Vik Drama: Round 3

[rapterr15]

Before I say anything, care to explain?

Yea all I'm saying is that while Jobs was the CEO of Apple, there was plenty of evidence pointing out the fact that he wasn't exactly a nice, stand-up guy. He was certainly very ambitious, but with that ambition and desire for success came a level of ruthlessness and apathy towards some of his fellow human beings. Even with this information available on the internet, people chose to ignore it, or were simply ignorant, and Apple products continued to sell tremendously well, because they are in fact great products. So basically Jobs treated many of his employees like shit, ended Apple's philanthropic efforts, and had no problem using cheap sweat shops in China to produce his products, but had he made a statement about sexuality it would have crippled him from a business perspective.

My point is that there are plenty of assholes out there who succeed and continue to succeed, but as soon as sexuality enters the fray, it's a whole other ballgame. An asshole is an asshole is an asshole. Does it matter if they don't like gays or if they choose to fire their employees in the elevator as a joke?

 

[noUser01]

Steve Jobs was a giant douche, and Apple products continue to sell like hotcakes. Say you don't like gays and your brand is destroyed, even if you're producing a quality product. Now Vik is clearly a douche and I don't support his statements, but it's a strange world we live in when a ruthless bastard like Jobs is idolized by so many, but if you don't agree with dicks going in men's butts then all hell breaks loose.

I'm not sure exactly what you want to argue here, it just seems like you want to argue something.

Vik said something stupid, now he's getting the backlash for it. That's what happens, that's life. That's reality. What is there to argue about there?

Also, one man's evidence is another man's lie. It's hard to trust second, third, fourth hand reports. Especially when it's about a major company, because anyone famous enough is bound to have rumors or lies spread about them. When it's straight from the source, that's a bit different. Maybe Steve Jobs was a horrible person, but again, what is your point here?

 

[rapterr15]

And yes what Vik said sucks, so if you disagree then don't buy his products. It's that simple. Someone earlier in the thread said statements such as Viks should not be tolerated and should be punishable by death or something extremely rash along those lines because these words lead to "intolerance and violence". That's just as extreme as being anti-gay. Vik didn't say lynch all homosexuals. He merely indicated he doesn't like gays. An immature viewpoint and suicide business-wise, but he had every right to say what he believes. The dude certainly doesn't deserve to be killed or have violence brought forth against him.

 

[Joose]

Yea all I'm saying is that while Jobs was the CEO of Apple, there was plenty of evidence pointing out the fact that he wasn't exactly a nice, stand-up guy. He was certainly very ambitious, but with that ambition and desire for success came a level of ruthlessness and apathy towards some of his fellow human beings. Even with this information available on the internet, people chose to ignore it, or were simply ignorant, and Apple products continued to sell tremendously well, because they are in fact great products. So basically Jobs treated many of his employees like shit, ended Apple's philanthropic efforts, and had no problem using cheap sweat shops in China to produce his products, but had he made a statement about sexuality it would have crippled him from a business perspective.

My point is that there are plenty of assholes out there who succeed and continue to succeed, but as soon as sexuality enters the fray, it's a whole other ballgame. An asshole is an asshole is an asshole. Does it matter if they don't like gays or if they choose to fire their employees in the elevator as a joke?

-I guarantee you own multiple things made in sweat shops.

-I don't recall Jobs ever saying something like "(insert company name)'s VP is gay, no wonder I don't like their products"

-I do see what you're getting at, but it does not work in this particular situation.

 

[noUser01]

And yes what Vik said sucks, so if you disagree then don't buy his products. It's that simple. Someone earlier in the thread said statements such as Viks should not be tolerated and should be punishable by death or something extremely rash along those lines because these words lead to "intolerance and violence". That's just as extreme as being anti-gay. Vik didn't say lynch all homosexuals. He merely indicated he doesn't like gays. An immature viewpoint and suicide business-wise, but he had every right to say what he believes. The dude certainly doesn't deserve to be killed or have violence brought forth against him.

Right, but you and I both know that any time anything happens there will be extremists on both sides. This isn't news. What is news is the incident with Vik, which is why this thread was made. He deserved the backlash, he has the right to say what he wants, anyone else has the right to call him an idiot for doing so.

That's it.

 

[7stg]

I do not support Vik nor other hate groups. To hate someone when they cause no harm to others is wrong.

If gay was straight and straight was gay -

 

[capoeiraesp]

The right to free speech means that you won't go to jail for speaking your mind, however you will still have to face the consequences that follow the things you choose to say.

People seem to forget this a lot.

My old Tai Chi instructor once said to me "Freedom of speech doesn't mean freedom from consequences".
Not exactly super deep words but so to the point.

 

[darren]

Jobs was an uncompromising asshole, but last I checked, he never behaved in a discriminatory manner against entire groups of people. Except maybe idiots. He was definitely intolerant of idiots.

 

[Dcm81]

Steve Jobs was a giant douche, and Apple products continue to sell like hotcakes. Say you don't like gays and your brand is destroyed, even if you're producing a quality product. Now Vik is clearly a douche and I don't support his statements, but it's a strange world we live in when a ruthless bastard like Jobs is idolized by so many, but if you don't agree with dicks going in men's butts then all hell breaks loose.

I don't really think you can compare the 2. There are plenty of assholes running around, even more so in the ranks of management in huge corporations. Vik was acting like an asshole already in recent time and it's not really a big deal.
Where he crossed the line from just being a regular asshole is his blatant and public disgust of gay people. Jobs might have been a douche but I never heard him slam gays, blacks, jews, muslims or any other specific group so the comparison isn't really usable in this case.

 

[noUser01]

At the end of the day, there is a massive difference between someone admitting to being homophobic, and someone who owns a large corporation that is subject to scrutiny and rumors having very high standards of work.

And I bet you Jobs didn't start hating anyone he fired simply because of something they couldn't change about themselves.

 

[morethan6]

Fvck me, how did Steve Jobs get in here? There's always someone trying to argue the other side of any point, even when the point is as simple as:

"He said something I personally disagree with. Therefore I will not endorse his behaviour or products."

That, as a sentiment, can literally not be incorrect or wrong. And it's what everyone is basically saying. I echo it.

Now can we all move on, forget about this douchebag and go and work out which other more awesome and non-actively-prejudiced luthier we would like to give our money to?

Awesome

 

[xCaptainx]

Absolutely baffling and actually infuriating that people are trying to play off homophobia as no big deal and a personal choice.

 

[Fringe]

Seems like I'm the worst person Vik can imagine...I got myself a Vik inspired build and even let my very good and gay friend touch it

I knew he's a douche by his actions during the last months, but this really takes the word douche to another level...
I never was so happy to have a Vik style guitar NOT built by him...

 

[Enselmis]

Steve Jobs was a giant douche, and Apple products continue to sell like hotcakes. Say you don't like gays and your brand is destroyed, even if you're producing a quality product. Now Vik is clearly a douche and I don't support his statements, but it's a strange world we live in when a ruthless bastard like Jobs is idolized by so many, but if you don't agree with dicks going in men's butts then all hell breaks loose.

Steve Jobs did a better job of hiding it from anybody who wasn't interested in digging. When you bought a mac, Steve Jobs didn't personally source each piece and assemble the damn thing before shipping it to you. Hell, I'm sure if he had been caught on video setting rainbow flags on fire and spewing intolerant commentary then the hate would have flown freely as well.

That basketball team owner from the other day is an accurate picture of what happens when the intolerance of influential people is exposed.

 

[Joose]

I have been banned from posting to the ViK Guitars page.

I made one comment. Fvcker has no issue with letting his supporters post though. What a tool. Now the page is just full of people feeling sorry for him because he's "being bullied".

Edit: Also, he deleted his original post and everything else associated with it. Little does he know, about the screenshots people have...

Whatever. Dude's an asshole and not exactly great when it comes to customer service anyway.

 

[noUser01]

I have been banned from posting to the ViK Guitars page.

I made one comment. Fvcker has no issue with letting his supporters post though. What a tool. Now the page is just full of people feeling sorry for him because he's "being bullied".

Edit: Also, he deleted his original post and everything else associated with it. Little does he know, about the screenshots people have...

Whatever. Dude's an asshole and not exactly great when it comes to customer service anyway.

Banning people from his page, deleting comments that aren't 100% behind him? A complete douchebag?

Lucas Mann 2.0

 

[Orandje]

I want to buy/build a rip-off of the Duality in rainbow colors that is converted to headless, because fvck Vik

I'm in! But make it a swirl job. Or that Ibanez Petrucci '90s paint work.

 

[Jzbass25]

mod edit: can we just take a second to stay on topic

 

[noUser01]

I'm in! But make it a swirl job. Or that Ibanez Petrucci '90s paint work.

Rainbow unicorn swirl or bust.

 

[jonajon91]

Making the most of a dark situation here, but some of the facebook comments are comedy gold. Vik has really messed up this time.