Scallops and tuning

[Winspear]

So I've never tried scallops. I'm going to make myself a scalloped board to change that, and I am excited to try it. However, right now I'm sceptical about the intonation thing.

I have looked through all my guitars, and only on the ones with the smallest fretwire, and only on the frets closest to the nut (so the widest), does the string even come close to touching the fretboard. I am heavy handed, but I have to try really hard to get the string to touch the board. If I was pushing that far for any reason, the chord is already way out of tune. Sure a scallop would let you push further, but...really? If anyone is that heavy handed, pitch must already be an issue for them. And on the upper frets where scallops are more common? No - I can't really get the string to touch the board at all.

So what gives?

 

[MaxOfMetal]

It's pretty much a non issue, unless you're the type of player that really digs in on bends and vibrato or absolutely hammers the heck out of the board with legato/tapping.

I have a scalloped boarded RG7620 and I don't really notice any difference unless I play a particular way.

You could always go "scalloped lite" and throw some Dunlop 6000s on there.

 

[USMarine75]

I only have guitars with scallops on the last 4 frets. Chording obviously inst an issue... and if you're pressing that hard on strings that it would be, then you're probably already having technique issues anyways.

 

[Humbuck]

Why not try a guitar with a scalloped board first? That will pretty much tell you if they are a non-issue or are going to drive you nuts.

Personally, they don't bother me at all... don't really even notice it while playing, although I have not tried a guitar with a full scalloped board...only the upper half.

 

[angl2k]

I have a fully scalloped guitar and I had to adjust my chording a bit. Was pressing down too hard on them making them go out of tune. Took about a day to get adjusted to it.

Biggest benefit was bending, as I was always touching the fretboard with my fingers when bending. Scalloping makes it smoother.

 

[Avedas]

It's pretty much a non issue, unless you're the type of player that really digs in on bends and vibrato or absolutely hammers the heck out of the board with legato/tapping.

I have a scalloped boarded RG7620 and I don't really notice any difference unless I play a particular way.

You could always go "scalloped lite" and throw some Dunlop 6000s on there.

I'm kinda curious why scalloping became a thing when you could just put tall frets on an instrument.

 

[MaxOfMetal]

I'm kinda curious why scalloping became a thing when you could just put tall frets on an instrument.

Don't get me wrong, it's a different thing, but if you're afraid of going scalloped it's worth trying monster frets.

 

[ixlramp]

Huge frets seems a far better idea, with added advantages.
For example those 5/32" stainless steel rods sunk into the fretboard that tkinstruments uses https://www.tkinstruments.com/id17.htm

 

[MaxOfMetal]

The one downside to absolutely huge frets is it can make the neck feel thicker than it is.

On a new build you can compensate for it, but on an existing instrument it's something to consider.

 

[ixlramp]

Hmmm, but then, scalloping reduces neck thickness and strength, so on a new build you might end up having to use a thicker neck to compensate anyway.
If minimum neck cross section is a gauge of neck strength i suspect that huge frets and scalloping would both require the same total neck thickness (back of neck to fret top).
On an existing guitar i would be concerned about thinning the fretboard to such a degree.

Scalloping has always seemed to me to be a rather crude afterthought or customisation, forced by a lack of easily availalble huge frets and the difficulty of machining and cutting huge frets. I think a lot about alternative frets.
It irritates me when i see scalloping on the highest frets only, as if you only ever bend really high notes, that's a rock guitar soloing cliche.

 

[MaxOfMetal]

Hmmm, but then, scalloping reduces neck thickness and strength, so on a new build you might end up having to use a thicker neck to compensate anyway.
If minimum neck cross section is a gauge of neck strength i suspect that huge frets and scalloping would both require the same total neck thickness (back of neck to fret top).
On an existing guitar i would be concerned about thinning the fretboard to such a degree.

Scalloping has always seemed to me to be a rather crude afterthought or customisation, forced by a lack of easily availalble huge frets and the difficulty of machining and cutting huge frets. I think a lot about alternative frets.
It irritates me when i see scalloping on the highest frets only, as if you only ever bend really high notes, that's a rock guitar soloing cliche.

I've done a bunch of scallops over the years, and worked on others, and can't say it's every lead to stability issues, structural or tuning/setup related.

At least as far as properly done professional jobs go. Home jobs that are poorly done have had issues, but that's about execution more than anything else.

The necks will bow forward slightly, but this is easily compensated for by the truss rod.

 

[immemorial]

I have an issue that gets solved by scalloping or extremely tall frets - my fingertip is very flat and my fingernail also protrudes a significant amount beyond the flesh of my finger tip. With a scalloped board I don't have to press with the side of my finger anymore, as my fingernails would dig into the fretboard and prevent me from fretting the string properly.

Hmmm, but then, scalloping reduces neck thickness and strength, so on a new build you might end up having to use a thicker neck to compensate anyway.
If minimum neck cross section is a gauge of neck strength i suspect that huge frets and scalloping would both require the same total neck thickness (back of neck to fret top).
On an existing guitar i would be concerned about thinning the fretboard to such a degree.

Scalloping has always seemed to me to be a rather crude afterthought or customisation, forced by a lack of easily availalble huge frets and the difficulty of machining and cutting huge frets. I think a lot about alternative frets.
It irritates me when i see scalloping on the highest frets only, as if you only ever bend really high notes, that's a rock guitar soloing cliche.

Is neck strength through thinning the fingerboard really an issue? I'm not a luthier but I recall that the neck by itself, even on extremely thin necks, plus rod reinforcement, is much more than enough unless you're using an extreme amount of strings.

Would it not be similar to scalloping if you were to build an even thinner/lower profile neck for your extremely tall frets? I think at some point, the frets would need to be extremely well finished or else they would potentially be annoying when moving your hand on the neck, whereas scalloped boards don't quite have that trouble as much since the transition between the lowest part of the board and the fret has a smoother arc?

 

[Sogradde]

"Gittler" has you guys covered.

 

[BananaDemocracy]

FWIW

I will say this just as quick two cents. My old guitar teacher and amateur tech told me a long time ago when he tried scalloping his fender beater and I asked him if he could help me scallop mine,” dude...don’t ever try to scallop your own fretboard. You will never get the intonation right again .”

[Now with that said, I’m on mobile so I can’t read all replies if this was repetitive, but if your confident enough as a tech just be careful !]

 

[BIG ND SWEATY]

How would scalloping affect intonation other than you pressing too hard and bending out of tune? Its not like the bridge is moving.

 

[BananaDemocracy]

Idk
Not a luthier(just repeating what someone told me as sound advice)

"Gittler" has you guys covered.

View attachment 69148

Whattttt?????
8 STRING SCALLOP WUT?! Lol

 

[ixlramp]

I'm guessing this person was referring to players who press to hard because they are used to feeling contact with the fretboard? Scalloping doesn't move frets or saddles so intonation can be fine.

It seems to me that scalloping needs to be flat-bottomed valleys with steep sides, not the usual radius curve, because when a scallop is between lower frets and you fret just behind a fret, your finger will be at one end of the scallop, not halfway between frets. Not an issue for the very high frets of course.
It seems such an effort that huge frets would be easier.

 

[immemorial]

I'm guessing this person was referring to players who press to hard because they are used to feeling contact with the fretboard? Scalloping doesn't move frets or saddles so intonation can be fine.

It seems to me that scalloping needs to be flat-bottomed valleys with steep sides, not the usual radius curve, because when a scallop is between lower frets and you fret just behind a fret, your finger will be at one end of the scallop, not halfway between frets. Not an issue for the very high frets of course.
It seems such an effort that huge frets would be easier.

Another type of scalloping is the one that Ritchie Blackmore had, it's the ones on the right in this image compared to the ones Malmsteen made popular. Ritchie's is probably more true to it's function from the nut to the mid-neck and Malmsteen's is probably more so in the upper range when the spacing becomes smaller. Actually, that's probably why this guy was doing it like that on this neck right here lmao