Marshall No Longer Using Dagnall Transformers

[technomancer]

So Marshall moved their transformer production in-house in Vietnam. Let the youtube storm begin

The issue is people outside the EU consider Marshall a high-end / boutique brand because the distributors have marketed them that way and marked up the prices to a ridiculous extent. The 1959HW amps are $1800 or less in their home market (I've bought 2 new 1959HWs from Germany for that this year) and the 2203X are even cheaper.

I also don't think this had anything to do with the buyout. I got one of my 59s in March and it already had the new transformers. This had clearlly been in the works for a while. I'd guess Dagnall was shutting down and Marshall was already winding the transformers for other amps there and just moved everything in house.

It's going to make a great topic for youtube rants for a while and drive up used Marshall prices though. Congrats to Jason for snagging the traffic first lol

As for the ringing issue he talks about, Friedman and Tramble both told him on his amp chat stream that they've gotten Heyboers and Mercuries like that in the past and Jason himself has admitted in comments that the amps sound fine.

 

[Das Gitarrenwiesel]

So Marshall moved their transformer production in-house in Vietnam. Let the youtube storm begin

The issue is people outside the EU consider Marshall a high-end / boutique brand because the distributors have marketed them that way and marked up the prices to a ridiculous extent. The 1959HW amps are $1800 or less in their home market (I've bought 2 new 1959HWs from Germany for that this year) and the 2203X are even cheaper.

I also don't think this had anything to do with the buyout. I got one of my 59s in March and it already had the new transformers. This had clearlly been in the works for a while. I'd guess Dagnall was shutting down and Marshall was already winding the transformers for other amps there and just moved everything in house.

It's going to make a great topic for youtube rants for a while and drive up used Marshall prices though. Congrats to Jason for snagging the traffic first lol

As for the ringing issue he talks about, Friedman and Tramble both told him on his amp chat stream that they've gotten Heyboers and Mercuries like that in the past and Jason himself has admitted in comments that the amps sound fine.

Provided the quality is the same ... personally I don't give a flying f --k where the my transformers are made. Ringing issue aside ... which if the amp is new, should be a warrantee return ... if the amp sounds like a high end Marshall it is a high end marshall. Reducing your costs to make a bigger profit margin is just capitalism folks.

 

[technomancer]

Provided the quality is the same ... personally I don't give a flying f --k where the my transformers are made. Ringing issue aside ... which if the amp is new, should be a warrantee return ... if the amp sounds like a high end Marshall it is a high end marshall. Reducing your costs to make a bigger profit margin is just capitalism folks.

Pretty much my take too, and Jason has said in comments once the ringing was taken care of the amp sounded fine. I can also say for a fact the nothing else changed as I've modded both of my 1959s. In fact I didn't notice the transformer thing until I saw Jason pointing it out.

 

[Werecow]

I guess the Marshall "image" in the rest of the world is similar to how Mesa Boogie is here. Marshall here was always just a well known make, but absolutely nothing special or high end about it. Good sounding, but just the average Joe amp that almost everyone eventually tries. Mesa, on the other hand, was always this almost untouchably expensive mystique brand to the average guitarist. I never even saw one growing up, let alone play one (and i still haven't played one). It's funny what limited availability or expense does for a brand's image.

 

[technomancer]

I guess the Marshall "image" in the rest of the world is similar to how Mesa Boogie is here. Marshall here was always just a well known make, but absolutely nothing special or high end about it. Good sounding, but just the average Joe amp that almost everyone eventually tries. Mesa, on the other hand, was always this almost untouchably expensive mystique brand to the average guitarist. I never even saw one growing up, let alone play one (and i still haven't played one). It's funny what limited availability or expense does for a brand's image.

Yep only difference is Mesa's domestic prices caught up with their export prices

 

[Das Gitarrenwiesel]

I guess the Marshall "image" in the rest of the world is similar to how Mesa Boogie is here. Marshall here was always just a well known make, but absolutely nothing special or high end about it. Good sounding, but just the average Joe amp that almost everyone eventually tries. Mesa, on the other hand, was always this almost untouchably expensive mystique brand to the average guitarist. I never even saw one growing up, let alone play one (and i still haven't played one). It's funny what limited availability or expense does for a brand's image.

Being a Brit ... Marshall has just always 'been there' ... My first Marshall Head was a JTM45 Block Logo that I bought for £50 from the music shop I worked in as a teenager ... it really wasn't seen as anything special ... just some old, dusty amp out back of the shop that they wanted to get rid of ... to make way for all the shiny new transistor amps coming in. I was then given a 100w Plexi head by an old stoner DJ ... to me as a kid starting out they were just 'workman' amps for serious rockers. To me this boutique thing is bollocks (sorry , balls for my US friends) - an amp is an amp
I played my first Mesa (borrowed) when I was about 20 ... it belonged to the vocalist of my band at the time and was one of the original converted Princetons I think. It was an evil, fire spitting little beast ... which believe it or not he used to play blues harmonica through!

 

[technomancer]

Being a Brit ... Marshall has just always 'been there' ... My first Marshall Head was a JTM45 Block Logo that I bought for £50 from the music shop I worked in as a teenager ... it really wasn't seen as anything special ... just some old, dusty amp out back of the shop that they wanted to get rid of ... to make way for all the shiny new transistor amps coming in. I was then given a 100w Plexi head by an old stoner DJ ... to me as a kid starting out they were just 'workman' amps for serious rockers. To me this boutique thing is bollocks (sorry , balls for my US friends) - an amp is an amp
I played my first Mesa (borrowed) when I was about 20 ... it belonged to the vocalist of my band at the time and was one of the original converted Princetons I think. It was an evil, fire spitting little beast ... which believe it or not he used to play blues harmonica through!

In hindsight I really wish I had grabbed some of the old Marshalls people were pretty much giving away in the early 90s when I was in college...

 

[Das Gitarrenwiesel]

In hindsight I really wish I had grabbed some of the old Marshalls people were pretty much giving away in the early 90s when I was in college...

Gotta love hindsight! When I've been busted for money in the past I've sold all sorts of good stuff I never should have parted with, including an immaculate 1955 Les Paul Special that funded my messy divorce. Marshalls are just tools ... and if they work well ... use em and be grateful.

 

[youngthrasher9]

I honestly don’t find the switch to be that concerning in terms of ethicality, because I personally doubt they’ve listed Dagnall transformers on their website/literature especially since the switch. We aren’t entitled to that info as consumers unless we ask or it is outright mislabeled somewhere, imo.

As far as price vs what you get? I’m on the fence because as someone else mentioned, they are cheap enough in the companies’ home country.

 

[Andromalia]

Yep only difference is Mesa's domestic prices caught up with their export prices

There are currently no export price since Mesa have to validate their new schematics through EU validation schemes. Mesa has bveen unavailable in the EU for like, 3 years now, because of this. OF COURSE just when I had the money for a JP2C. But overall you're correct, my Marshall is your Mesa, sort of. Same goes with Engl and other EU brands until eveybody decided to market themselves as premium or boutique gear to hike the prices up. It's like everything is labeled "premium" nowadays.

In hindsight I really wish I had grabbed some of the old Marshalls people were pretty much giving away in the early 90s when I was in college...

Well, in hindsight I wish I had enough money to buy anything when I was in college.

 

[Necky379]

Damn Dagnall is going out? Their 5150 OT always interested me but I don’t hear any reason to change out the stock OT.

 

[technomancer]

Damn Dagnall is going out? Their 5150 OT always interested me but I don’t hear any reason to change out the stock OT.

It's possible I'm wrong on that part, I thought I read it somewhere but haven't seen anything else about it

 

[MASS DEFECT]

if there's a backlash, it won't last. Same thing happened with Mesa Boogie when their old supplier closed. The problem with the Mesa transformers conversation is that they have geeks that mythologize the transformers to the amp's lineage and value. Even then, the conversation died a natural death when people noticed the amps with the new transformers sounded the same vs the old ones.

If the transformers are well built and to spec, it would probably sound the (90%?) same. Besides, when people mod their Marshalls, don't they also replace the transformers?

 

[technomancer]

if there's a backlash, it won't last. Same thing happened with Mesa Boogie when their old supplier closed. The problem with the Mesa transformers conversation is that they have geeks that mythologize the transformers to the amp's lineage and value. Even then, the conversation died a natural death when people noticed the amps with the new transformers sounded the same vs the old ones.

If the transformers are well built and to spec, it would probably sound the (90%?) same. Besides, when people mod their Marshalls, don't they also replace the transformers?

The real comedy with Mesa is that they switched back to their original transformer supplier

I haven't seen it here but I know some were worried about the plate voltage of the new Marshall transformers... the 1959HW with the new transformers I was working on today was 490v on the plates. So again, the new iron is fine.

 

[MatrixClaw]

I've never even heard of Dagnall transformers, so this is of no consequence to me.

 

[Das Gitarrenwiesel]

Hollywood will get hold of a script based on all of this and we'll get another Transformers movie!

 

[LeftOurEyes]

Hollywood will get hold of a script based on all of this and we'll get another Transformers movie!

Don't say this too loud, Michael Bay might hear you.

 

[FitRocker33]

There are so many current builders doing the “Marshall” thing better than Marshall has for the past 20-30 years in terms of quality and price point.

Let Marshall sink…they are overdue to reap what they’ve sown. Sorry but it’s true

 

[technomancer]

There are so many current builders doing the “Marshall” thing better than Marshall has for the past 20-30 years in terms of quality and price point.

Let Marshall sink…they are overdue to reap what they’ve sown. Sorry but it’s true

Agree to disagree, but I'm not stupid enough to pay what the US distributor is charging so there is that. I'm actually curious to see what happens as I'm hearing the US distributor has shut down. If we can start getting these at closer to what the EU is paying without waiting for international shipping I'm going to have a blast with mods as the 1959HW is pretty much an impossible platform to beat for $1800.