What are some cliches in guitar dominated music that you can't stand?

[karjim]

1) Two gay kids screaming at same time in a djent band...why? The first one's too bad ? Fire him dam it and get a good one !! not two goats please
2) THALL ... fuck you that doesn't exist in any language...Could you please use "Brutal" "Awesome" "Huge" "I love it" but please stop that stupid expression
So trendy I know but stop

 

[Nykur_Myrkvi]

1) Two gay kids screaming at same time in a djent band...why? The first one's too bad ? Fire him dam it and get a good one !! not two goats please

Firstly, possibly just beating a dead horse but it's a dead horse that deserves to be beaten, are people really not over saying everything they don't like is "gay"? Or are you tired of homosexuality in djent, mostly when the number of gays in a band is over one?

If you're just talking about dual vocalists, then why not?

I love some bands with more than one vocalist because it tends to open up possibilities that wouldn't be possible with one. Also if the two have very different styles it can be really really cool.

See:

Sikth
Fellsilent
The Arusha Accord
Unexpect
Mastodon (I know they're not only vocalists but they split it pretty evenly)

 

[tedtan]

I hate as a whole it seems guitar oriented musicians thrive on making negative comments. I have really been trying to tone it down personally since I saw this documentary thing on comedians and how they feel about negativity in there scene. It helped me realize Whether i like the music, their image, or how they conduct themselves sometimes, all musicians that participate in guitar dominated music work hard. They go through the same issues with writers block, They logged hundreds of thousands of hours practicing their instrument and songwriting skills.

Even the ones with less practice, and not so amazing songwriting At least they try. Also there is no real reason to be mad someone who cant play as well as you think they should owning nice gear. Either they worked hard for it, Or they were fortunate enough to have parents that worked hard enough to provide neat things for their kids.

And on the fact people saying writing certain music is easy, mostly the ones that boast about that they are in super prog ultra tech band. You need to realize just because you think that writing and playing Music like emmure is easy doesn't necessarily mean that the people that wrote it are dumb and shouldnt play guitar, and the are there to ruin your scene. There are the terrible ones that havent quite found there footing for sure, But let them work at it before you immediately shit on them.

TLR Cheer up and be glad metal music is a thing. And this negative thread bums me out.

(I know its a silly idea to subject myself to things that bum me out)

This. So much so that I'm quoting it so everyone can read it again.

 

[Narrillnezzurh]

Food for thought: Go to any gig that has a full-time session musician guitar player. 95% of their gear is standard fare. I don't know a good, professional guitar player here in Toronto that uses a boutique, high end solidbody guitar.

That's very interesting, but why is that the case? If ever there was a musician that both deserved and could make use of high-end gear, it would be a competent session musician.

What exactly do you mean by "standard fare"?

I hate as a whole it seems guitar oriented musicians thrive on making negative comments.

Some more food for thought: Metal has outlasted a significant number of other contemporary trends in music without any noticeable lack of progress. At some point we have to ask ourselves, why is metal so stubborn in the face of ever-changing tastes?

I doubt the answer is the innate negativity of the metal community, but it's something worth thinking about

 

[jimwratt]

This. So much so that I'm quoting it so everyone can read it again.

I agree. One thing I will say is that there is some finance bound up in all of that. Namely that there is SO little money to go around in our crumby corner of the music industry that our favorite acts rarely if ever have a financial profile on par with their artistic contributions. When we see other acts that are, at least seemingly, more lucrative, we feel almost insulted vicariously. Its compounded when it comes to other genres. In my mind, Allan Holdsworth should have more money than Lil Wayne; Tosin Abasi deserves to have T.I's money. It's hard to see people, who are objectively not as skilled as musicians, being more financially successful than those we feel are more entitled to that compensation. I think not recognizing that makes us turn negative in dealing with one another. It's like crabs in a barrel.

 

[Konfyouzd]

I get that a lot too. What's tough about it for me is that I really love Jimi's music and he is definitely a major influence on me as a guitarist...but so is Steve Vai, Allan Holdsworth, Dimebag Darrell, Shawn Lane, Nile Rogers, Charlie Singleton, Jesse Johnson, Guthrie Govan, Akira Takasaki, Eddie Hazel, EVH, Ramon Ortiz, Greg Howe, etc. Nobody ever brings those guys up though. People really get into some scratch and sniff stuff sometimes. They're like "Hey its a black dude with a guitar, he must sound like Jimi Hendrix. Wait, he has dreads, BOB MARLEY! Can you sell me some weed?"

On the flip side, wouldn't it be cool if in 10 years, people were like "Hey, it's a black dude with a guitar. Must be Tosin Abasi."

I have dreads and play a white RG8. Tosin comments, you say?

Ppl started making that comparison as soon as he gained a little fame and I entered the chat room here.

We play nothing alike. Look nothing alike.

Some ppl are just easily amused.

 

[tedtan]

I agree. One thing I will say is that there is some finance bound up in all of that. Namely that there is SO little money to go around in our crumby corner of the music industry that our favorite acts rarely if ever have a financial profile on par with their artistic contributions. When we see other acts that are, at least seemingly, more lucrative, we feel almost insulted vicariously. Its compounded when it comes to other genres. In my mind, Allan Holdsworth should have more money than Lil Wayne; Tosin Abasi deserves to have T.I's money. It's hard to see people, who are objectively not as skilled as musicians, being more financially successful than those we feel are more entitled to that compensation. I think not recognizing that makes us turn negative in dealing with one another. It's like crabs in a barrel.

I understand completely. Just realize that capitalism isn't based on talent, its based on providing something people will pay for and most people seem willing to pay for that type of stuff.

 

[blaaargh]

If you're just talking about dual vocalists, then why not?

I love some bands with more than one vocalist because it tends to open up possibilities that wouldn't be possible with one. Also if the two have very different styles it can be really really cool.

See:

Sikth
Fellsilent
The Arusha Accord
Unexpect
Mastodon (I know they're not only vocalists but they split it pretty evenly)

I actually kinda agree with dude buddy on bands with two vocalists who both sound exactly the same. I'm looking at you, Vildjthallta. It's completely fucking pointless and adds nothing to the band's performance. Bands like SikTh and Rwake can pull it off cause their vocalists have very different styles, and when it's two dudes who also play instruments, it makes sense as well, cus one dude might not be able to play and yell at the same time for an entire set. But if they're not doing anything but yelling, and you can't distinguish one yeller from another, then I'd say your band needs a strong dose of getdafuckouttahere.

 

[DarkWolfXV]

[rant=What Makes Me Angry]
--Shitty deathcore singers. BMTH, Asking Alexandria, Behemoth, and all the other bands that give metal vocals a bad name.
[/rant]

Are you kidding me? Are you comparing stuff like Asking Alexandria and Behemoth? Behemoth is not deathcore, and Nergals voice is powerful and you can hear words quite clearly, plus actually Nergal is quite praised so i dont know how would he give metal a bad name.

 

[flint757]

I understand completely. Just realize that capitalism isn't based on talent, its based on providing something people will pay for and most people seem willing to pay for that type of stuff.

Kind of off topic, but that is why I find it hilarious when politicians say that poor people are lazy. Hard work and a good ethic guarantee very little in life. Luck and demand determine everything.

 

[Tyler]

ambient sound to non stop breakdown with some notes thrown in for the heck of it.

 

[tedtan]

Kind of off topic, but that is why I find it hilarious when politicians say that poor people are lazy. Hard work and a good ethic guarantee very little in life. Luck and demand determine everything.

That, along with who you know, goes a LONG way towards acheiving "success" in life and career (regardless of the career).

 

[Konfyouzd]

I understand completely. Just realize that capitalism isn't based on talent, its based on providing something people will pay for and most people seem willing to pay for anything.

Fix'd

 

[AngstRiddenDreams]

1) Two gay kids screaming at same time in a djent band...why? The first one's too bad ? Fire him dam it and get a good one !! not two goats please
2) THALL ... fuck you that doesn't exist in any language...Could you please use "Brutal" "Awesome" "Huge" "I love it" but please stop that stupid expression
So trendy I know but stop

This guy hates Vildhjarta ^ Coulda just came out it said it man,

 

[InfinityCollision]

Some more food for thought: Metal has outlasted a significant number of other contemporary trends in music without any noticeable lack of progress. At some point we have to ask ourselves, why is metal so stubborn in the face of ever-changing tastes?

I'd argue that physics and instrument construction contribute at least as much as the people involved with the genre. Guitars play in an approximation of equal temperament, which is an approximation of the harmonic series... And then you throw a ton of distortion on top of it. This really limits what you can do in a vertical, harmonic sense without compromising the concept of "metal" or making your ears bleed. There's still room for growth in a more horizontal sense (song structure), but the limitations of the genre mean that those who would push those boundaries are less likely to explore it as a means of creative expression as opposed to incorporating elements of it into less limiting genres.

 

[tedtan]

Fix'd

Then where're my riches for my tunes?!?!?!

 

[Narrillnezzurh]

I'd argue that physics and instrument construction contribute at least as much as the people involved with the genre. Guitars play in an approximation of equal temperament, which is an approximation of the harmonic series... And then you throw a ton of distortion on top of it. This really limits what you can do in a vertical, harmonic sense without compromising the concept of "metal" or making your ears bleed. There's still room for growth in a more horizontal sense (song structure), but the limitations of the genre mean that those who would push those boundaries are less likely to explore it as a means of creative expression as opposed to incorporating elements of it into less limiting genres.

I don't know if you understood me correctly. I'm saying that metal has managed not only to survive without mainstream support, but to maintain forward progress while doing so. I'm not saying metal is resistant to change, quite the opposite.

And guitars don't play in an approximation of equal temperament, they play in equal temperament. It's an approximation in the sense that intonation will never be perfect due to physical limitations, but no instrument is capable of perfect intonation. In fact, I'd actually argue that equal temperament is more conducive to harmonic growth than non-equal temperaments, given that you can expand in any direction without significantly exacerbating the inaccuracies inherent to the temperament. The same cannot be said for just intonation or Pythagorean tuning.

 

[spawnofthesith]

People complaining about bass drops must not have a sub in their car

 

[InfinityCollision]

I don't know if you understood me correctly. I'm saying that metal has managed not only to survive without mainstream support, but to maintain forward progress while doing so. I'm not saying metal is resistant to change, quite the opposite.

I see. Different perspectives, I suppose. There have been developments over the years, but I feel that the most significant ones have been largely timbral/textural (different vocal styles etc) and that even that has been noticeably lacking in recent years.

And guitars don't play in an approximation of equal temperament, they play in equal temperament. It's an approximation in the sense that intonation will never be perfect due to physical limitations,

Bingo. I wouldn't say "never" though - we're getting closer. FGN's curved frets come to mind.

but no instrument is capable of perfect intonation.

Fretless stringed instruments and the entire woodwind family come to mind.

In fact, I'd actually argue that equal temperament is more conducive to harmonic growth than non-equal temperaments, given that you can expand in any direction without significantly exacerbating the inaccuracies inherent to the temperament. The same cannot be said for just intonation or Pythagorean tuning.

I don't recall saying anything in regards to alternative temperaments, only the limitations of 12-TET within the context of metal. My preference, if anything, would be "seasoned" 12-TET, ie an equal-temperament backbone but with sufficient flexibility to bring notes into just-intonation tuning relative to any other given pitch as needed. Not really practical for fretted guitar, but it's quite lovely in a classical band or orchestra context. Fretless guitars can pull it off if you've got the ear for it, but in most cases it would be impractical due to fretted counterparts or a keyboard player.

 

[tedtan]

Fretless stringed instruments...

Q: What is a minor second interval?

A: Two fretless stringed instruments playing "in unison".