ROTER more affordable Customs

[Apophis]

I have many quotes with really basic guitars where ending price is like a for any custom guitar we make. But there is a possibility to make that costs lower simply by buying a lot bigger amount of premium woods, what we can't do because of costs and we can't be sure what wood customer will chose after order...

as standard we always do ntb designs, multilaminated necks, figured tops, backs headstock caps, custom weird shapes etc, what requires a lot more work to do, wood is more expensive because we have to have longer pieces with highest quality etc.

So..

... we started to think about building some cheaper, but still custom shop versions of our guitars. So we need your help with shapes you would like to have the most.

All guitars will be made from premium woods, but to save costs we can't give to many options for a change. Of course customer can choose number of pickups, brand etc. As standard we will offer custom made Merlin pickups from their line and customer can order copy of almost all existing pickups or can have one made for his needs in the same price.

Construction - bolt-on with ultra access for playability.
Body - alder, basswood, mahogany, ash, maple
Neck - maple
Scale - 25,5"
Fingerboard - 3 layers ebony/maple/ebony or maple/ebony/maple
Frets - 24 Dunlop 6000
Nut - graphite
Bridge - tune-o-matic or hardtail with strings thru body
Finish - high gloss polyester or matte gloss, almost all colors available

Guitars will be available in 6 and 7 string versions.

We think that price for a a 7 string version with custom Merlin pickups will be something about 800$ plus shipping. Price may be different when customer will choose other pickups.

DON'T THINK ABOUT THIS GUITARS LIKE MASS MARKET CRAP. THOSE GUITARS WILL BE STILL CUSTOM MADE FOR A CUSTOMER BUT WITH LIMITED AMOUNT OF MODS AVAILABLE. THIS WAY WE THINK WE WILL GIVE A POSSIBILITY TO HAVE STILL COMPLETELY CUSTOM MADE GUITAR IN LOWER PRICE.

Of course guitars will be made only on request, no classic production models like in stores where you will only pick one and buy, we simply have to build it from scratch

So right now this is only an idea, let me know what do you think about that move and then I will be sure what do do
Thanks


18.02.2008
So at this stage we have specs like that

Construction - bolt-on with ultra access for playability and small heel.
Body – Ash, Mahogany, Alder, No tops.
Neck – 1 Piece Wenge, Thin-Flat Profile
Strings – 6, 7, 8
Scale - 26" and 28"
Pickups – Merlin or supplied by customer
Fingerboard – Ebony
Inlays - None, side dots only
Frets - 24 Stainless Steel
Nut - graphite
Bridge - tune-o-matic or hardtail with strings thru body, (ABM or Hipshot for 8 strings)
Tuners - standard or locking - depends from ending costs
Finish - laquer will be high gloss or matte polyester finish, vax and oil or request

Price:
- 6 & 7 string - 800$
- 8 string - below 1000$ - but this depends from bridge costs at the end

so we have to decide what shapes will be avilable.

 

[loktide]

that's some good news.

so, what body shapes will be available? and would you also consider doing 8-strings based on this?

 

[Apophis]

shapes is something what I ask I would like to know what YOU guys want to have

cheap 8 string is not so easy option, cause we need more expensive hardware, but we can think about that but to be honest I can't beat Agile or Schecter prices so easy

 

[MF_Kitten]

who cares if you "beat" schecter or agile, if you offered unique 8 string guitars with high quality and kinda-custom specs, people would definitely buy them!
there´s a reason why i talked to you instead of buying an intrepid

now, as for shapes, you should always offer some sort of superstrat, as people always ask for those

another shape i´d love to see is the one you did for that 10 string in your avatar. it´s a really awesome singlecut!

i don´t really know what other kinds of shapes you should do...

i think longer scale lengths should be available too, for an added cost. as long as the other specs are the same, and you only changed the length of the neck, and the placement of the bridge, the price difference shouldn´t be too much higher, right?

i see great oppurtunities here... if the specs are "stock", and the customer agrees to pay extra for longer scale and 8 strings (hardware and all), then the prices could get really affordable!

are you looking for original shapes? we could all chime in with photoshop mockups

also, you could look back at all the guitars you´ve made, and see what people keep asking for as far as shapes go?

 

[B36arin]

This looks really, really interesting! I'd love a custom, but I can't afford $2k-3k. The only thing that I find missing in the options is an added scale length. It would be awesome to be able to choose from maybe 25,5", 27" and 28.625". All three lengths are quite standard, so it shouldn't be that much harder to make them, should it? The only problem I can see is that it might be harder to get longer pieces of wood for the neck and fretboard. Is there any chance of getting additional scale lengths?

 

[MF_Kitten]

i think you could save some money on dropping the 3-layer fretboards too, or maybe you could make it 2 layers if you really want to layer it?

i don´t see a reason to keep the multi-laminated fretboards on a "budget" custom, unless the cost difference is unnoticeable?

also, if you´re going to offer longer scales, PLEASE offer 30" or 30,5" scale too!

 

[Lilarcor]

now, as for shapes, you should always offer some sort of superstrat, as people always ask for those

another shape i´d love to see is the one you did for that 10 string in your avatar. it´s a really awesome singlecut!

+1 on these shapes.
You should consider a V shape as well. I don't like them but a lot of people seem to ask for them.

You should also offer stainless steel frets maybe for an upcharge as they seem pretty popular as well (I would want them).
I'd also like the option of an additional top wood and different neck woods but probably that's too much of a custom.

I really like the idea of affordable high quality semi-custom guitars as prices currently seem to explode. I would definitely consider buying one of these.

 

[7deadlysins666]

Genius idea. Moser guitar does this as well...accept their prices are still expensive haha. Their Templar series, is their barebones guitars. How they have them though, the prices start out at $1200 thats Quad bridge, single humbucker, walnut body, bolt on maple neck, your fretboard choice, your body/headstock choice. The only finish offered is just tung oil, which looks great on the walnut. But from there, if you want you can add on things, basically you can add on Anything you want...for an upcharge. (Adding things neck pickup, different bridge, hardware color, multilaminate body (things like Walnut/Flamed Maple\Walnut, etc). They are still custom made guitars, but the build times are shorter because of the simplicity of most of them. So it would be a great idea to do this.

As for shapes, I would really like a V, either an offset Rhoads type V, or an old school rounded type V.

 

[Joel]

that price is killer...
i was reading it thinking the price would still be over $1500
this is good news

as for shapes, probably a super-strat, maybe a les paul style single cut.

 

[B36arin]

Would it be possible to get "special" finishes/inlays?

 

[MF_Kitten]

you should offer that shape i wanted

but seriously though, i don´t really know what kinds of shapes there are out there that could be done... i´d definitely offer different superstrat shapes though, like a more schecter/esp style with rounder horn tips, arched tops and "bevels" along the horns if you know what i mean

maybe a EBMM JP/silhouette-type superstrat too?

maybe a star-shape like the xiphos-looking thing you made.

you should offer some bass-inspired shapes too! i would LOVE to have an ibanez BTB body shape on a guitar!

 

[Apophis]

Thanks for all of that

1. shape - I was thinking about some superstrats, V-shape and singlecut. If you guys want to design something, why not, we don't have to copy anything, but we have to have 3-5 available shapes without any shape-mods available, I can make just any shape
2. ss frets - this can be an option - it won't add much, so maybe price even can stay at the same level
3. tops - we were thinking about that and it was an option first, but then we realized that we have to have some REAL differences between those guitars and all other customs we do or did. Top (flame maple) costs 200$ in our customs, so we can't give that for free, making that as an option make this guitars just like the others, we really want to keep those simple and "cheap"
4. scales - of course there is such possibility but to save costs I have to make more than one neck with specific scale so:
a - we can make guitars for a specific market like SS.org users and then we can have way longer scales than any other manufacturer, so 27", 28.625" or 30" scale is possible
b - other buyers - for them we have to have "standard" scale options also
so all depends from buyers. At first I think SS.org users are my main goal

 

[7deadlysins666]

What would the build time be on one of these, and when are you going to start building them?

 

[cddragon]

I think it's just the right time to start saving money
Great Idea Sebastian!

 

[Apophis]

1. inlays - sorry, but that option won't be available imo, cause it costs a lot (100$ at least for small one) and I want price to be low
2. I will start ASAP I will have any order
3. building time - I think 1 month is possible

 

[MF_Kitten]

here are my suggestions then:

-RG-style (maybe RGA too?)
-superstrat esp/schecter/agile style arch-top superstrat
-V style (i don´t know what variation on this people want, so let them decide )
-star shape (xiphos-style or otherwise. i love the xiphos over most other star shapes though )
-singlecut style (like the 10 string in your avatar! )
-ibanez BTB-style shape (maybe? at least consider it )
-EBMM JP/Silhouette-style shape
-tele shape?
-prs dual-cutaway style?

those are the only not-so-obvious shapes i could come up with from the top of my head. there are lots that are a little brand-specific, but that could be considered, like the schecter 00 shape for example.

this sounds like a great option for people who want something better than production models without having to gather money for a full custom

 

[yevetz]

WOW!!!!

Seb 800$ is more than awesome. You are making good things for guitarplayers I am on Sherman preorder now. But anyway check your PM in 10-20 mins

 

[Apophis]

so overall I think we all going into some less-option-available custom guitar, where every order will be way different than the other That was not my main intention, but I see that will be the end

this way it will be really hard for us to keep that price stable cause I can't ask everybody different amount of money everytime, I wanted to keep the price stable and give some small amount of options available to make more custom feel

 

[7deadlysins666]

so overall I think we all going into some less-option-available custom guitar, where every order will be way different than the other That was not my main intention, but I see that will be the end

this way it will be really hard for us to keep that price stable cause I can't ask everybody different amount of money everytime, I wanted to keep the price stable and give some small amount of options available to make more custom feel

You should do the Upcharge thing. Basically you have your Base price that includes all the standard options: bolt on, body wood(s), fretboard wood, hardware, etc. But if someone wants something thats Not in the base price...something extra, just make it an up charge for that. Like if they want a fancy top, you said that was $200(for flamed maple atleast), if your Base price is $800 then after adding the top, the guitar will still only cost $1000 which for a custom handmade guitar, is a Damn cheap price.

That way you Can offer outrageously Awesome guitars for an amazing price, and people can still add non standard options like extra scale length or fancy top, when they get into the true custom stuff, just charge them your regular upcharge prices, so you don't loose money.

 

[yevetz]

You should do the Upcharge thing. Basically you have your Base price that includes all the standard options: bolt on, body wood(s), fretboard wood, hardware, etc. But if someone wants something thats Not in the base price...something extra, just make it an up charge for that. Like if they want a fancy top, you said that was $200(for flamed maple atleast), if your Base price is $800 then after adding the top, the guitar will still only cost $1000 which for a custom handmade guitar, is a Damn cheap price.

That way you Can offer outrageously Awesome guitars for an amazing price, and people can still add non standard options like extra scale length or fancy top, when they get into the true custom stuff, just charge them your regular upcharge prices, so you don't loose money.

I think it's good opinion. What do you think, Sebastian?