Reamping with or without reamp box

[mindwalker]

Hey guys,

I've always heard that you need a reamp box to do reamping. These boxes are a bit on the exensive side (Radial Engineering at the top of the league, Palmer Daccapo on the cheaper side).

But do you even need one of these ?

Yesterday I tried one of Ola Englund's DI tracks from the mixing competition he had running a few ago, and reamped it with my RME Babyface and Blackstar HT-5R using a simple XLR-Jack cable.
I simply plugged the XLR balanced female into the Babyface's lineout and then the other end of the cable (1/4" jack unbalanced) to the guitar input. Go to reaper, hit play and then started with the faders in the Babyface really low and slowly brought up the volume until I started hearing the amp distorting in an unnatural way.. I lowered the fader a bit until it was smooth and there it is..
I have to say that the volume was low on this one (a little under 9:00) and I had the reverb on (doooh) so it sounds perhaps a bit loose. Not too much bass either but this was running direct. DI -> amp.. that's it, no pedals have been used.



Since I don't actually have a reamping box I can't tell how different or better it will sound with a reamp box but perhaps someone can chime in ? Is there a drastic difference ?
And can this method of simply using a cable damage something ? It's a low impedance signal flowing into an input that expects a high impedance signal, using a cable that's probably heavier duty (or meant to carry stronger signals) than a guitar cable (?).

 

[Quitty]

No damage.

All i can think of is that a line level signal will be hotter and appear to be brighter than an unbalanced guitar one - you'd need a reamp box (or a decent DI) to fix that.
Also, maybe a ground loop? A ground lift can be found on a DI as well.

Unless i'm missing out on something, a 'reamp box' is a fancy, exorbitantly priced DI.
A little google search confirms this, BTW.

 

[mindwalker]

nice to hear

yeah there might be a ground loop specially if my laptop is plugged into the outlet.. as for noise quality I can't really compare without an actual reamp box but as you say, it's a bit pricey and unless it's going to work dramatically well, probably not worth the money if you're just a hobbyist.

you're right, I googled the subject a bit but found all kinds of different opinions.. some say it sounds ass, some say it doesn't.. some say a DI can be used as a re-amp box... I guess in the end it depends on your system but well.. as long as there's no damage that's all I want! Wouldn't want to accidentally blow up my amp by giving it too strong a DI signal by accident

 

[Quitty]

nice to hear

yeah there might be a ground loop specially if my laptop is plugged into the outlet.. as for noise quality I can't really compare without an actual reamp box but as you say, it's a bit pricey and unless it's going to work dramatically well, probably not worth the money if you're just a hobbyist.

you're right, I googled the subject a bit but found all kinds of different opinions.. some say it sounds ass, some say it doesn't.. some say a DI can be used as a re-amp box... I guess in the end it depends on your system but well.. as long as there's no damage that's all I want! Wouldn't want to accidentally blow up my amp by giving it too strong a DI signal by accident

You'll be hard pressed to blow your amp via the input. Worst you can do is overdrive the input to death and blow a resistor, which is a 2 cent fix.

Give it a go. I'll wager it works.

 

[meambobbo]

lmao, my method of re-amping has been far cruder, although I don't really resort to it much. I don't have an interface with line outs, only 2 monitor outs, which are connected to my monitors. To re-amp, I unplug the left monitor out, and I send the DI out the left monitor out to my Pod. The return feed comes in via SPDIF. I only enable the right SPDIF signal in my DAW, and make sure I pan any tracks that are playing back go full right, so I'm not creating any kind of feedback loop or sending drums to the Pod, etc.

 

[exclamation-mark]

You won't damage anything by running a low impedance output into a high impedance input (except you may gain roughly 4% more volume). I personally wouldn't bother with a re-amp box - IMO there's a ton of problems with most of them, and they cost a freakin' ton. As stated, they're pretty much a glorified DI Box. Some things to consider...

Your guitar can easily swing greater voltages than your audio interfaces can produce - most re-amp boxes are passive, which means this problem will usually stay, unless they have a step up transformer (though it can eliminated by not strumming your guitar like a psychopath). Not usually a problem in high gain applications.

To answer your original question of the low vs high impedance thing, consider this. The DC resistance (or 'impedance) of an audio system actually only affects the gain in small amounts. Audio systems usually use what is known as an impedance bridge to transfer maximum amounts of signal. The basic formula to figure out the % of signal actually transferred to your source is: load impedance/(load impedance + source impedance).

Your average guitar pickup has a source impedance of roughly 40k, and the load/input impedance of your amplifier is usually 1M(illion). The source impedance of a line level output is in the range of about 100 Ohms. There's literally a 4-5% difference in gain between them - utterly insignificant. However, the tone may be slightly brighter depending on how much cable you're running, hence why many re-amp boxes contain an impedance out control. Technically, it shouldn't really be needed, as any good DI box should capture the interactions the pickups have with the cable capacitance and amplifier front end.

IMO the most important function is probably the fact that it converts a balanced signal into an unbalanced one, and can do so without creating a ground loop. AKA a D.I BOX

 

[TheProgWay]

Apologies for bumping an older thread, but OP: Have you found tried to use the headphones out instead of line out? If so, has that made a difference?

 

[mindwalker]

Hey!

The thread isn't that old me thinks
anyway I haven't tried using the headphones for reamping.. reason being that I would need a different cable (stereo 1/4" trs to 2 unbalanced 1/4" trs) and I don't have that one.

I haven't messed up with this stuff so much after I recorded the video earlier but what I still need to do is to record myself playing something straight into the amp and record that with a mic. Then I need to play and record the same stuff as close as possible but with the Hi-Z input of the babyface and try to reamp that and record with the mic and compare them both to see how close they sound.
However in doing so, there's 2 distinct variables at play.. first I'm di'ing without a proper DI box (some people say the Hi-Z input of sound cards is good but not as good as a proper DI ?). Then I'm reamping without a reamp box
Anyway if they both come out sounding pretty similar then I'm happy about it... I'm not recording professionally so if I can't tell the difference with my equipment then that's good enough for me already and I guess good enough for most people unless you're a sound engineer in a studio trying to record an album.

I think the hardest part will be setting the output of the lineout for re-amping to be as close as if the guitar itself would be plugged straight in.. doing so by ear will always be a little different. Likewise, when DI'ing the guitar I might be having a different level also there for the DI input as opposed to plugging straight into the amp.

 

[Sephael]

I go headphone out into a buffered pedal and have no problems.