Kiesel CL6 - Lithiums or Pegasus/Sentient?

[Adamewf]

Hey guys,

I've finally decided to pull the trigger on a Kiesel CL6.
This particular model offers the seymour duncan set for a $150 upcharge ($75 Each). Are they worth the upgrade?
I just wanted to weigh in here and see what you guys think. It'll be somewhat difficult to replace the pickups if I dont like them after (being that theyre the slanted version.)
I figure both pickups are geared to being pretty versatile, which is ideal for me. I'm just not entirely sure of the tonal differences as I have only played lithiums.
Does anyone have experience with both and could give me some insight on this decision. I need to have my build ready by monday. Much appreciated!

 

[Demiurge]

How comfortable are you with changing-out pickups yourself? It's a $150 upcharge for the SD set that retails ~$190USD new. If you don't like them, you could pull & re-sell the Lithiums and use the proceeds towards the SDs. The Lithiums, if purchased separately are $89- if you can dump them at even 50% retail that's good money to parlay.

 

[Adamewf]

How comfortable are you with changing-out pickups yourself? It's a $150 upcharge for the SD set that retails ~$190USD new. If you don't like them, you could pull & re-sell the Lithiums and use the proceeds towards the SDs. The Lithiums, if purchased separately are $89- if you can dump them at even 50% retail that's good money to parlay.

I've been installing pickups for about 5 years now, so that part isnt the issue. I figured it wouldve been a hassle to get the slanted duncans if i wanted them down the line.

 

[Adamewf]

How comfortable are you with changing-out pickups yourself? It's a $150 upcharge for the SD set that retails ~$190USD new. If you don't like them, you could pull & re-sell the Lithiums and use the proceeds towards the SDs. The Lithiums, if purchased separately are $89- if you can dump them at even 50% retail that's good money to parlay.

You make a great point though. I'm saving $40 if i get the duncans. But I would be saving $89+ if i sold the lithiums @50% and put that money toward the duncans after.

 

[iamaom]

You make a great point though. I'm saving $40 if i get the duncans. But I would be saving $89+ if i sold the lithiums @50% and put that money toward the duncans after.

Is there even a market for kiesel pickups in non-kiesel guitars? if you have any doubt about the lithiums go with the duncans and save yourself the hassel of trying to find matching slanted pups+selling stock pickups from a relativity small brand.

 

[spudmunkey]

Selling the multi-scale Lithiums to anyone besides Kiesel owners seems like an impossibility...and then the only people who don't already have the lithiums are people who didn't like them and ordered their multiscale Kiesels with the SD options...which have only just started shipping, and there's only been a few dozen of those customers from what I understand...so again, your potential to sell the Kiesel-specific angled lithium pickups is virtually non-existant.

I believe they offer two different SD bridge and two different SD neck pickups, so i'd suggest trying out any many guitars as you can with those pickups before plopping money down for custom-wound SD pickups which you'll only ever be able to sell to Kiesel multiscale owners of the same string count who have the Lithiums and don't like them.


Have you tried those specific SD pickups? Buying any pickup on brand alone from the major pickup brands is as much of a crapshoot as buying unknown pickups from kiesel. They all make many many models of pickups and you might like some but not others.

 

[AkiraSpectrum]

Selling the multi-scale Lithiums to anyone besides Kiesel owners seems like an impossibility...and then the only people who don't already have the lithiums are people who didn't like them and ordered their multiscale Kiesels with the SD options...which have only just started shipping, and there's only been a few dozen of those customers from what I understand...so again, your potential to sell the Kiesel-specific angled lithium pickups is virtually non-existant.

I believe they offer two different SD bridge and two different SD neck pickups, so i'd suggest trying out any many guitars as you can with those pickups before plopping money down for custom-wound SD pickups which you'll only ever be able to sell to Kiesel multiscale owners of the same string count who have the Lithiums and don't like them.


Have you tried those specific SD pickups? Buying any pickup on brand alone from the major pickup brands is as much of a crapshoot as buying unknown pickups from kiesel. They all make many many models of pickups and you might like some but not others.

Agreed. Not too many people are in need of slanted pickups, let alone used Kiesel branded ones.

I think the question should be the following: Which set of pickups do you think will suit you best? What styles are you playing? Check out reviews for each pickup set as well.

 

[spudmunkey]

Agreed. Not too many people are in need of slanted pickups, let alone used Kiesel branded ones.

To be clear, the branding isn't even the issue...are there any companies that make multiscale guitars that use the same angle for the pickups where the Lithiums would work as replacements? I've only heard of people getting custom pickups from Instrumental, SD (and I think BK) made to the specific angles the Kiesel guitar requires for the angle they chose (every manufacturer seems to do this differently).

 

[Adamewf]

Thanks for all the input so far guys. Great point spudmunkey, realistically it is going to be a pain in the ass to sell either set and im sure itll cost extra to get the kiesel slanted SDs. I think im just going to have to go with one and hope i love them. To be clear on the CL model they only offer the pegasus/sentient from SD. I assume its because those are the pups chris uses. Theyre both fairly versatile in being a medium gain pickup. Through experience i find the kiesels to be a tad sterile. Not much bottom end going on, but then obviously not very boomy. I think its just going to come down to listening to samples of the P/S and try to just commit.

 

[trebal]

I have the same doubt. Good survey! I will follow this.

 

[BubbleWrap]

I swapped out the lithiums in my SCB7 for a Pegasus/sentient set and am much happier with the tone I'm getting. If you play djenty bs, the lithiums will probably work well for you. But they're too thin and weak sounding for me, even with lots of tweaking.

 

[Adamewf]

I swapped out the lithiums in my SCB7 for a Pegasus/sentient set and am much happier with the tone I'm getting. If you play djenty bs, the lithiums will probably work well for you. But they're too thin and weak sounding for me, even with lots of tweaking.

What do you find in the Pegasus/sentient that you didn't find in the lithiums? Can the duncans still do the djenty stuff justice? Just interested in how youd describe both pickup sets from first person experience.

 

[AkiraSpectrum]

What do you find in the Pegasus/sentient that you didn't find in the lithiums? Can the duncans still do the djenty stuff justice? Just interested in how youd describe both pickup sets from first person experience.

I haven't played Lithiums, but I have 2 sets of the Pegasus/Sentient and they can easily do the djenty stuff no problem with your typical set up (high gain amp and OD pedal). Both P/S pickups have great note expression too, which is great for clarity under high gain. Seriously the cleanest note expression under high gain in a set of pickups that I've played (haven't played any BKP's though).

Recently found a clip on youtube of a guy playing some Periphery with a P/S set and it sounds pretty good to me:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tvijVNnFGPM

 

[BubbleWrap]

What do you find in the Pegasus/sentient that you didn't find in the lithiums? Can the duncans still do the djenty stuff justice? Just interested in how youd describe both pickup sets from first person experience.

The Kiesels remind me of a fatter version of the lace bar pickups, hifi big noiseless single type tones. The SDs are have much more "body or balls or however you want to describe a thicker tone" while still being articulate and tight. I've actually modded my set a fair amount with hex pole pieces and a ceramic magnet swap. I'm back to running the A5 mag now. The SDs can definitely do the djenty stuff, but offer a richer tone than the kiesels could ever hope to.

 

[Adamewf]

As a closing thought, just wanted to let you guys know i did end up pulling the trigger on the Duncan upgrade on my CL6 build. There nothing wrong with the kiesels, theyre extremely clean, but after listening to your input and listening to countless examples I felt like I could cover more area of tone with the Pegasus/Sentient.

Just off my research, these were the best clips i found for showcasing versatility in both options:

Kiesel Lithiums
https://youtu.be/ZpB6oW08Tw4
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8AN3Uh6PjvQ
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F6h08-yXDA8
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SHuAnJS3vFg

Seymour Duncan Pegasus/Sentient
https://www.instagram.com/p/BGzRwPPDxw1/?taken-by=aaronintervals&hl=en
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=krgm-On47Gg
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VbKS56i2PiQ
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ROH-j6UEJbY

I love how articulate the lithiums are but I find the P/S just give you a little more to work with. At this point i was just trying make a decision with the intention of never changing the Pups (With the kiesel spec'd slanted pickup configuration of the CL, selling either pair afterwards to change to the other would be a struggle).
Either way, if anyone isn't interested in plopping down an extra $150 on the duncans for this particular build, the lithiums are insane for a stock pickup.

Thanks everyone for your input and those of you who voted, I hope this thread can be helpful in the future for anyone else facing the same question.

 

[AkiraSpectrum]

As a closing thought, just wanted to let you guys know i did end up pulling the trigger on the Duncan upgrade on my CL6 build. There nothing wrong with the kiesels, theyre extremely clean, but after listening to your input and listening to countless examples I felt like I could cover more area of tone with the Pegasus/Sentient.

Just off my research, these were the best clips i found for showcasing versatility in both options:

Kiesel Lithiums
https://youtu.be/ZpB6oW08Tw4
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8AN3Uh6PjvQ
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F6h08-yXDA8
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SHuAnJS3vFg

Seymour Duncan Pegasus/Sentient
https://www.instagram.com/p/BGzRwPPDxw1/?taken-by=aaronintervals&hl=en
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=krgm-On47Gg
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VbKS56i2PiQ
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ROH-j6UEJbY

I love how articulate the lithiums are but I find the P/S just give you a little more to work with. At this point i was just trying make a decision with the intention of never changing the Pups (With the kiesel spec'd slanted pickup configuration of the CL, selling either pair afterwards to change to the other would be a struggle).
Either way, if anyone isn't interested in plopping down an extra $150 on the duncans for this particular build, the lithiums are insane for a stock pickup.

Thanks everyone for your input and those of you who voted, I hope this thread can be helpful in the future for anyone else facing the same question.

Great choice. Hope it works out for you!
You may have to tell me your address so I can come to your place and give that guitar a whirl when you get it