Wound vs plain string tension

[Oscar Stern]

OK these are Thomastik KF110 Flatwound Acoustic Guitar Strings. Their core wire is made from a really special alloy.

 

[Oscar Stern]

One of my friends managed to restring a Strat w/ a set of 13s which have more tension to make them durable. This has a Flexible Wound G String you can bend but you actually have to practice alot to make it work.

 

[Oscar Stern]

This is a claimed advantage of a flat winding, not of a hex shaped wound string.

As mentioned earlier, although a flatwound wrap wire layer has more material, a wrap wire layer has insignificant strength because a spiral of material is very easy to stretch, it is a spring. The strength of a wound string is determined by hte strength of its core wire.

But anyway ... hex shaped strings do not exist

I went up a gauge when changing the Plain G to a Flexible Wound G & it didn't break at all because they refined the formula.

 

[Chris Bowsman]

Go check out what people who do a lot of wide bends use. It’s very rarely going to be a wound third.

Or, even better, try one and see how it actually performs. I like doing 1.5 step bends sometimes, so I think wound thirds suck. You may love them.

 

[Oscar Stern]

Go check out what people who do a lot of wide bends use. It’s very rarely going to be a wound third.

Or, even better, try one and see how it actually performs. I like doing 1.5 step bends sometimes, so I think wound thirds suck. You may love them.

Not anymore because the formula has been improved.

 

[Oscar Stern]

Because that is the mechanics of 'stiffness'. Distance stretched and tension are different things.

If you replace a plain with a same gauge wound, the tension will be slightly lower, so there is less resistance when pushing it sideways, and less force is needed to push it sideways by a certain distance. But ... this is not what determines 'ease of bending', you have to also take in to account how far you need to push it sideways to get the desired pitch change.

'Ease of bending' is 'how easy it is to bend a particular pitch interval', because that is what really matters. Whether someone uses subtle vibrato or does a large string bend, they require a particular change of pitch.

With a wound, the core wire will be very much thinner, which means you have to push it sideways much much further to get the desired pitch change, therefore having to bend multiple strings. Despite the lower resistence of the string the result is very probably 'harder to bend'. The fragility of the core wire and the larger amount of stretching also makes it far more likely to break during a bend.

I expect you have experienced all this already.

As i wrote earlier, you should not make a comparison using a wound with less tension, because players require a particular tension for a string. The comparison of plain and wound bending behaviours has to be made with equal tensions.


StringJoy Recommends going up a gauge when changing the Plain G to a Wound G:https://forum.seymourduncan.com/forum/the-guitar-shop/282731-wound-g-better-intonation so that it becomes flexible. For example if you substitute the 16p w/ a 17w, it'll be easier to bend. I think the formula for a Wound G string is actually outdated.

 

[Oscar Stern]

The best part about this is that you can keep with the gauges you’re used to, and simply add in a wound G string that will keep the same tension as the other strings in the gauge set. To do this, simply select a wound string that’s just a hair heavier in gauge than the plain string it’s replacing, to account for the reduced tension wound strings exert versus their plain counterparts. So if you’re replacing a plain .017 in a set, go for a .018w to keep the same tension, and if you’re replacing a plain .018 or .019, go with a .019w .020w. If you're replacing a plain .016 in a 9-42 set, use a .017w:https://stringjoy.com/wound-g-string-wound-3rd/

 

[Oscar Stern]

Our personal favorite move is to take our Balanced Light Gauge (10-48) electric guitar strings and sub in a .018w for the 3rd string. So you’d select these gauges as a custom set: .010 – .0135 – .018w – .026w – .036 – .048

That gauge is thin enough that you can bend it almost as well (If not just as well) as you can a plain string, but you get all the added fullness of a wound string—it’s the best of both worlds. But that’s just one example—go crazy, have fun, and if we can ever help with anything, just holler.

Our second favorite? The same idea but with our Balanced Mediums as the base for the custom set: .011 – .014 – .020w – .028 – .038 – .050

StringJoy Guitar Strings has pulled off Guitar String sets w/ a Flexible Wound 3rd.

 

[Oscar Stern]

What about a 17.5 Gauge Wound G String? Half Gauge Wound Strings would actually be a good compromise.

 

[Chris Bowsman]

What brand allegedly has a wound third that doesn’t need bent as far as it’s plain counterpart, and how much more are we paying for this?

 

[Oscar Stern]

What brand allegedly has a wound third that doesn’t need bent as far as it’s plain counterpart, and how much more are we paying for this?

Actually Thomastik (as well as Otcave4+) has those kinds of Strings & they're not that expensive along w/ Dogal.

 

[Chris Bowsman]

Actually Thomastik (as well as Otcave4+) has those kinds of Strings & they're not that expensive along w/ Dogal.

I’ve used Thomastik strings, not into them.

If you give me a link, I’ll get one of the wound third strings that supposedly defies physics and try it out.

 

[Oscar Stern]

I’ve used Thomastik strings, not into them.

If you give me a link, I’ll get one of the wound third strings that supposedly defies physics and try it out.

D'addario is a good brand w/ Colored Ball Ends. To defy those physics take a set of 9-42 Gauge XT Coated Strings:https://www.daddario.com/products/g...ctric-nickel-plated-steel-super-light-09-422/ & substitute the 16p w/ a 17w:https://www.daddario.com/products/g...wound-electric-guitar-single-string-.017-471/ also make sure you lubricate the bridge & nut w/ #2 pencil Graphite so that it slides more smoothly (a Zero Glide nut would also be a good upgrade:https://goldtonemusicgroup.com/zeroglide/ it's an updated version of the Zero Fret system where the Zero Fret is now built into the nut).

 

[Oscar Stern]

You'll also have to make sure to apply pencil graphite to the bridge slots too.

 

[Oscar Stern]

Keep in mind that as the Wound Strings get thinner & thinner, you'll have to lubricate the bridge & nut w/ more pencil graphite

 

[Chris Bowsman]

D'addario is a good brand w/ Colored Ball Ends. To defy those physics take a set of 9-42 Gauge XT Coated Strings:https://www.daddario.com/products/g...ctric-nickel-plated-steel-super-light-09-422/ & substitute the 16p w/ a 17w:https://www.daddario.com/products/g...wound-electric-guitar-single-string-.017-471/ also make sure you lubricate the bridge & nut w/ #2 pencil Graphite so that it slides more smoothly (a Zero Glide nut would also be a good upgrade:https://goldtonemusicgroup.com/zeroglide/ it's an updated version of the Zero Fret system where the Zero Fret is now built into the nut).

Last time I’m saying this, I promise…

A wound third will need to be bent further to achieve the same pitch as a plain. No amount of formula improvement will alleviate this. If a string has less tension, it will need to be bent further than a string with higher tension.

 

[ixlramp]

 

[Oscar Stern]

Last time I’m saying this, I promise…

A wound third will need to be bent further to achieve the same pitch as a plain. No amount of formula improvement will alleviate this. If a string has less tension, it will need to be bent further than a string with higher tension.

That's not really the case, Dogal Strings are designed that way so that they can be bent only a teeny tiny amount.

 

[Oscar Stern]

View attachment 104136

Actually StringJoy says if you go up a gauge when changing the Plain G to a Wound G (example 9-42 set, change the 16p to a 17w) it'll be a Flexible Wound G that you can bend just as well w/ better intonation.

 

[Oscar Stern]

To have a Wound G that you can bend the wrap wire would have to be glued really tightly around the core so that it acts as one piece.