The "shredding has no feeling" rant

[jacksonplayer]

This debate has been going on for years, and it's never gotten any less asinine. Do you suppose that any dipshits ever went up to Charlie Parker or John Coltrane and told 'em to slow it down? Not to say that every wannabe shredder at Guitar Center is the next Parker or Coltrane, but to say that shred is inherently unmusical is pure bullshit.

 

[The Dark Wolf]

To me alot of what I've heard from Rusty Cooley sounds terrible. (I do however like Outworld)

Whereas I've loved almost everything I've heard from Yngwie.

So I definately agree that it depends on the phrasing and what not.

Me too, brother. I feel the exact same way.

Diff'rent strokes, I guess.

 

[Metal Ken]

thats cause Yngwie sounds EPIC. I love everything Yngwie does that DOESNT have a vocalist on it. As a matter of fact, i just got back from trying to buy the first album from him, but the mall was closed (They havent started holiday hours yet :/ )

 

[rummy]

I usually admire their dedication and discipline.

 

[NegaTiveXero]

Seriously, i don't shred, it's not my style. I'd do it if I could and it fit, but I really can't do it well.

But, can people really say that shred has no emotion? If ANYTHING the emotion comes from the rhythm behind it. An "emotional" solo can only be emotional in front of the right rhythm, anywhere else it's wankage.

On the other hand let's say emotion DOES come from soloing. Then, it's impossible for shred to NOT have emotion. There are an uncountable amount of emotions that are expressable. Not just "woah, I can really feel his pain through this solo". Maybe someone is pissed and they want to express that emotion...hmm, anyone now a style of solo that is really fast and aggressive that would relay that emotion well?

Anyway, that's my opinion on the matter.




P.S. I love Clapton, Vai, Petrucci, Coltrane, and a lot from both "sides" of the debate.

 

[skinhead]

Malmsteen IMO is very very clean when he play, it's not easy to play a plexi in 10 with a strato in the neck pup position and sweep a lot.

I respect a lot what he does, i have all his cd's, i think that he repeats the same a lot (like me, what a coincidence ) but his music it's sweet.

And his woman it's sweet

 

[The Dark Wolf]

thats cause Yngwie sounds EPIC. I love everything Yngwie does that DOESNT have a vocalist on it.

And I feel exactly the same as this, too.

(Except, I've heard some bluesy-type stuff Yngwie both plays and sings on, and it sounded pretty damn good, IMO.)

 

[Naren]

thats cause Yngwie sounds EPIC. I love everything Yngwie does that DOESNT have a vocalist on it. As a matter of fact, i just got back from trying to buy the first album from him, but the mall was closed (They havent started holiday hours yet :/ )

Although I like a lot of his Rising Force stuff.

I'm very picky when it comes to "shred." My own lead guitar style is mostly medium-tempo with some slower leads as well. I get bored really quickly of a lot of the super fast shredder (such as Cooley). They impress me, but I don't really like their music. And, even with the shredders I do like, my favorite licks by them are a lot slower than their regular stuff.

Speed does not equal emotion.

 

[All_¥our_Bass]

I do.
I've been ripping Clapton and Page and who-all else for god knows how long for doing shit that any moron can do within 10 seconds of being handed a sheet with a pentatonic scale on it.
Gilmour's different, for the record.

Give me shred or give me death!

And yes, there's a lot of boring, emotionless shred. Who gives a shit? There are a lot of people who suck at a lot of things. I'd rather have boring shred than really good "rock/blues" solos any day.

I hate all people who play with excessive volume. If you're in a store, keep your playing to yourself.

It probably doesn't help that both of us have expirienced Steve, the epitome of classic rock revival. He embodies all of the reasons I dislike most (but not all) classic rock.

 

[Metal Ken]

And I feel exactly the same as this, too.

(Except, I've heard some bluesy-type stuff Yngwie both plays and sings on, and it sounded pretty damn good, IMO.)

Yng's vocals are great, actually. i just hate the singers he usually has..i cant stand Jeff Scott Soto, Doogie White, Et Al, they sound like rehashes from the worst parts of the 80s.

 

[Metal Ken]

Malmsteen IMO is very very clean when he play, it's not easy to play a plexi in 10 with a strato in the neck pup position and sweep a lot.

Say what you will, but i've played some mexican strats that friggin SHRED. I'd NEVER buy a USA strat, but i would definately consider a nice priced mexi.

 

[BinaryTox1n]

I love shred, I love emotional solos.
If you only listen to one or the other all of the time, i'd say you're missing out,
And if you think emotion can't be expressed in a 33nps arpeggio, i'd argue that you have the possibility of having 33 times the amount of emotion per second as you would with an "emotional" (apparently read: slow) 1nps solo.

I don't see why those terms have to be mutually exclusive,
not every "shred" solo is lifeless, and not every slow solo is so full of emotion that i feel i need to never listen to fast music again.

And about the guitar center thing, some people are just idiots.

 

[Metal Ken]

^ well said.

 

[Buzz762]

Say what you will, but i've played some mexican strats that friggin SHRED. I'd NEVER buy a USA strat, but i would definately consider a nice priced mexi.

I dunno what it is about them, but I tend to prefer Mexican strats over American strats. I don't know what it is about them.

 

[Nik]

Malmsteen IMO is very very clean when he play, it's not easy to play a plexi in 10 with a strato in the neck pup position and sweep a lot.

Malmsteen's fairly clean, but there are hundreds of shredders who are cleaner.

When I saw him live last year, he did an accoustic guitar solo and it was awful His fretting and picking weren't quite matching up. I dunno, maybe he was having a bad night...

 

[Metal Ken]

Malmsteen USED to rule.. i've horror stories of him getting plastered and playing while shitfaced and whatnot recently, so that has a lot to do with i bet.

 

[Naren]

Malmsteen USED to rule.. i've horror stories of him getting plastered and playing while shitfaced and whatnot recently, so that has a lot to do with i bet.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6TaLQ0hZUpU

Of course, here is a more recent version that I think is even better. It's pretty cool when he puts the guitar on the floor at the end and is tapping. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GhRN4hXbEV4 I have to believe he's not drunk for this... or at least only mildly...

What I like most about Yngwie's songs are usually the slower parts. For example, in Black Star the part near the end (around 4:30) is probably my favorite part of the whole song. It's so emotional and aweeeesome. Or the part where he plays the main lick with his teeth.

 

[Cancer]

This debate has been going on for years, and it's never gotten any less asinine. Do you suppose that any dipshits ever went up to Charlie Parker or John Coltrane and told 'em to slow it down? Not to say that every wannabe shredder at Guitar Center is the next Parker or Coltrane, but to say that shred is inherently unmusical is pure bullshit.

That, and it misses the point of shred. To me, shred has always been a celebration of the player's technique. It has nothing to do with the listener, in fact, they are an option. People who don't shred don't relize that shredding feels REALLY GOOD TO DO. I mean really, its called guitar masturbation for a reason, any note executed cleanly and with control feels really good, playing a succession of notes, sets up a feedback loop where those good feelings are repeated over and over, and then on top of that if you have the ability to play it fast, its like those labs monkeys who kept hitting the tube filled with cocaine until they died, y'know.

Simply put, those who've never had that ability simply don't get it, they're reacting the same way as a person who never gotten high, never had sex, or never had a euphoric response tied to a particular activity, perhaps they got it from playing their blues lick, and believe that no other style of guitar playing can achieve that affect, I dunno.

When you get high, it "should" only concern 3 people, You, yourself, and the person in the mirror, that what shredding is, its akin to a physical high, and it all about the player.

I'd go as far saying that as for as shredding is concerned, "musicality" is almost secondary, musicality should only be a consideration if you THINK that other people may be listening, and even then only if you care. By and large though IMO, shredding, like masturbation, is a personal event, and ironically tends to be just that in many music stores, where I find the shredders keep the volume down, while the nOObies or the sucky guitarists tend to crank their amps up.

Personally, the people I love to listen to shredwise, seem to keep that in mind (at least to me), they aren't performing, they are self-absorbed, doing their thing and if other people hear it and like it great, if not, well it's not for them. I hear that attitude alot in Rusty's playing, which is why he's my current fave.


Just my 2 cents.

 

[Adam]

That, and it misses the point of shred. To me, shred has always been a celebration of the player's technique, people who don't shred don't relize that shredding feels REALLY GOOD TO DO. I mean really, its called guitar masturbation for a reason, any note executed cleanly and with control feels really good, playing a succession of notes, sets up a feedback loop where those good feelings are repeated over and over, and then on top of that if you have the ability to play it fast, its like those labs monkeys who kept hitting the tube filled with cocaine until they died, y'know.

Simply put, those who've never had that ability simply don't get it, they're reacting the same way as a person who never gotten high, never had sex, or never had a euphoric response tied to a particular activity, perhaps they got it from playing their blues lick, and believe that no other style of guitar playing can achieve that affect, I dunno.

I'd go as far saying that as for as shredding is concerned, "musicality" is almost secondary, musicality should only be a consideration if you THINK that other people may be listening, and even then only if you care. By and large though IMO, shredding, like masturbation, is a personal event, and ironically tends to be just that in many music store, where I find the shredders keep the volume down, while the nOObies or the sucky guitarists tend to crank their amps up.

Just my 2 cents.

Right fucking on brother! Theres not one thing I disagree with what you said, except for the fact that it is a personal event, for me, I incorporate shred into every song I compose, but I try to to make it as melodic as possible

 

[Wiggywiggler]

I quite like some shredding, like for example
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mk_GMvIea6s

Can anyone else alternate pick that ?

But there's a fine line between bacon and christian, enjoyable shred and unenjoyable shred. As far as emotion goes, shred presents different emotions than let's say a bing single bend with some delay and whatnot on a slow song. I wouldn't say it's emotionless, but the emotions vary. Some people just can't tap into shred. All the best for them.