguably during the last 3 elections, but I think I'm almost over that now.) See where it got us?

The problem is basically that money talks. The vast majority of the populous will eat whatever our media feeds them. Until or unless people like you and me can buy out all the media outlets and forceably change their 'reporting' tactics, it's highly unlikely that the collective conscious is going to change.

I mean, you gotta figure for every 100 unhappy Americans, there's probably only one who's not too busy sitting on his ass stuffing potato chips in his mouth to do anything about it.

I don't know what I mean either, I feel as helpless as anyone else at this point. I just know that some nations have gotten past greed better than we have.

It seems like the most deeply rooted human flaw.

When I was working in China I noticed they have the exact same problem as over here.
People will fuck over each other without much hesitation for money. They made juice, candy, desert, meat, even eggs out of harmful chemicals just because it's a few cents cheaper than using the real ingredients. I'm sure you've heard about the toddler milk scandal by now.

Over here it's the same idea but in a different style, here they actually pass legislations to make illegal activities legal so that corporations can profit, they corrupt the media and the education system to keep people dumb and uninformed, there's even talks about the president being influenced, even "appointed" in the interest of profit.

The political spectrum is a circle, if you go too extreme to the right (communism) or to the left (capitalism), you end up in the same place, (fascism).

If somebody doesn't do something soon I'm afraid we're going to develop a symbiotic relationship with our greedy shadowy overlords akin to the cow's relationship to us. We're bred, fed and harvested for the sole purpose of feeding some higher beings' lifestyles.

I'm so moving to sweden when I get the chance.

 

[sevenstringj]

We're bred, fed and harvested for the sole purpose of feeding some higher beings' lifestyles.

 

[Zehailiu]

Lol, yeah that, except it's already happening and the CG sucks.

 

[cpnhowdy]

It is unfortunate that the most gov officials and people running the fed follow Keyensian fallacies.

This guy gives quite a funny comparison between reality and wishful thinking.

 

[crimsonbound]

i just find it funny that obama and his subordinates got elected just by preeching change. has anybody seen any of this change? i have not. and i'm pretty pissed at the half of the us who elected this 'black' man

 

[Tiger]

i just find it funny that obama and his subordinates got elected just by preeching change. has anybody seen any of this change? i have not. and i'm pretty pissed at the half of the us who elected this 'black' man

*cringe*