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As an unbiased observer, you know what would go a long way here? Some sort of peer-reviewed scientific paper demonstrating, to a reasonably small p-value, that there is a relationship between soy consumption and estrogen issues. Science is pretty good when it comes to confirming this stuff, after all.Too specific because it isn't necessarily a problem related to the amount of ingested estrogen?
Ok...agree to disagree and all that stuff.
I just want to get my calories easily and forget about it and focus on other things.
marcwormjim, I hear you, man.This may be unrelated, but I really hate people.
As an unbiased observer, you know what would go a long way here? Some sort of peer-reviewed scientific paper demonstrating, to a reasonably small p-value, that there is a relationship between soy consumption and estrogen issues. Science is pretty good when it comes to confirming this stuff, after all.
So, your argument is:
1. A person eats soy.
2. ?????
3. Estrogen problems.
That's pretty specific. [sarcasm]
Anyway, there is no estrogen-based harm in eating soy.
(sources:
http://journals.plos.org/plosone/article?id=10.1371/journal.pone.0089288
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/11880595
http://www.precisionnutrition.com/soy-latest-research)
So, again, no horse in this race....https://www.westonaprice.org/health...ing-adverse-effects-of-dietary-soy-1939-2008/
http://americannutritionassociation.org/newsletter/downside-soybean-consumption0
http://articles.mercola.com/sites/articles/archive/2010/12/04/soy-dangers-summarized.aspx
Here are some papers of varying degrees of credibility (like yours) that suggest soy can be a bad thing.
Take it how you like, like I've alluded to many times now neither you or I have the answers as this is not an exact science yet.
And please refrain from assuming that I believe in "anecdotes" or that I'm "parroting" what I've heard anymore than you do.
I do not hesitate to be involved in meaningful debate, but you and me going at this is not a meaningful debate given how neither of us (presumably) are experts in this field and all we can do is throw contradictory studies in each others face.
Like you, I simply share my opinion based on what I believe to be closest to the truth.
How science is SUPPOSED to work.Well, i am guilty of passing along information from what I've "heard", mainly from bodybuilding and strength training circles. While I do still believe soy has low biological value (BV) and should not be used as a primary source of protein, I retract my previous statement about soy raising estrogen levels.
How science is SUPPOSED to work.
My main problem with soy is this - unless it's fermented into something I can dip my sushi into or use as the base for a marinade or glaze for steak tips, I just don't like it all that much.
I just work out so I can eat for taste, so I don't even really pay much attention to that stuff. Which is why I found the OP so dumbfounding.Again, I've never intentionally shied away from soy. It's biggest problem for me is the low BV. Basically, I have a protein goal to meet every day. One gram of soy is not worth as much as one gram of whey. So, I need more of it which leaves me fewer calories overall to work with. Also, soy protein doesn't mix as well in a shake. At least, not the ones I've had.
I have noticed that when I'm in the grocery store and see some product shouting at me "8G OF PROTEIN!!!", it's usually soy because soy protein is cheap.
I just work out so I can eat for taste, so I don't even really pay much attention to that stuff. Which is why I found the OP so dumbfounding.
Dude, I enjoy the shit out of cooking. The OPPORTUNITY of cooking is the 60 minutes of prep cooking and dicing shit up and searing and sautéing and cranking some tunes while your kitchen smells delicious.The problem with cooking is 20 mins of prep/cooking, and another 10 for clean-up for 5-10 mins of delicious eating. It's one of the worst returns for your efforts
don't forget the beer to drink while doing itDude, I enjoy the shit out of cooking. The OPPORTUNITY of cooking is the 60 minutes of prep cooking and dicing shit up and searing and sautéing and cranking some tunes while your kitchen smells delicious.