Mix feedback needed

[Descent]

https://soundcloud.com/descentintomadness/winters-garden-mix3/s-mf5Lr

Trying to mix off of recent analog tape transfer of an old recording and keep as much from the original performance as possible, so I'd like some feedback on this.
It was recorded in a high end studio by a low end engineer (I'd like to get my hands on him for a few things)...so trying to tweak some things and possibly re-release in the future.

 

[Filipe83]

I'm a beginner in engineering, but i think the mix is fine pan-wise. The problem seems to be on the tones, that are really demo-like. All in all perhaps just a little less volume on the cymbals, but overall i think what it separates from a pro track seems to be the recorded tones.

 

[Descent]

Hey Filipe, thanks for checking it out. This was actually recorded in 2003 in a professional studio on analog tape, actually the most expensive studio in Houston. I agree with you though, if I had access to the engineer that tracked it back then, I'd probably wring his neck
Thanks for your input.

 

[Axewield31]

I'm only a beginner with mixing and everything but the cymbals are really overpowering. You might want to back off the vocals a little too.
The tones aren't very good either. The guitars lack clarity and midrange.

 

[ZachK]

Hey Filipe, thanks for checking it out. This was actually recorded in 2003 in a professional studio on analog tape, actually the most expensive studio in Houston. I agree with you though, if I had access to the engineer that tracked it back then, I'd probably wring his neck
Thanks for your input.

This feels like a demo.

The cymbals are overpowering during the verses. Take out a little bit of 15k on the hats, soften them up a little bit.
The toms sound a bit muffled and lack clarity, mostly the lower toms.

The guitar tones for the most part sound like demo tones. They need some work.
They fight with the bass a little bit for low end space.
The lead tone is decent, but could be brought out a little more.

The vocals are fine. I feel like the could use a little de-essing though.

My big complaint is the fact that the reverb just gets cut right at the end, without much decay, it doesn't feel natural.

Going to tape doesn't mean too much. You'll get a little warmth and tape hiss, but it's since been converted to digital and compressed (signal degradation), and uploaded to soundcloud (more signal degradation)

I'd pull the cymbals back in the mix
Add some attack to the kick to make it a little snappier
Give the bass more attack as well (5kish)
EQ, compress, and possibly reamp the guitars
Bring the vocals down a little and let the reverb naturally decay at the end of the track.

Just my .02

 

[Descent]

Thanks for your feedback guys,
unfortunately can't reamp as this was recorded on 24 track analog and all the tracks were printed the way they are.
I toned down the cymbals, redid the vocal rides and touched up the guitars somewhat.
Here is the revised version, let me know what you think:
https://soundcloud.com/descentintomadness/winters-garden-mix4/s-hVSgE

 

[illimmigrant]

Hey there! I live in Houston too and have drooled over the pictures of Sugar Hill studios, wishing I could spend a day in there to learn. If I hadn't read in the description that this was recorded there, I never would have guessed it (no offense). I'd love to hear the raw tracks to see if it's the mix that needs help, or if things were just poorly engineered at recording and you are really just working with what you have.

The second mix sounds better. I personally like a more up front, in your face mix than what you seem to be going for here, which is the "in-the-room" type of vibe. Very raw and definitely more 80's sounding in your example with the use of ambiance and big reverb on the vocals. The first one was super harsh on the high end. The vocals are a little loud and I hear them going up and down in volume at certain parts of the song in a strange way. The drums are too far in the background to have the kind of power I'd like to hear out of a rock track like this one. Do you remember how the drums were mic'd up? The hi hat and ride sound kinda center-ish to me. Kinda like a mono room mic was used with an XY pair on the overheads instead of a spaced pair for a wider spread. I could go on and on with questions, but don't want to ramble any further haha. Can you give some insight to the tracking and mic'ing? this may have just been the direction you were going for from the start.

 

[Descent]

@illimigrant - the engineering on this was definitely an issue, coming back to this and hearing the raw sounds I am pretty much locked up with what I can do on quite a few of these things.

There seems to be some weird aliasing on the drum mics that I'm working to keep down, a lot of nasty bleed on both ride and hh cymbals with not enough focus.

The guitars also suffer from a lot of issues that I am trying to fix with subtractive eq.

I can say that maybe the vocals only sound somewhat close to what you can get in that studio.

It was a budget session which still wasn't cheap, in 2003 we paid $3000 to walk out with 5 song EP from there on analog tape, now that could probably be done with this quality for around $800 or maybe probably better. There's still this "sheen" on the tape that I dig, regardless of what happened on this session.

I am trying to do this without sound replacement...so far I enforced the kick and snare some with EZDrummer samples but that's about it, everything else is pretty much from the original session.


Here's the latest mix:
https://soundcloud.com/descentintomadness/winters-garden-mix5/s-b1q6i