Helix gone. Next Modeler? Or something else?

[SnoozyWyrm]

Hello guys! It's been a while.

Last week I sold my Helix Floor.

It did what I required it to do, however I 've fallen out with both the sounds and its size.

Currently I make do (for cover band needs) with a Mooer Prime P2 and a Bose s1 pro plus. It is a capable combination and VFM. For MIDI needs I use a luminiteFX Graviton with XY-controller or footswitch.

Right now I am considering two paths, while trying to be versatile and compact.

1. Pedalboard amp and fx unit.
I have considered the BluGuitar Amp1 and the Victory V4 amps, however their MIDI functionality is limited to non-existent.

The Blackstar Amped1 seems decked out in terms of features, however I've seen conflicting reviews. It also can be used as a flat/linear amp for a modeler down the line.

FX might get something like the H90 or the Plethora.

2. High end modeler again (may be a power amp down the line?).

Go for a FM3, FM9 (do I need the second one? will I miss the horsepower? since the switches are covered with MIDI)

Go for a QC? Just for the interface? It will be very similar to the Helix situation, good GUI mediocre tones, required tricks and time to coax out the tones.

What are your experiences with similar rigs, how did you reach your decisions?

Toodeloo!

 

[soul_lip_mike]

I can’t say enough good things about the fm9. I had an fm3 and needed more buttons so I swapped.

 

[budda]

Grab a used fm3/fm9 and fender FR-12?

 

[ATRguitar91]

If you think the Helix had mediocre tones and required too much tweaking, I don't think you'll be happier with any modeller, and midi support with an analog based setup is gonna be a headache I'd think.

I'd say a preamp pedal based rig with a separate poweramp might be up your alley. You could just supplement your existing setup with more preamps and effects.

You could also go hybrid with an HX Stomp for effects and its utility functions. There's a lot you can use it for, even if you're not relying on it for amp tone.

My current pedalboard rig is an HX Stomp with a small class D amplifier, sounds great and very versatile, could supplement with hardware pedals at the expense of space.

 

[SalsaWood]

Modelers are the washboard necktie for millennials. Quit screwing around and get a tube amp.

Since you won't, I'd suggest the Axe 3 or FM9 as well. It has all the potential in the world, most of which nobody asked for, just like millennials.

 

[Kosthrash]

The Fm9 seems ideal for your use case (IF you can locate one here in Athens, Greece... )

Otherwise I'd look for an analog preamp pedal like the Friedmann IR-X along with a multifx floor unit (hx effects?) and a floor poweramp pedal Or an FR-12.

 

[ATRguitar91]

Modelers are the washboard necktie for millennials. Quit screwing around and get a tube amp.

Since you won't, I'd suggest the Axe 3 or FM9 as well. It has all the potential in the world, most of which nobody asked for, just like millennials.

OP clearly is asking about small, portable, pedalboard based rigs - suggests getting a big, heavy tube amp. Classic SSO.

Who's to say he doesn't have a tube amp at home that he doesn't want to drag out to a gig?

The median age of millennials is like 34, around the age you realize dragging a big tube head around is goofy.

 

[SalsaWood]

Classic SSO.

Some might say too classic.

For real, go Fractal. It's a known-known and not a Helix.

 

[DrewH]

Don't sleep on the Fender Tonemaster Pro. That unit is pretty good and it has the easiest UI of all the units out there.

 

[Shask]

OP clearly is asking about small, portable, pedalboard based rigs - suggests getting a big, heavy tube amp. Classic SSO.

Who's to say he doesn't have a tube amp at home that he doesn't want to drag out to a gig?

The median age of millennials is like 34, around the age you realize dragging a big tube head around is goofy.

You could do something like a Synergy Syn1 and a KSR KA-50 Poweramp and have a small tube based rig.

Even a Synergy Syn2 and a Syn 5050 Poweramp would be smaller than an Axe-FX III.

 

[Spinedriver]

OP clearly is asking about small, portable, pedalboard based rigs - suggests getting a big, heavy tube amp. Classic SSO.

Who's to say he doesn't have a tube amp at home that he doesn't want to drag out to a gig?

The median age of millennials is like 34, around the age you realize dragging a big tube head around is goofy.

Not to mention, the price of re-tubing one these days could be kind of expensive. Also, depending on the venue the person is playing, if the amp/cab is going to be miced, there's no way the audience would be able to tell if you were using a tube amp or a very well dialed in digital rig anyway.

 

[budda]

Don't sleep on the Fender Tonemaster Pro. That unit is pretty good and it has the easiest UI of all the units out there.

Don't buy one either because they haven't quite caught up yet.

 

[Crungy]

Modelers are the washboard necktie for millennials. Quit screwing around and get a tube amp.

Since you won't, I'd suggest the Axe 3 or FM9 as well. It has all the potential in the world, most of which nobody asked for, just like millennials.

 

[MatrixClaw]

If you think the Helix had mediocre tones and required too much tweaking, I don't think you'll be happier with any modeller

This. FM3/9 sounds great, but I was able to get equally as good tones out of Helix Native with a lot less effort, as far as amp sounds are concerned. The main downfall to Helix is the lack of amps available compared to Fractal, so there's less variety of sounds available. That said, I tended to only use a higher gain Marshall, a 5150 and a Recto for heavier sounds, all of which the Helix has and does well.

Now, if we're talking effects - the Fractal's are world-class and worth the price of admission alone. The UI on Fractal is far less user-friendly though, so you should take that into account, especially if you intend to edit patches on the unit itself. I sold mine not because it wasn't a great sounding modeler, but because I found that I simply didn't enjoy using it as much as my real amps.

 

[budda]

The second time I had a helix, i was so used to advanced parameters available (no i dont touch most of them) that not having the depth in line6 made quick editor tweaks non existent. I dont expect that to be everyone’s case but worth mentioning.

If its a real amp you know, you can use similar settings in a current gen fractal product and go. Dont even need to use other parameters imo, they are there for those inclined. Now that I know how transformer match, negative bias and other things work, I use them.

 

[crushingpetal]

The second time I had a helix, i was so used to advanced parameters available (no i dont touch most of them) that not having the depth in line6 made quick editor tweaks non existent. I dont expect that to be everyone’s case but worth mentioning.

If its a real amp you know, you can use similar settings in a current gen fractal product and go. Dont even need to use other parameters imo, they are there for those inclined. Now that I know how transformer match, negative bias and other things work, I use them.

Yeah, I can't imagine not having the advanced parameters. I sometimes look at my tube amps and think "damn, what's your problem, why don't you have a supply sag knob".

 

[budda]

Yeah, I can't imagine not having the advanced parameters. I sometimes look at my tube amps and think "damn, what's your problem, why don't you have a supply sag knob".

I look at my superlead and think “fuck your noise floor”

 

[Marked Man]

Modelers are castles made of sand.



.

 

[Mike]

BluGuitar Amp1 Iridium Edition is awesome. It takes pedals perfectly. Compact, loud, and feels really good. Better to me honestly than any modeler into power amp I've ever owned.

 

[laxu]

1. Pedalboard amp and fx unit.
I have considered the BluGuitar Amp1 and the Victory V4 amps, however their MIDI functionality is limited to non-existent.

I have exactly this at the moment.

This board:



Into this BluGuitar mini-stack:




As you can see it's wirelessly controlled by the Luminite Graviton M1. I run a MIDI cable to the BluGuitar from the board to control its channels etc. I wish I could use a CME WIDI Master there, but the BluGuitar MIDI adapter does not do power through its MIDI port, just powers the MIDI controller inside the adapter itself.

The good​

- It's "just the things I really need" stuff.
- Knobs, so many dedicated knobs!
- The Amp 1 Mercury Edition does the things that I truly care about: Marshall-based overdrive tones and Fender cleans. And boy does it do those well. It has made me sell a Bogner Goldfinger because the Amp 1 could do everything it does at a fraction of the size, weight and cost.
- Real cabs, straightforward tones. Both the BluGuitar 1x12 cabs are lovely, and super easy to mic: just point your mic at the "Blu" or the "uitar".
- Modular. Nothing says I need to bring all of this with me, my rig at its smallest is throwing the BluGuitar Amp 1 and a Source Audio Collider into a backpack because the Amp 1 has multiple channels, a built in boost and noise gate. Just needs a delay and a better reverb is nice to have.

The bad​

- It does nothing more than what's on the board. Which already is a lot, but you need to shuffle things around if you want something different.
- It's expensive. MIDI capable pedals tend to be pricy, and even though I've bought most of these used, it adds up to way more than most modelers.
- Routing is very fixed. I have a Temple Audio patchbay in the back so I can split "before amp" and "in the fx loop" pedals but that's it.
- Always have to remember to turn off that Boss Fuzz because it defaults to enabled...
- A lot more programming to make the MIDI controller do all the things you want it to. The Luminite M1 is great tho.

The ugly​

- It's more portable than a typical tube rig, but certainly nowhere near as handy as most floor modelers.
- It is more noisy than a modeler. Not by much tho and depends heavily on what pedals are on.
- Preset management is complicated on pedals because Strymon still doesn't have their Nixie 2 software out with support for my pedals.
- If anything goes wrong, it becomes a whole ordeal to find a patch cable that doesn't work etc.

This is just a home rig for now so I don't mind that it is complicated. It's very fun to use and sounds awesome.

---

The alternative​

I recently sold my Axe-Fx 3 + FC-12. It's a fantastic sounding setup and my current one doesn't do anything better in terms of sound. All those pedals are just more user friendly. Of course, the Fractal absolutely trounces my rig with its versatility, variety and how easy it is to build presets and set up routing and switching in comparison. I just didn't use more than a fraction of that rig's capabilities. In hindsight I should have stuck to the FM3 instead because even though it needed some "block Tetris", it did enough and was much more portable.

But if you didn't like the Helix, then you might not like say a FM9 any better. Helix Floor to me is the sweet spot of modelers where it's reasonably easy to use, sounds great and does a ton. I mainly sold mine because for me floor modelers are no longer an option due to health issues (no crouching to the floor to adjust stuff). It was also a pretty huge device, but it didn't need extra switches, had a built in expression pedal etc. Easy to recommend.

Quad Cortex operates like the Helix but with a touchscreen. IMO it doesn't sound as good as the Helix or Fractal especially for effects. Switch spacing is a bit cramped but that's at least possible to rectify with a MIDI controller.

Me, I'm waiting for the next gen. While it may still be 1-2 years away, I expect Fractal and Line6 will knock it out of the park with their next units because the current ones are already so good. I just want better onboard usability.