What sounds tighter? 4x12, 2x12 or 1x2?

[Quitty]

I wasn't giving advise, Quitty, just pointing out the fact that guitar cab sizes are not designed according to acoustic principles. They are based, some more closely than others, on the size Jim Marshall arbitrarily chose when Eric Clapton and Jimi Hendrix asked him to build 4x12 speaker cabinets for them back in the 1960s.

Those same 4x12 cabs are what we have heard for over 40 years, and what we are still accustomed to hearing, when we hear rock and metal with distorted electric guitar.

...And none of them are square. Not without extensive internal damping, anyway.

Saying that guitar speakers are not FRFR speakers, while perfectly true, does not mean we can ignore what makes them work right. We're aiming for a different effect, not ignoring the effects altogether.

Standing waves are bad, period. For any speaker.

 

[tedtan]

^ Quitty

Off the top of my head, check out Diezel (75cm x 75cm), Carvin Legacy and others (30" x 30") and old PRS cabs (29" x 29"). Also Engl, while not perfectly square, is close enough to it at 74cm x 75cm that it won't affect standing waves much, if at all.

Also, I'm not suggesting one intentionally design standing waves into a cab as a feature (unless you're trying to recreate an existing cab), just that we are accustomed to hearing guitar cabs that do, in fact, have standing wave issues, and don't object to the sound produced by these cabs.

 

[Suitable]

How do I change the title? I will be using Celestion V30's and G12K100's in an X pattern...

My original plan form was a take off of a Mills Acoustics Afterburner 412b cab which are 32" x 32" x 14.75". That's where I got the square planform from. I'm looking at changing that now to maybe a Diezel V412F planform. I'll thinking of changing my plan so I do the dadoes joints for the front baffle and front load them but I'm going to try this gasket idea out and screw the corners 40mm in then adverage out the spacing to every 100mm which should give me a really tight seal... I can alway change it to rear loaded then and if Ilike its front loaded sound i can always take the gasket off later and glue the back on... leaves me with options... Would it be better to divide the inernals in 2 with a board making ir like it 2 sealed 2x12's or even quarter it so it like 4 1x12s so each speaker has its own room to breath (so to speak) ???

Also do you all think it'll be best to try and replicate the Diezel cab sizing or another brands? There all different sizes, but been hearing a lot about the tighness of the Diezels 412...

Cheers heaps for all of your help and inputs!!!

 

[tedtan]

I'm looking at changing that now to maybe a Diezel V412F planform.

Note that Diezel cabs are available in front and rear loaded versions. The people (including Scattered Messiah above) who mention them being tight are usually referring to the front loaded version.

I'm going to try this gasket idea out and screw the corners 40mm in then adverage out the spacing to every 100mm which should give me a really tight seal... I can alway change it to rear loaded then and if Ilike its front loaded sound i can always take the gasket off later and glue the back on... leaves me with options...

While loading them from the front will change the sound a bit compared to rear loading, the biggest part of the front loaded cabs sound is the fact that the rear panel is finger jointed and glued into the cab. This makes it flex less, resulting in greater compression on the speakers, and the tighter sound. Even with the gasket to prevent air escape, the rear panel will not be as rigid as if it were glued in, thus it will flex more and change the sound a bit.

Having said that, there is nothing wrong with rear loaded cabs. In fact, most of them are constructed this way and they sound great. They just don't sound as tight as a front loaded cab to me.

Would it be better to divide the inernals in 2 with a board making ir like it 2 sealed 2x12's or even quarter it so it like 4 1x12s so each speaker has its own room to breath (so to speak) ???

Sorry, I don't have any experience with this to be able to help. All I can say is that some cabs are divided and some are not.

 

[Suitable]

I can understand that a piece of 18mm thick ply would flex copared to finger jointing and gluing it on, a normal rear loaded cab has maybe only 5 screws down each edge of the rear panel, i can see how that will flex. But change that 18mm thick ply to 40mm thick solid hardwood and put maybe 10 screws down each edge, i can't see how it would move at all or vibrate. Ill look into the diezel cab designs some more to see if there is any difference in size between the 2 (FL & RL). Ill make the whole lot out of 30mm thick and only make the back panel 40mm.

Has anyone opened their diezel cab and had a look inside? Just want to know if there is any blocking off between speakers.

Thanks all!!!

 

[yellow]

idk man, a 1x12 is pretty tight

 

[Hollowway]

Look at the Fryette stuff. They're designed to be uber tight. I have a 4x12 fat bottom and can vouch for its tightness. It's a front loaded cab as well.

 

[Suitable]

Just found out the specs for the diezel v412f 745 x 745 x 365mm. square again. The fryette has 1cm difference in height to width. Hmmm don't know what to do???

 

[Suitable]

Is there any chance someone can please have a look inside there diezel or fryette 412 cab and tell me what you see in there bacing/baffle wise?

Your help is greatly appriciated!!!

 

[Suitable]

idk man, a 1x12 is pretty tight

I am thinking of quartering the cab so its like 4 x 1x12's. I'm not sure if its been done before or if its worth doing yet though as the speakers I'm using have a sensitivity db of 99db and 100db so they won't hurt each other at all...

 

[PodHdBean]

6x12
ftw

 

[Suitable]

6x12
ftw

Yeah maybe your right.? But I've got 8 12" speakers so what do Ido with the other 2?