Transcribing without an instrument

[distressed_romeo]

Is anyone here really good at this?

When I did A Level music at school I got thrown in right at the deep end, having to write out long passages of music without an instrument to check myself, and really struggled with it.
Since then I've done a lot of aural training on my own and am gradually getting better at it. Anyone have any secrets/tips to share, apart from constant practice?

 

[Nik]

Well, I kinda do that, but not really.

I use Guitar Pro, so when I put stuff in tab, although when I write music, I pay attention to the notes rather than the tablature (hence why some of my songs are really retarded to play in terms of fingering).

But I compose 95% of the time without my instrument, just sitting with my laptop outside, or in class (lol college is fun).

In any case, I'm sure you're leagues more advanced than me, so it would be arrogant for me to offer advice, but I would imagine that this is like all musical things--practice is the answer.

 

[distressed_romeo]

The main thing I've found to be helpful is to practice singing intervals and scales/arpeggios, ideally over a harmonic backing. Along with that I do things like singing a three or four note melody and then attempt to replicate it on the guitar or keyboard. Solfege exercises helped me with that initially, but I don't use that so much anymore.

If you're already composing without the guitar, chances are your ear is already pretty well developed.

 

[lachrymose]

The main thing I've found to be helpful is to practice singing intervals and scales/arpeggios, ideally over a harmonic backing. Along with that I do things like singing a three or four note melody and then attempt to replicate it on the guitar or keyboard. Solfege exercises helped me with that initially, but I don't use that so much anymore.

If you're already composing without the guitar, chances are your ear is already pretty well developed.

Sounds like you're already working on improving your relative pitch, I recently got a program called EarMaster School 5 that is useful for just having a customizable set of exercises for working on intervals (well fuckloads more actually, right down to recognizing certain chords, inversions and progressions).

but still, having to compose without an instrument seems a bit extreme.. it's generally when you fuck up something on an instrument that you discover something way better sounding then what you'd have written rigidly on paper.

unless its counterpoint or a fugue or something

 

[Nik]

but still, having to compose without an instrument seems a bit extreme.. it's generally when you fuck up something on an instrument that you discover something way better sounding then what you'd have written rigidly on paper.

Well, I compose without an instrument, and the whole discover-something-cooler-sounding-than-you-intended thing usually happens during the recording process.

For example, the other day I was recording this song and I had just finished recording some basic powerchords. Anyway, I thought it'd be a cool idea to layer some some chords (with a wah pedal) over the powerchords that consist of the 3rd and 5th notes from the root of the powerchord (thus making a big triad spanning 2 octaves). Anyway, the first third from the powerchord was actually an E (the song is in Em) and from there you decend one tone below. When I was recording, I accidentally screwed up and instead of decending to the 7th, I decended only a 1/2 step to a raised 7th (harmonic minor).

This screw up turned out to sound totally awesome and I kept it. It had a really strange sound to it, and yet it didn't sound 'eastern' or classical, like most of the time I venture into the harmonic minor

 

[lachrymose]

minor-major 7ths

 

[distressed_romeo]

Sounds like you're already working on improving your relative pitch, I recently got a program called EarMaster School 5 that is useful for just having a customizable set of exercises for working on intervals (well fuckloads more actually, right down to recognizing certain chords, inversions and progressions).

but still, having to compose without an instrument seems a bit extreme.. it's generally when you fuck up something on an instrument that you discover something way better sounding then what you'd have written rigidly on paper.

unless its counterpoint or a fugue or something

I might check that program out. Last thing I got for eartraining was Gary Willis' book, which is pretty comprehensive.

 

[lachrymose]

haha oh shit i got this thing called "Relative Pitch Ear Training by David Lucas Burge"

but it MAJORLY lost credibility, when this guy claimed to have perfect pitch AND perfect relative pitch. yet admittedly could barely sing in tune... it was like pole dancing lessons from Roseanne haha. but i guess his course was uhh accurate. LONG ASS FUCK though.. you'd spend hours going through it. id reather just sit down with Ear Trainer and get into my own groove. i can isntantly recognise major 7th intervals and such now.

to be honest i think relative pitch is FAR more useful to begin with, because even if your instrument is out of tune, you KNOW what note to aim for. Perfect Pitch is good for a vocalist though because then you can nail the note and know where to go from there. but meh, takes time i guess. hearing the note in your head, then being able to sing it is quite an achievement i think. goes beyond having to bend and 'find' the note as in a fretless instrument. Those Melissa Cross videos emphasize how important it is to hear the note before trying to sing it, and i think that's the different. avoiding the horrible 'search and destroy' element. you search for the note and just.. fuck it up totally.

but good luck anyway, you sound more than on your fucking way. time is your friend i guess as with everything. i suck at being patient, im having to kick my own ass. took me months to even play some shit Nirvana song, how long does it take to master intricate melodies using the one instrument that lacks an visual representation or proper 'tuning'. singing is a bitch. i wish i was tori amos she sings out of tune but its all in tune.. meh, bitch.

that was a tad long winded.

oh wait though, did you mean transcribing as in changing the key of the songs though, or just writing something from scratch? transcribing is so much easier in midi.. select it all then move it up a few steps.. unless its a Parrallel minor-major modulation, they're fucking cunts.

 

[distressed_romeo]

No, I did mean transcribing as in listening to music and writing it out, not transposing it into a different key.

I've always though those DLB courses looked like a con. Although being a good musician doesn't necessary include having a beautiful singing voice (Beethoven was a pretty terrible singer apparently), you'd expect the guy to be able to back up all the claims he makes in his adverts.

Really good bit of advice I got from one of my old music teachers; 'Singers are some of the worst musicians, but some of the best musicians are musicians who can sing.'