Mix brightness help

[omgdrdoom]

Hi all! I'm relatively new to the mix/master process (just a couple of months in) and I'm working on some tracks that are tough to define an exact subgenre, I'd say blackened heavy metal best describes it. I feel like it sounds decent but it's too bright of a sound overall. I've tried reamping guitars with a darker tone, using different drum samples, soaking the vocals in reverb/delay, and adjusting faders and track EQ quite a bit. Everything is still fairly bright overall and doesn't give the "dark" sound we're going for.

Without any audio samples, is there any advice I can get on tips and tricks for darker mix tones? Thanks in advance!

 

[c7spheres]

Mostly what yo uput in is what you get out. GEt teh best tracks you can first and do genderal levels. If it's good with minor things then maybe start mixing, but if it ain't godo right off the bat then back to the drawing board. It seems impossible and can take a lot of time and energy but its worth it in the long run. Sounds like from what you're saying go back to drawing board and work more on your sounds, tones and levels.

 

[GunpointMetal]

Hi all! I'm relatively new to the mix/master process (just a couple of months in) and I'm working on some tracks that are tough to define an exact subgenre, I'd say blackened heavy metal best describes it. I feel like it sounds decent but it's too bright of a sound overall. I've tried reamping guitars with a darker tone, using different drum samples, soaking the vocals in reverb/delay, and adjusting faders and track EQ quite a bit. Everything is still fairly bright overall and doesn't give the "dark" sound we're going for.

Without any audio samples, is there any advice I can get on tips and tricks for darker mix tones? Thanks in advance!

What are you using to monitor (IE speakers in a room, headphones, a home stereo in the garage)? And are you using reference tracks? Have a reference on hand while you're going is a good way to get started. Find something that has the overall tonality you're after and see where yours is different. And keep in mind that frequencies add together, so having a super clear bass tone and a super clear guitar tone and super clear cymbals and vocals will probably mean you end up with a build-up of "bright". Do EQ and mix moves with the whole song playing, don't make those decisions in solo.

 

[BMFan30]

Maybe your monitors or listening environment is too bright? I know on my Rockit 8's (1st Gen)

I have to slightly boost the highs on various mixer/bus or master channel cause everything on my end comes out a bit too dark for my taste.

This also means I could go overboard on the highs too easy and have to listen on different speakers/rooms/cars to check the higher frequencies with the mixing environment I gots to my own name, since I don't feel that I could feel those frequencies out on my own without the assistance of other listening environments.

 

[Drew]

Hi all! I'm relatively new to the mix/master process (just a couple of months in) and I'm working on some tracks that are tough to define an exact subgenre, I'd say blackened heavy metal best describes it. I feel like it sounds decent but it's too bright of a sound overall. I've tried reamping guitars with a darker tone, using different drum samples, soaking the vocals in reverb/delay, and adjusting faders and track EQ quite a bit. Everything is still fairly bright overall and doesn't give the "dark" sound we're going for.

Without any audio samples, is there any advice I can get on tips and tricks for darker mix tones? Thanks in advance!

I mean, I'm going to state the obvious here, but sometimes it needs to be said and throwing it out there CAN be helpful.

If your mix/master is too bright, then something in it is too bright, and you need to fix that.

What exactly is it that sounds bright to you? Blackened metal is making me think maybe the drum overheads/cymbals are the culprit here; if you're using some sort of VST drum sim, and if you have this degree of control in it, turning down any cymbal spot mics and up the room mic might help as well as give you a little more lo-fi of a sound anyway, which I suspect would be authentic here. After that, well... See i there are any treble boosts going on in any "mix" parameters inside your VST and back those off/potentially even some modest high shelf cuts, as well.

But if your mix is too bright, then some part of it specifically is too brght. A/B yours against several mixes you like and really try to listen to specific instruments, and figure out where yours is wrong. Then fix it.

The literal answer here is you have too much treble and need to turn it down, but it's probably not everywhere in the mix so much as one specific instrument (with cymbals being a very likely culprit), and there's a few ways you can do this, either with EQ directly, with the balance of the "bright" parts of the drum kit against everything else, and with the balance between virtual spot mics and room mics.

 

[jl-austin]

Ummm, maybe this will sound stupid. But are you using a Bass guitar?

Me personally, my "fullness of sound" comes from how well the bass comes through (too much is BAD though).

 

[omgdrdoom]

Thanks everyone! Tons of great help here for someone very new to all of this. I'm trying to research and learn as much as possible from random videos, online searches, etc. while understanding that every mix is going to be different. Learning what everything does has been quite eye opening for me.

I started using a reference more while mixing and added more low end and it sounds much, much better to me now. I'm tracking using a real bass but the low end wasn't present enough. I turned the fader up slightly but more importantly made a lot of changes to my mix bus FX chain. I think some of my saturation and other plugins I was using was stripping the low end too much and causing the mix to fall flat. There are more dynamics now while remaining loud and has a "full" sound.

Thanks again!

 

[Drew]

I started using a reference more while mixing and added more low end and it sounds much, much better to me now. I'm tracking using a real bass but the low end wasn't present enough. I turned the fader up slightly but more importantly made a lot of changes to my mix bus FX chain. I think some of my saturation and other plugins I was using was stripping the low end too much and causing the mix to fall flat. There are more dynamics now while remaining loud and has a "full" sound.

Another dumb-sounding observation, but one that's helped me a LOT over the years.

When working on a mix, start by simply panning and setting levels. Working with DI instruments is a little more challenging in this respect in that you pretty much have to have some sort of VST running on them just to get an "amped" sound... but, you first step in any mix is basically to just set levels, pan, and listen.

Don't reach for a single plugin until you've taken stock of the mix, found problems, and know exactly how you want to solve those problems. What you're describing to me here sounds a lot like you're starting with a lot of plugins active because that's what you're "supposed" to do in a mix, and that can often cause a lot more problems right off the bat that otherwise wouldn't be there - like, a saturation plugin eating your low end and not realizing that until you go back and turn it off.

 

[omgdrdoom]

Another dumb-sounding observation, but one that's helped me a LOT over the years.

When working on a mix, start by simply panning and setting levels. Working with DI instruments is a little more challenging in this respect in that you pretty much have to have some sort of VST running on them just to get an "amped" sound... but, you first step in any mix is basically to just set levels, pan, and listen.

Don't reach for a single plugin until you've taken stock of the mix, found problems, and know exactly how you want to solve those problems. What you're describing to me here sounds a lot like you're starting with a lot of plugins active because that's what you're "supposed" to do in a mix, and that can often cause a lot more problems right off the bat that otherwise wouldn't be there - like, a saturation plugin eating your low end and not realizing that until you go back and turn it off.

This is excellent advice and something I'm learning about the hard way! Haha

I stripped everything off my mix and started from scratch and it produced much better results with less FX than I originally had. I had a lot of stuff I thought I was "supposed" to use on my mix bus, but found that those were hurting my mix more than anything. Settings levels without all of the effects and then fine tuning after has made a world of a difference.

I know some people might feel insulted when you give them an obvious solution, but I always appreciate any advice possible because you never know when someone never learned the basics. I think that was my issue when I started learning, I tried diving into the deep end before getting the absolute basics of mixing down. I'm sort of starting over now and it's working out quite well.

Thanks again for the tips. Keep them coming if you think of anything else!

 

[Drew]

I know some people might feel insulted when you give them an obvious solution, but I always appreciate any advice possible because you never know when someone never learned the basics. I think that was my issue when I started learning, I tried diving into the deep end before getting the absolute basics of mixing down. I'm sort of starting over now and it's working out quite well.

Dude, you don't know how long it took me to learn some of these "obvious" solutions. I first started recording more than 20 years ago, I've had a LONG time to fuck things up and learn the hard way.

I think the one thing I'd toss out there that I think has only really become clear to me in the last few years (mostly while working on an americana/roots rock/folk project with my dad and uncle a few years back) was how much of a good mix comes from a good arrangement. If you can sit down and listen to the idea of a song, maybe play through it, and figure out where your "hook" is and what part of the accompaniment that hook is really kind of hung off, what's driving the song, whats important and what's not... and then carving out space for all of the elements that are going to be really critical for the song, not in the mix, per se, but that if it's a song with a, oh, prominant bass groove, and that's really the interesting rhythmic driving part of the song, that there's plenty of "space" in the low end and low-center of the mix, and the bass drum isn't stepping all over the part but is accenting it, etc... Or, if it's an acoustic guitar providing the energy for the rhythm section, then again the drum part isn't hitting the same accents but is complimenting them, and if there are any other rhythm insturments they're in a different register, different tonality, and in a different part of the stereo mix, etc. Trying to get a song together with a busy acoustic part, a busy keyboard part, and a busy electrc part, and it's going to suck, no matter how cool the parts are, unless you're VERY careful about where you put them in the mix and how they interlock ("never say never, just say probably not").

I swear just spending some time up front thinking how i want a song to function before I even start tracking has done more than anything else to save me headaches when it comes time to actually mix. Even simple stuff that I figured out ages ago on some level but never really fully extrapolated, like making sure the melody guitars in my instrumental stuff had very different tones and stayed in very different registers than my rhythm guitars... It's like Tetris. You can't fit two things in the same space. You can minimize the damage with careful mixing, but you can stop it from happening in the first place if you just spend some time thinking about how you want to assemble the song.

 

[omgdrdoom]

Another dumb-sounding observation, but one that's helped me a LOT over the years.

When working on a mix, start by simply panning and setting levels. Working with DI instruments is a little more challenging in this respect in that you pretty much have to have some sort of VST running on them just to get an "amped" sound... but, you first step in any mix is basically to just set levels, pan, and listen.

Don't reach for a single plugin until you've taken stock of the mix, found problems, and know exactly how you want to solve those problems. What you're describing to me here sounds a lot like you're starting with a lot of plugins active because that's what you're "supposed" to do in a mix, and that can often cause a lot more problems right off the bat that otherwise wouldn't be there - like, a saturation plugin eating your low end and not realizing that until you go back and turn it off.

Alright so I made some changes and we released this song a few days ago. If you have a couple minutes to check it out, I'd definitely be open to any criticism or thoughts on the overall mix.

 

[Drew]

Based on your band logo, I am NOT the person you want providing feedback on your mix, since we have very, very, very different mix aesthetics.

 

[omgdrdoom]

Based on your band logo, I am NOT the person you want providing feedback on your mix, since we have very, very, very different mix aesthetics.

Very fair! Haha, I guess I just assume everyone on SSO is into some form of extreme music. All good, I greatly appreciate the tips throughout the thread.

 

[ArtDecade]

Winger is about as extreme as this forum gets, you maniac.

 

[Drew]

Very fair! Haha, I guess I just assume everyone on SSO is into some form of extreme music. All good, I greatly appreciate the tips throughout the thread.

I play bluesy instrumental shred on my seven.

 

[kamello]

Alright so I made some changes and we released this song a few days ago. If you have a couple minutes to check it out, I'd definitely be open to any criticism or thoughts on the overall mix.

Saw the logo and thought "oh shit, this will sound terrible".
But it didn't! Great job on the mix