Wintersun's Groundhog's Day Thread

[Neon_Knight_]

Assuming that you are using a seperate dac all the CD player will do is literally read 1s and 0s off the disc and then send that information to it. Only difference will be maybe cheaper cd players will have a harder time reading scratched up cds but if youre going to split hairs that much then I would assume your collection is in immaculate condition.

If you're going to oversimplify it that much, then all guitar pickups sound the same because all they do is pick up string vibrations and send them to the amp.

Why wouldn't my collection be in immaculate condition? It's pretty effortless to take a tiny bit of care when transferring CDs between their case and a CD player.

The difference between vinyl and cds is slight, if you are pairing a set of speakers to the medium of choice then you are delving deep into mintuae that I'm sure 999/1000 people wouldnt be able to pass a blind test on. There'll be a difference, but wheather one is massively subjectively better or worse is another story altogether, especially as you go through different decades and genres of mixes.

If you are not choosing a set of speakers to compliment your amp + medium of choice (CD player / turnable / streamer) then how are you choosing them?

 

[Ataraxia2320]

If you're going to oversimplify it that much, then all guitar pickups sound the same because all they do is pick up string vibrations and send them to the amp.

Why wouldn't my collection be in immaculate condition? It's pretty effortless to take a tiny bit of care when transferring CDs between their case and a CD player.


If you are not choosing a set of speakers to compliment your amp + medium of choice (CD player / turnable / streamer) then how are you choosing them?

I think you misunderstood me. I wasnt trying to make a slight saying your cds wouldnt be in immaculate condition. My point was that you care so much your cd collection would be in immaculate condition and your going to have a seperate amp and dac so therefore the player part of your setup is not going to matter.

I choose my speakers like most audio engineers do: get the best speakers possble and the cleanest A-D and D-A converters. Not that any of this matters without a properly treated room of course which is half the battle in itself.

And of course the main thing is that I have a sauna in the room next door! We all know that there's nothing to be done audio wise without one!

 

[nightsprinter]

Booooo I wanted to see a heated argument about compact disc care

 

[Neon_Knight_]

I think you misunderstood me. I wasnt trying to make a slight saying your cds wouldnt be in immaculate condition. My point was that you care so much your cd collection would be in immaculate condition and your going to have a seperate amp and dac so therefore the player part of your setup is not going to matter.

Just like all other audio equipment, DACs vary massively in quality. A separate DAC will only be an improvement over a CD player's inbuilt DAC if it's superior - not simply because it's an extra seaprate piece of equipment added to the system. The DAC in a CD player that costs ££££s will generally be much better than a separate DAC that costs £££s, so to get an improvement you'd need to buy a DAC that costs ££££s not £££s.
Yes, there are DACs available that would be an unpgrade on the one in my CD player. There are also CD players out there that would have a better inbuilt DAC and be a superior CD transport. I haven't gone down either route to upgrade my system because I can't justify the expense to myself currently. There's plenty of room for improvement in every part of my system, but I own what I found to be the best available to me within a certain budget.

I know it has become more and more common for people to use a relatively low-end CD player as a "CD transport", with a higher end DAC + amp + speakers. Just because some people have decided to go down that route doesn't mean it's best. If I was to use a separate DAC, I would still want the CD transport to be of equivalent quality to the rest of my system.
I'm going to go back to the guitar pickups analogy again. Plenty of people think pickups don't matter, so use low-end stock pickups with higher end amps and pedals. 99% of people who have used lots of different pickups through lots of different amps and with lots of different pedals will agree that the pickups do make a difference.
Rubbish in = rubbish out.

I choose my speakers like most audio engineers do: get the best speakers possble and the cleanest A-D and D-A converters. Not that any of this matters without a properly treated room of course which is half the battle in itself.

At any given price point (including when money is no object), the what the "best" speakers are is subjective. IME it's very normal for someone to trial equipment together in the actual room that it will be used in, rather than buying something on the assumption that it's the best option. Home trial periods are commonplace for this reason.

And of course the main thing is that I have a sauna in the room next door! We all know that there's nothing to be done audio wise without one!

 

[GunpointMetal]

Are we going to get into audiophile jokes? I love audiophile jokes. Like spending $8k on a DAC to connect to a $15k sound system that's hooked up in a room with hardwood floors and bare walls to pretend it "sounds better".

 

[Ataraxia2320]

Most audiophile stuff is the definition of EXTREME limiting returns. Not to mention spending the majority of money on the wrong things.

That being said after listening to music in a god tier room with god tier gear you'll be forever chasing the dragon.

 

[nightsprinter]

Does anyone know if this will be released on Organette Roll?

 

[Ataraxia2320]

Audio so warm it could heat my house!

Does anyone know if this will be released on Organette Roll

 

[GunpointMetal]

Most audiophile stuff is the definition of EXTREME limiting returns. Not to mention spending the majority of money on the wrong things.

That being said after listening to music in a god tier room with god tier gear you'll be forever chasing the dragon.

Oh yeah, I've just never met a real person who didn't put all the money into the gear instead of the room. A great room plus a great speaker system is amazing. A great room will get you a lot further than a great speaker system, though. I haven't had both in one space outside of a trade show or a high-end recording studio. And even the studio still probably didn't spend more than $10k on the monitors, but probably double that on the room.

 

[mehegama]

Oh yeah, I've just never met a real person who didn't put all the money into the gear instead of the room. A great room plus a great speaker system is amazing. A great room will get you a lot further than a great speaker system, though. I haven't had both in one space outside of a trade show or a high-end recording studio. And even the studio still probably didn't spend more than $10k on the monitors, but probably double that on the room.

Serious question: who can have an "audiophile" room and play loud music, in today's flats and cities, without having their neighbors breaking down the door and beating them senselessly? Unless you live in a relatively remote area on a detached home. 99% of people use headphones these days

 

[p0ke]

Haha, Time II won't be coming this Friday (at least not for me)

It's not Jari's fault this time though - I also pre-ordered Opeth's new album at the same time, so now the record store is waiting to ship both at the same time. Oh well, doesn't matter, it's not like I intend to use the actual disc anyway.

 

[Metropolis]

Haha, Time II won't be coming this Friday (at least not for me)

It's not Jari's fault this time though - I also pre-ordered Opeth's new album at the same time, so now the record store is waiting to ship both at the same time. Oh well, doesn't matter, it's not like I intend to use the actual disc anyway.

Yeah... somehow my shirt/vinyl/cd package is still registered at Tampere. State of shipment has been same since last friday.

One With The Shadows was playing at Radio Rock a moment ago, but I only heard the last chorus. Also Jari was in the studio.

E: Just when I was writing state of shipment have changed, so it's coming... tomorrow or friday.

 

[Metropolis]

What's this? It can't be...

 

[SalsaWood]

I'm not gonna eat my words because it was an entire shit show and a half, but I'm happy you guys are getting this record finally.

 

[sakeido]

Just like all other audio equipment, DACs vary massively in quality. A separate DAC will only be an improvement over a CD player's inbuilt DAC if it's superior - not simply because it's an extra seaprate piece of equipment added to the system. The DAC in a CD player that costs ££££s will generally be much better than a separate DAC that costs £££s, so to get an improvement you'd need to buy a DAC that costs ££££s not £££s.
Yes, there are DACs available that would be an unpgrade on the one in my CD player. There are also CD players out there that would have a better inbuilt DAC and be a superior CD transport. I haven't gone down either route to upgrade my system because I can't justify the expense to myself currently. There's plenty of room for improvement in every part of my system, but I own what I found to be the best available to me within a certain budget.

I know it has become more and more common for people to use a relatively low-end CD player as a "CD transport", with a higher end DAC + amp + speakers. Just because some people have decided to go down that route doesn't mean it's best. If I was to use a separate DAC, I would still want the CD transport to be of equivalent quality to the rest of my system.
I'm going to go back to the guitar pickups analogy again. Plenty of people think pickups don't matter, so use low-end stock pickups with higher end amps and pedals. 99% of people who have used lots of different pickups through lots of different amps and with lots of different pedals will agree that the pickups do make a difference.
Rubbish in = rubbish out.


At any given price point (including when money is no object), the what the "best" speakers are is subjective. IME it's very normal for someone to trial equipment together in the actual room that it will be used in, rather than buying something on the assumption that it's the best option. Home trial periods are commonplace for this reason.


View attachment 148754

All this audiophoolery is starting to really bug me. The finest DACs in the world, with objectively proven, 100% accurate sound with distortion levels almost 15dB below the human threshold of hearing, can be had for like $150. Expensive DACs actually tend to be bad, not good, they are selling a look and a name and no attention at all is paid to actual performance.

Your CD transport absolutely does not matter. It's digital, FFS. If you think otherwise, you are simply wrong.

The guitar pickup analogy is wildly off base and never worked, don't do that again

 

[nightsprinter]

My 8-Track Cartridge exclusive edition is clearing customs finally!

 

[TheShreddinHand]

I’m just glad Jari posted a video the other day teaching me how to download files, unzip them, and back them up so that I don’t miss out on the epicness of his package!!

 

[Metropolis]

Also download link for the TIME PACKAGE dropped into my email, nice.

Time II is really well thought and epic composition where every song flows into next one beatifully. I think at the third listen it starts to open up what it's all about, for me at least. One With The Shadows and Silver Leaves might be my favourites so far.

 

[mehegama]

Did we wait more than a decade to listen to these cardboard sample druns (especially the combination of snare and kicks) and some synths buried under other synths in a chaotic layering???