Used prices on Axe-Fx Ultras - did I miss something?!

[HighGain510]

Hey gents! So I haven't spent much time on the Fractal forums (or many other forums as I've been on vacation and spending less time on forums and more time with family) but did something happen recently that has altered the used rates on Axe-Fx Ultras? I heard that the II's are shipping out faster than previously and the list is getting blown through at a higher pace than before, but did something else go down that has people freaking out and trying to blow out their units? I've seen prices anywhere between $1300-1400 and still some for $1800. Is it just desperate sellers in need of post-Christmas cash or did I miss something? I just picked up that package deal recently and since my name is up on the II list I was planning on selling the one I had to buy with the package but I'd hate to take a bath on it just because the rest of the folks on the market are trying to blow their units out to clear funds for a II and they're desperate.

I'm just wondering if I'm missing something, I haven't seen prices go this low since the original announcement on the II's came out and people freaked out and threw their Ultras and Standards up with ridiculous BIN prices on eBay. If anyone has some insight as to why this happened suddenly I'd be interested to know, the only three things I could think of is either Christmas hitting people in the wallets, Axe-Fx II availability increasing or that people are just really that desperate for cash these days but it seems odd that it happened instantly and all at the same time. The Ultras are still killer units and I have no qualms about just keeping mine, however I am still quite curious about trying a II but not if it means taking an $800 bath on one.

 

[Shask]

I think it is a lot of what you said plus NAMM is happening next week and there is promising rumors from Digitech, Line 6, and Kemper. Basically there is more competiton from other companies, and Axe-FX II units.

I don't have one, but I have been watching the prices since I have been REALLY considering buying a used Ultra lately. But, I am sure people on the fence are thinking like me, why buy a used Ultra for $1700 when it is not much more to get an Axe II. the updates are probably done and the gap in price is worth future updates. If I am getting a Standard/Ultra there better be a bigger $$ gap to have "old technology".

 

[MaxOfMetal]

Hopefully the prices start reflecting how many more units are out there, on top of what a "fair" used price would be.

It was bound to happen.

 

[ozzman619]

up here in canada ive seen people asking closer to $2000 for ultra's and even as high as $1700 for the standard.... i doubt they actually got that kind of coin for it but still its a bit much to even ask that much i think

 

[kmanick]

I already have my II but I've been watching the prices on Craigslist an dEbay and I still see the "usual" price of around $1700.00 for an Ultra and $1300-$1400.00 for a standard.
Cliff is getting more of these out lately but if he has another 'stall" in production the prices of the Ultras may go back up a bit.
supply and Demand my friend, we have no control over it.
I must say though that so far this II has really impressed me

 

[jam3v]

Not only are people getting their units from the wait list, but it's almost always in stock on their website. Axe Standard/Ultras simply aren't going to have the same demand as they did.

 

[HighGain510]

Cool thanks for the thoughts guys, I'm still a little confused about the whole "well they SHOULD come down in price" as nothing has changed about their current function, other than the II coming out and having more features and future updates. As far as other options too I'm a bit puzzled as while the HD stuff from Line 6 isn't bad I've yet to hear a clip that blew my mind and the Kemper stuff STILL isn't hitting the shelves and keeps getting pushed back so I don't see them as viable competition until they get their production issues sorted. I'm hoping I can move this unit for the most I can still get as I'd like to put it towards the II order but since some are still selling for $1800 I don't think it's quite hit that "bottom" yet where the prices will stay there. I was tempted to offer shipping to Europe as I know the guys on waiting lists there would still pay closer to the "old" used value since they're still getting them $1-2K cheaper than they would new across the pond. It will be interesting to see if anything really unique for modeling comes out at NAMM this year.

Nick - Good to hear it man, I heard the updated to firmware 4.0 made a huge difference too! I'm excited to get my hands on a II personally but I wish I could hear one in person so I could help justify whether or not to take the huge hit on my Ultra. If it's noticeable enough I might not care as much, I'd just hate to ditch a quality unit at a significant loss if the improvement to the tone wasn't really awesome (which I'm sure it is... ). I know I'll have more than enough money for my order within a month when I get my taxes done, just afraid if I wait too long that the plateau on prices might drop out on me permanently!

 

[jam3v]

I didn't spend much time with the Axe Ultra, but I've owned the II for a few weeks now. It lives up to the hype. But I don't think I would have purchased it without the wait list coupon.

 

[HighGain510]

Right on, thanks dude! Yeah my name has been up on the list since October, just things keep popping up (Thorn finished several months ahead, bills in general needing to be covered etc.). We also just found out the pug rescue we applied to is 90% done the background check and they're doing our home visit this week after which they will start going over the list of fostered pugs with us to see which ones we can take home so that's going to push my II order back until tax time even if I sell my Ultra as I want to have money ready for the pooches since we're adopting 2 of them!

 

[Shask]

It is the same mentality that drives people to wait overnight in lines for a new Iphone. People like to have the newest toys even though their "old" version doesn't do any less than what it did yesterday. That is just the digital curse I guess.

I agree the competition doesn't sound as good in clips (I have a POD HD), but also a $1500 difference makes a HUGE difference in how much people care about that extra 10% extra sound quality. It is just unnecessary to most. Only the biggest critics care

 

[themike]

We also just found out the pug rescue we applied to is 90% done the background check and they're doing our home visit this week after which they will start going over the list of fostered pugs with us to see which ones we can take home so that's going to push my II order back until tax time even if I sell my Ultra as I want to have money ready for the pooches since we're adopting 2 of them!

Just when I think our bond could not get any stronger, you had to pull out the humanitarian of small, adorbable dogs card, didn't you?

 

[HighGain510]

It is the same mentality that drives people to wait overnight in lines for a new Iphone. People like to have the newest toys even though their "old" version doesn't do any less than what it did yesterday. That is just the digital curse I guess.

I agree the competition doesn't sound as good in clips (I have a POD HD), but also a $1500 difference makes a HUGE difference in how much people care about that extra 10% extra sound quality. It is just unnecessary to most. Only the biggest critics care

Haha yeah I totally get that aspect of it, but in the same fashion as say the iPhone, the 4S model comes out and the iPhone 4 models didn't immediately drop to $100.

 

[kmanick]

I have spent some time on an Ultra and now obviously on my II and one of the main reasons I decided to gow tiht the Ii was the USB interface. I updated my firmware from 3 to 4.0 and then 4.0 to 4.01 and then updated all 3 bancks (and I am as much of a freaking noob with this stuff that you'll ever see) in a total of about 10 minutes thru the latest Axe Edit software. I also no longer need a seperate audio interface to get this thing to work.
Plus the new JVM model ........................kills
the new FAS 6160 model ......................kills
the new CAS3+ mode ..........................kills
the new stereo tape delay can you say echoplex) sounds awesome
plus being able to turn the grid modeling on/off makes quite a difference on some of the models.
there a buch of other stuff as well

from the fractal forum
NOTE: FACTORY BANKS HAVE BEEN REDONE TO REFLECT THE CHANGES AND IMPROVEMENTS. THE SYSEX FILES TO INSTALL THE BANKS ARE INCLUDED ALONG WITH THIS FIRMWARE.

Overhauled power amp modeling. Master Volume control is now usable over a larger range. Reduced harshness in many amp models. Most amps will sound more “open”. Adjusting the MV in existing presets is recommended for optimum results.

Added “Grid Modeling” parameter to Amp block. Turning this to OFF bypasses the grid modeling in the power amp which can reduce subjectively undesirable distortion.

Added “FAS 6160” model. This model is based on the PVH 6160 model but more open and less fizzy than the original amp. Also, a virtual choke has replaced the resistor found on the original’s power supply filter. This results in a bouncier feel.

Added Tape Echo algorithm to Delay and Multidelay blocks. This algorithm simulates a tape echo where modulation occurs due to tape speed variation. In the Delay block the algorithm is implemented as a two head monophonic tape “deck”. The Time/Tempo parameters set the distance between the record and first playback head. The Ratio parameter sets the relative distance between the record and second playback head as a percentage of the first playback head. The Multidelay block is implemented as a monophonic deck with four independent heads. See the updated manual for full details.

Fixed TEMPO R parameter affecting left time in Dual Delay.

Added Dry Delay Shift for Thru-Zero mode of Flanger. This allows moving the thru-zero point from the center (default) to the edge or anywhere in between.

Exposed Advanced Whammy Start and Stop parameters to modifier control.

Increased output level for Octave Distortion model in Drive block.

Added support for all MIDI Voice Messages when MIDI Adapter Mode is on. This allows using the MIDI ports for keyboards and other devices other than foot controllers.

Fixed Recall Effect not working in certain instances.

I scored mine as a package deal with the MCF floorbaord from Quigs, he really hooked me up so it was kind of a no brainer.
Is it worth the upgrade? (IMO) definitely.
I'm actually going to get together with Zimbloth soon , he uses the ultra
and we are going to do some side by side comparisons.
I'll post the results of that (probably sometime next week I'm going skiing this weekend )

 

[HighGain510]

Just when I think our bond could not get any stronger, you had to pull out the humanitarian of small, adorbable dogs card, didn't you?

Yessss! Not only that, but TWO of them! I can't wait, the lady is coming by Saturday with one her pugs to do the home inspection and see how I interact with dogs.

 

[Andromalia]

Prices in Europe are staying what they are.
Keep in mind getting "better" than an ultra is shelling the full axe II price over here, so used prices start from that point actually.
The Axe II being 2200€ (don't start me on this) Ultras are sold at 1800 and standards at 1500.

edit: ZOMG just got this:

Dear (almost) Axe-Fx II Owner, Finally we have good news for you - the next shipment with your Axe-Fx II will be picked up in the US by our shipping company on Friday, which means that your Axe-Fx II should be delivered to us beginning of next week. We will get back to you with payment details later this week. Thanks again for all your patience during the long wait!

 

[Locrian]

Digital products, that are viewed to be inferior to their newer counterparts, are always going to drop in value. Why spend $1800+ on a used, inferior product, when the new, better product is just a few hundred dollars more? As more AxeIIs come into the market, more and more people will be looking to unload their ultras and standards, which is going to mean lower prices.

How much would you pay for a 2nd generation Iphone? No where near what you'd pay for a 4s. I do not think this is the lowest the ultras will get. My guess is that the price will settle in the $1200 range when all is said and done. Digital products don't appreciate in value unless the technology that follows it is viewed inferior. I couldn't pay someone to take this old TV from my house, even though it works great and has a great picture. But it isn't a flat screen, I couldn't get 50 bucks for it, and it cost $1000 new.

When the new product is marketed as supremely better, and even more realer than real, the previous product is going to take a dive.

 

[HighGain510]

Digital products, that are viewed to be inferior to their newer counterparts, are always going to drop in value. Why spend $1800+ on a used, inferior product, when the new, better product is just a few hundred dollars more? As more AxeIIs come into the market, more and more people will be looking to unload their ultras and standards, which is going to mean lower prices.

How much would you pay for a 2nd generation Iphone? No where near what you'd pay for a 4s. I do not think this is the lowest the ultras will get. My guess is that the price will settle in the $1200 range when all is said and done. Digital products don't appreciate in value unless the technology that follows it is viewed inferior. I couldn't pay someone to take this old TV from my house, even though it works great and has a great picture. But it isn't a flat screen, I couldn't get 50 bucks for it, and it cost $1000 new.

When the new product is marketed as supremely better, and even more realer than real, the previous product is going to take a dive.

Haha right we've already been over the generic economics-based example but the analogy you're using is not quite the same. The Ultra is ONE generation behind the II, not 3 generations like the 2nd gen iPhone vs a 4S model, hence it's not an apples to apples comparison. That's like saying what would you pay for an Ultra versus something that is yet to come out 5 years from now, you can't compare as being that "inferior" based a comparison of technology that spans 5 years. The Ultra has been out for a while but the II is the only "new" technology from Fractal since it came out. Again, it's not really a debate about the economics behind the situation but rather asking if something had happened with Fractal (aside from the II coming out or increase in units shipping) that would account for the random sudden price drop on Ultras.

 

[Isan]

I am just gonna be the douche bag here....


IT ISN'T RANDOM!! IT IS ECONOMICS!!

/end douche

The market is FILLED with axefx owners who want to upgrade to the Axe FX II. When they all try to low ball the other people selling Axe FX they thusly lower the price of the used units.

You flood the market and prices drop...

 

[HighGain510]

we've already been over the generic economics-based example

I am just gonna be the douche bag here....


IT ISN'T RANDOM!! IT IS ECONOMICS!!

/end douche

The market is FILLED with axefx owners who want to upgrade to the Axe FX II. When they all try to low ball the other people selling Axe FX they thusly lower the price of the used units.

You flood the market and prices drop...

Yeah again, the whole supply/demand argument is already out as it's a given there are lots of folks trying to ditch their Ultra and grab a II. I asked if there was really anything beyond that but from what I've gathered here there really isn't much, I was wondering if I just had been off the Fractal boards for so long that I missed something important that led to the massive low-priced exodus to the II's but it wasn't, just people trying hard to move their Ultras cheap to grab a II.

 

[Isan]

Ah miss read your last post , thought you were saying that argument was BS...

I am used to arguing with retards on this forum.