Shout Out To Kiesel!

[jaxadam]

Too funny, right before I opened SSO I was at RT and thinking “I haven’t seen Jaxadam in a while….”

Hahahahah next time you’re in the area we’ll have to grab some lap dances then go wipe all the body oil off on some expensive guitars at GC!

Sounds good to me! I need some new t-shirts and Private Stocks!

 

[BuckarooBanzai]

If others want to jump on the bandwagon to publicly drag a company that has already publicly apologized for their actions and is actively working on and reflecting on their past behavior,

Show us the money. I don't completely doubt that this has happened but I wouldn't put money on it. Between the "robbery", Jeff shitting on small luthiers continuously in a YouTube factory tour, the no-return bad finish matching debacle, the roasted maple SNAFU, the stuff called out in that skinny pale YouTube guy's video, Jeff feigning sympathy and gloating on Facebook when Carvin "went under" a few years back, and the fact that one of their employees condescended the ever-living shit out of me when I visited the factory a few years back they have a lot to apologize for.

I just bought a new Korean LTD and am spending hundreds of dollars on mods and a setup even though I could pay a few hundred more for an equivalent Kiesel instead. That's how much I don't want to give them my money. He chose to spin the business out and grow it by being a terminally-online overdramatic prima donna that slings hypebeast guitars with gaudy tops and dyed fingerboards. I choose not to give my money to people like that because life is too short to enable this type of behavior.

there is probably a whole lot of hardworking people within their organization that truly want you to feel great about their products,

It's unfortunate that they work for a guy that conducts himself in such an unsavory fashion.

 

[GenghisCoyne]

life is too short

long enough to follow his online bullshit, post about it here, build up other guitars because you dont want to give kiesel money

 

[Hollowway]

the fact that one of their employees condescended the ever-living shit out of me when I visited the factory a few years back

I had the same experience on a phone call. Felt like I’d interrupted his dinner with a couple of copies of The Watchtower.

 

[BuckarooBanzai]

long enough to follow his online bullshit, post about it here, build up other guitars because you dont want to give kiesel money

You don't have to seek it out when it's all over the forums that you read for the better part of a decade. Spending a few minutes to summarize it for others is preferable to making one-line troll posts, but hey, to each their own.

 

[highway one]

Show us the money. I don't completely doubt that this has happened but I wouldn't put money on it. Between the "robbery", Jeff shitting on small luthiers continuously in a YouTube factory tour, the no-return bad finish matching debacle, the roasted maple SNAFU, the stuff called out in that skinny pale YouTube guy's video, Jeff feigning sympathy and gloating on Facebook when Carvin "went under" a few years back, and the fact that one of their employees condescended the ever-living shit out of me when I visited the factory a few years back they have a lot to apologize for.

I just bought a new Korean LTD and am spending hundreds of dollars on mods and a setup even though I could pay a few hundred more for an equivalent Kiesel instead. That's how much I don't want to give them my money. He chose to spin the business out and grow it by being a terminally-online overdramatic prima donna that slings hypebeast guitars with gaudy tops and dyed fingerboards. I choose not to give my money to people like that because life is too short to enable this type of behavior.



It's unfortunate that they work for a guy that conducts himself in such an unsavory fashion.

How quickly I am reminded why I havent posted anything in this forum in nearly a decade and choose to be a passive participant.. Look my friend, I hear ya, and I don't doubt that you and many other people had bad experiences (even recently), but you may have missed the part where the op slim mentioned that he made this post as an alternate means to showcase positive experiences. You have all day access to a probably 200-300 page thread that is an absolute slam fest for those that feel the same as you, and perhaps rightfully so in some cases. I am basing my OPINION on an apology video from Jeff I watched probably a couple years ago maybe, that he literaly said he messed up, doesnt always get it right, and his behavior and words can be out of line at times (or something to this effect). Is he to be taken at his word, who knows, but acknowledgment is a great first step, and yes I do believe there probably some really amazing people working hard every day there, and I am not willing to crucify them because their leader maybe says or does things they don't agree with. I believe customers deserve great customer service from anyone they do business with, and it sounds like my opinion based on my own experiences perhaps doesn't hold true for everyone, and may have been too broad of an assessment, but I stand the experiences I have had. I think they make great products, I love that they make their guitars in the USA and let you customize them to taste at a price many production import guitars sell for, and I am happy to know that so far the people I have dealt with there (Cal in particular) have been helpful and patient with me and my questions. Maybe one day I will have a related experience (hopefully not), but if I do, I can take comfort in knowing that this forum has a fully developed beat down thread I can chime in on.

 

[MetalDestroyer]

 

[tedtan]

How quickly I am reminded why I havent posted anything in this forum in nearly a decade and choose to be a passive participant.. Look my friend, I hear ya, and I don't doubt that you and many other people had bad experiences (even recently), but you may have missed the part where the op slim mentioned that he made this post as an alternate means to showcase positive experiences. You have all day access to a probably 200-300 page thread that is an absolute slam fest for those that feel the same as you, and perhaps rightfully so in some cases. I am basing my OPINION on an apology video from Jeff I watched probably a couple years ago maybe, that he literaly said he messed up, doesnt always get it right, and his behavior and words can be out of line at times (or something to this effect). Is he to be taken at his word, who knows, but acknowledgment is a great first step, and yes I do believe there probably some really amazing people working hard every day there, and I am not willing to crucify them because their leader maybe says or does things they don't agree with. I believe customers deserve great customer service from anyone they do business with, and it sounds like my opinion based on my own experiences perhaps doesn't hold true for everyone, and may have been too broad of an assessment, but I stand the experiences I have had. I think they make great products, I love that they make their guitars in the USA and let you customize them to taste at a price many production import guitars sell for, and I am happy to know that so far the people I have dealt with there (Cal in particular) have been helpful and patient with me and my questions. Maybe one day I will have a related experience (hopefully not), but if I do, I can take comfort in knowing that this forum has a fully developed beat down thread I can chime in on.

Keisel probably gets it right 99.9% of the time. The problem is that when they get it wrong, the customer has often been the one to pay for Keisel’s mistake. And given that most musicians I’ve known haven’t had money to burn, it makes sense that they get pissed when they’re stuck paying for someone else’s mistake due to some stupid, half assed “option 50” excuse. (Keep in mind that people are seven to ten times more likely to complain about negative experiences than they are to mention positive ones, so the negative thread tracks with this).

 

[highway one]

Keisel probably gets it right 99.9% of the time. The problem is that when they get it wrong, the customer has often been the one to pay for Keisel’s mistake. And given that most musicians I’ve known haven’t had money to burn, it makes sense that they get pissed when they’re stuck paying for someone else’s mistake due to some stupid, half assed “option 50” excuse. (Keep in mind that people are seven to ten times more likely to complain about negative experiences than they are to mention positive ones, so the negative thread tracks with this).

I get it, and I can't say I'd feel any different if that was my experience after dropping a significant amount of money on a dream guitar. The fact of the matter is, the personalization of the instruments in conjunction with a notable financial investment and having to wait out the production time for said dream guitar probably causes a heightened sense of excitement and expectation both realistic and unrealistic. Essentially you want it to be as perfect as you dreamt it up to be, and if it's not, then you want it to be a smooth path to reconciliation. Generally speaking, if you nit pick anything long enough you can probably take issue with just about anything produced anywhere, its really about personal tolerance as long as it doesnt render the item unfunctional for its intended use. Having an option 50 potentially overriding a pathway to address any valid concerns is troublesome from a customer service stand point if there is a quality issue that needs to be addressed. I am not able to speak to this, as this has not been a personal experience of mine, but I can agree that the expectation would be for any said issues to be considered and addressed appropriately without being talked down to or being made an example of for the world to see. Customer service and support post purchase is vitally important, and it can make or break many companies both big and small when the trust has been broken with your customer base (no argument there). I think sometimes companies are just blinded by the fact that they get it right often enough that they don't feel obligated to take these concerns seriously enough until enough bad will builds up that their overall reputation is at risk potentially scaring off future customers and potential purchases.

 

[slim231990]

Yea, I think the social media algorithm has people hooked on the hate. I'm a pretty thick skinned individual but I do feel like people kinda attacked my positive experience lol. Sadly you're not gonna see as many positive posts from others lurking on here when they feel like they are gonna be attacked or they might not wanna post a positive experience in the "Kiesel Never Again" thread just as highway one mentioned. I greatly appreciate everyone who actually read my words and can see what I was trying to get across. Peace and love

 

[MaxOfMetal]

Yea, I think the social media algorithm has people hooked on the hate. I'm a pretty thick skinned individual but I do feel like people kinda attacked my positive experience lol. Sadly you're not gonna see as many positive posts from others lurking on here when they feel like they are gonna be attacked or they might not wanna post a positive experience in the "Kiesel Never Again" thread just as highway one mentioned. I greatly appreciate everyone who actually read my words and can see what I was trying to get across. Peace and love

We do have a fairly active, long running, and informative Carvin/Kiesel thread too, which you'll find more of the positive stuff like NGDs, product announcements, etc.

The Carvin / Kiesel thread

i'm sure some of you saw this coming :P talk about carvins here. had/have one? liked one? hated one? favorite finishes? pickups? necks? etc etc.... i'm currently saving up for a Carvin CT24 of some sort. i'm leaning towards CT3 and CT4, but i may change my mind if post graduation i...

www.sevenstring.org

 

[slim231990]

We do have a fairly active, long running, and informative Carvin/Kiesel thread too, which you'll find more of the positive stuff like NGDs, product announcements, etc.

The Carvin / Kiesel thread

i'm sure some of you saw this coming :P talk about carvins here. had/have one? liked one? hated one? favorite finishes? pickups? necks? etc etc.... i'm currently saving up for a Carvin CT24 of some sort. i'm leaning towards CT3 and CT4, but i may change my mind if post graduation i...

www.sevenstring.org

Yea.... lol that's totally my bad. I assumed that this thread turned into "Kiesel Never Again" lol.