Logic Pro X and Pro Tools: Finding things to hate in each of them.

[klinic]

I finally worked out why people say writing in Logic is awesome. I actually quite like the midi editor in Pro Tools, but the instruments REALLY blow away Pro Tools. I just select a bass instrument tweak it a bit and BAM it sounds awesome. I'm using EZ drummer, but I find the included drums to sound pretty reasonable too.

I really like Pro Tools too tough, it just seems to make more sense when tracking a real instrument and editing things. In Logic I seem to have to set the functions of left click and command + left click and then I can only switch between those two and have to go back to the drop down menu to choose a new function. Whereas Pro Tools is all context sensitive depending on where I position the pointer and it honestly seems magical a lot. Cross-fades and fades, clip gain even transposing audio files and midi is SO much easier on Pro Tools. The shortcuts seem so much more logical (Hah! shouldn't it be the other way around) and window management makes so much more sense.

The instruments are just awful though, and it's not really in my budget to go and buy a whole host of instrument plugins for Pro Tools, I also don't really want a whole bunch of flexibility when I'm writing something, I just want to slap on the plugin and go.

I could write in Logic, bounce individual audio files to disk and then import them in Pro Tools to track guitars/vocals etc. but that's pretty annoying and I think I like the sound of Logics reverbs delays and general plugins better anyway.

Is there a cheap/free way to get plugins and instruments like Logics into Pro Tools, or a way to get Logic to act more like Pro Tools?

Or do you disagree with me and like one or the other for the opposite reasons? A bunch of thoughts would be cool. Cheers!

Edit: So, apparently Logic does have a similar function, only it doesn't work if I have more than one take. Huh. I don't recall running into that in Pro Tools

Edit 2: No, I can't have. I'm pretty sure I only used fades to ensure smooth transitions within comps! What's the point if I can't do that in Logic?

Edit 2: I got access to my Pro Tools rig. Can confirm that I can crossfade my comps and even do fades on individual takes without having to flatten them first. Why can't logic do this? Also confirmed that the plug ins really sound like ass. Made it sound a bit better by running Xpand through Sansamp as if expand was a D.I. bass signal and not an amped signal which I think might by the intention. Still doesn't sound as good as Logic (which does the same thing actually, but it does it by default) Reverb sounds pretty lacking too actually.

Also, I always thought I liked the routing options more in Pro Tools, but I have to route to a bus and then route that bus back to an auxiliary input to put effects on it? In Logic I just put my reverbs and delays ON that bus. :/

 

[sweepingDemon]

what version of pro tools and logic are you running, if both versions are 32bit or 64bit you can use rewire and make logic a slave to pro tools, that will allow you to use all the instruments from logic.

 

[From Ever]

I found the same thing, coming from Ableton though. I liked Live because it was a good electronica program (which I still use it for), but for metal it was not sufficient. I felt like the aggression and passion was getting toned because each part was being sliced up into a section or bar. Logic has a magic sound though - I took a GR Patch and loaded it in both. Both tracks were empy of anything but GR and the difference was undeniable. I've got a bunch of Ableton's plugins that I wouldn't mind using, but I'm going to see what I can get out of Logic's sounds. I will say this, their clean amp models are awesome and certainly better than GR is some respects.

 

[klinic]

I've go the 32-bit only pro tools 10 and what I assume is 64-but only Logic Pro X. The problem is, even if I could use rewire, I prefer Logics other plugins too (I think, maybe I'm just bad at setting them?)

It's a kerfuffle. I'm just using both of them as much as I can when I get the chance to. Maybe something will click and I'll realise I can fully use one or the other.

From Ever, could you fill me in on what GR is? I'm coming up with a total blank.

 

[From Ever]

I've go the 32-bit only pro tools 10 and what I assume is 64-but only Logic Pro X. The problem is, even if I could use rewire, I prefer Logics other plugins too (I think, maybe I'm just bad at setting them?)

It's a kerfuffle. I'm just using both of them as much as I can when I get the chance to. Maybe something will click and I'll realise I can fully use one or the other.

From Ever, could you fill me in on what GR is? I'm coming up with a total blank.

Guitar Rig. I'm using it until i can afford a proper rack.

 

[klinic]

Guitar Rig. I'm using it until i can afford a proper rack.

Oh god, I came up with garage Reverb. I might not be the sharpest tool in the shed.

I've heard pretty good results out of guitar rig, have you tried out bias as a cheaper alternative? I downloaded the demo and was pretty damn impressed. It was on sale just recently, not sure if it still is.

What sort of rack setup were you looking at?

 

[superash]

I can't deal with PT10 and having the listen back while bouncing, and I can't deal with not having AAX support for some of my favourite plugins in 11.

Best option I think would be to ReWire LP into PT.

 

[From Ever]

Oh god, I came up with garage Reverb. I might not be the sharpest tool in the shed.

I've heard pretty good results out of guitar rig, have you tried out bias as a cheaper alternative? I downloaded the demo and was pretty damn impressed. It was on sale just recently, not sure if it still is.

What sort of rack setup were you looking at?

At this point, I'm not sure. I'm pretty new to recording and felt it was a good place to start. I'd consider the Line 6 HD Pod Pro rack unit, the Axe FX is too pricey for me.

So far, I think I'm getting good results out of Guitar Rig, but I don't think it's as popular for a reason. There are times where it just doesn't sound as solid as I'd like, or it sounds assy. I'm using logic's models for a lot of cleans.

This is what I've achieved most recently with it:

https://soundcloud.com/fromever/still-life-portrait-sketch-mar2015

I still can't escape a somewhat conal sound, but I'm really at an impasse on it tonewise. Not sure if it's me being a noob or the limit of the software.

 

[S-O]

Write and record in Logic, bounce stems and import into Pro Tools. Edit and mix in Pro Tools! I generally do this with music I write in Ableton Live, I find mixing in Pro Tools to fit me best.

I track full bands and projects in Pro Tools, but many times find myself writing demos in Ableton Live.

 

[klinic]

I can't deal with PT10 and having the listen back while bouncing, and I can't deal with not having AAX support for some of my favourite plugins in 11.

Best option I think would be to ReWire LP into PT.

Might be tiring if you're writing Dream Theater length songs.

At this point, I'm not sure. I'm pretty new to recording and felt it was a good place to start. I'd consider the Line 6 HD Pod Pro rack unit, the Axe FX is too pricey for me.

So far, I think I'm getting good results out of Guitar Rig, but I don't think it's as popular for a reason. There are times where it just doesn't sound as solid as I'd like, or it sounds assy. I'm using logic's models for a lot of cleans.

This is what I've achieved most recently with it:

https://soundcloud.com/fromever/still-life-portrait-sketch-mar2015

I still can't escape a somewhat conal sound, but I'm really at an impasse on it tonewise. Not sure if it's me being a noob or the limit of the software.

Axe Fx is very expensive. Especially if you don't use a bunch of DIFFERENT amps. The Eleven Rack is a very nice modeller, but not a lot of options for modern metal. Pretty much just the Rectifier with a lot of EQ. Amazing for low gain though.

Write and record in Logic, bounce stems and import into Pro Tools. Edit and mix in Pro Tools! I generally do this with music I write in Ableton Live, I find mixing in Pro Tools to fit me best.

I track full bands and projects in Pro Tools, but many times find myself writing demos in Ableton Live.

Then I lose Logics plugins. :/ I also think I might prefer tracking in Pro Tools too.

 

[Cheap]

I just switched from Logic Pro to Pro Tools and I am so ecstatic each time I open up a session. I don't know if it's the change of pace after so many years of knowing Logic, but in Pro Tools I feel like I can write/do anything I'm after. I enjoyed the switch so much that I'm switching entirely from an old Macbook Pro to a Pro Tools optimized Windows PC. Should be sweet!

To each his own, but I will say that Apple doesn't support this software a whole lot and there are a ton of bugs that I haven't run into on a Pro Tools rig yet. They updated every once in awhile, but certain bugs have gone unresolved..

 

[KingAenarion]

Few suggestions for dealing with Pro Tools:

1) When you want to create, say, a new Reverb bus, don't create an Auxiliary, then assign a bus to it, then send to that bus. Do it this way:

a) Left click the output section you want to use (e.g. a send if creating an FX send, or the output section of the channel if creating a mix bus)
b) click new track
c) Create a new Stereo Auxiliary track and name it what it is (e.g. Plate Reverb, Drums Bus)

TADA!

2) Remember your selection hotkey criteria when doing I/O:

Option = Do to all
Option + Shift = Do to only selected
Cmd + Option = Number sequentially with I/O

3) When editing, try and get out of the habit of using Smart-tool. You'll find editing a LOT faster if mouse accuracy isn't part of the equation.

My edit process, which leads to a 15 minute prog epic have its drums completely manually edited in about 2 hours maximum. Make sure that your A-Z mode is enabled.

a) F7 to bring up selector tool. Either manually click or Tab to transient, Press "B" to cut the audio, Repeat for whole performance
b) Toggle between F6 and F8 to get between the grabber and trim tools. F8, drag the region, F6 drag the start/end back to where it needs to be, then move to the next region.
c) Press F7, Select entire area, Cmd+F to do a batch fade
d) c) Select the whole section after editing to listen back.make timing adjustments.

3) For creating a new Playlist, don't try clicking the .... annoying button. On a Mac Ctrl+\ create new playlist (Cmd+Ctrl+\ = duplicate), on Wandows, the Wandows Key+\ creates a new playlist, and Ctrl+Wandows+\ = duplicate

4) Upgrade to Pro Tools 12. The Annual Subscription plan makes is relatively easy. Things like Gain reduction metering is sexy, but mostly the 64-bit just makes everything easier, and it's generally more stable on both platforms.

5) Rewire has been suggested, but the real question is what instruments do you actually need, what plugin's do you actually need and what aren't you getting in Logic?

 

[Descent]

I just not see why you should use Pro Tools at all. Do everything in Logic and use Pro Tools just on case you need to trade sessions with someone or take your stuff to studio to get mixed. I think Logic does all of it better than PT and the main reason PT has been such a mainstay for so long is the fact that most studios use it.

 

[KingAenarion]

I just not see why you should use Pro Tools at all. Do everything in Logic and use Pro Tools just on case you need to trade sessions with someone or take your stuff to studio to get mixed. I think Logic does all of it better than PT and the main reason PT has been such a mainstay for so long is the fact that most studios use it.

You might think that, but Logic is slower at certain things than Pro Tools is if you work in certain ways.

Logic is also not always Logical in its design (neither is Pro Tools), and while it's certainly good at a lot of things there are things that many find clunky and a hindrance to workflow in Logic.

Probably the easiest DAW to quickly get a handle on, create music, and complete tasks ranging from simple comping up to advanced editing and routing is actually Presonus' Studio One, which does most of what Logic does better imo.

The other reason Pro Tools is standard, apart from being in every studio, is that it continues to be designed to work with audio first, whereas Logic is far more comfortable with its MIDI past. That's fine, but studios tend to work in audio.

Don't get me wrong, I absolutely LOATHE Pro Tools, and I think AVID are evil to the core... but Apple are not much better and should go screw themselves.

 

[klinic]

Haha, I have no idea how this got replies so long after I posted it. I now use Logic and Pro Tools just about equally, still hate both of them for entirely different reasons.

KingAenarion, that is very helpful advice! Advice I was certainly not expecting to get a year later, but just as helpful!