NBDx2: 12 Strings Of Spector And Altelier Z

[cardinal]

Been wanting a nice 6-string Jazz forever and finally did it. Atelier Z M285 imported from Japan. Nice light weight. Balances great. Sounds AWESOME. Wish the spacing were a bit narrower (it’s 19mm), but I hope I can get use to it.

The Spector I picked up to try 35” scales. Not really digging it, but it’s not awful. Will give it a few days and see. I’ve used NS5s for a while, so it sounds and otherwise feels like what I like. But it’s very light and has real bad neck dive, which isn’t helping playability with the longer neck.

EDIT: spelled Atelier wrong in the title. Can someone tell me how to fix that?

 

[cardinal]

Spector almost surely is going back. Fretwork and neck feel awesome. Sounds great. But so hard to play. The Spector shape puts the first fret far from your body, and now make the scale longer, make the neck heavier, and give it a super light body...

The Atelier is killer. Adjusting to the string spacing quickly. Looks and aounds like a great Jazz, but with two extra strings. Was worried it’d be a boat anchor but it’s just right. Fretwork is solid. Really stoked about it.

Probably selling my NS5s and getting another M285.

 

[narad]

Awesome, fellow Atelier owner! Did you buy new or used?

 

[Leviathus]

Exquisite taste as usual, HNBD!

 

[cardinal]

Awesome, fellow Atelier owner! Did you buy new or used?

Had to buy new. I very specifically wanted the M285, which seems hard to find. It’s not even on their website.

I’m pretty impressed. It’s very nicely built.

 

[A-Branger]

fuck me that headstock is huge
wonder why they didnt do a 4+2 instead

Happy neck dive day for you! .... hehe

 

[cardinal]

The angle of that pic maybe makes it look larger than it is. Here it is straight on:

There is a bit of dive, but nothing compared to that Spector.

I do kinda prefer the 4+2 though

 

[A-Branger]

yeah 4+2 looks neat, and ooooh that other jazz, thats a nice color top.

and really? you have more neckdive with the spector? even with that huge headstock and heavy tunners?, or do you ahve the hipshot light ones?

 

[cardinal]

yeah 4+2 looks neat, and ooooh that other jazz, thats a nice color top.

and really? you have more neckdive with the spector? even with that huge headstock and heavy tunners?, or do you ahve the hipshot light ones?

That Spector is very hard to play. I’m going to have to return it. The way the Spector hangs, all the weight is “in front” of the front strap pin, so it just dives straight down. I have two Spector NS5s that are just fine. I’m really surprised and disappointed, but to me at least the NS-JH6 is just unplayable.

 

[A-Branger]

actually didnt realize the Jazz has the strap pin at the 12th, vs the Spector that is around the 15th. that helps to explain a bit

 

[cardinal]

actually didnt realize the Jazz has the strap pin at the 12th, vs the Spector that is around the 15th. that helps to explain a bit

And the Spector has a very light body. Which is great as far as it goes, and maybe with a 34” scale 4-string neck it works. But with a longer 35” scale neck and the much wider (heavier) 6-string neck, I just can’t seem to make it work.

 

[Scordare]

Man, that Atelier Z is nice..I need to check that brand out. I have never been a Spector fan and that one raises red flags to me..short upper horn, 24 frets and 35" scale really puts the neck out there. I had a Brice 6 with similar specs and it was also uncomfortable to play, especially with my short arms. 21/22 frets are mandatory on long scale basses for me.

 

[LordCashew]

24 frets and 35" scale really puts the neck out there... 21/22 frets are mandatory on long scale basses for me.

Additional frets don't themselves make the nut farther away. That's really more a function of upper horn length/shortness. Have these factors been related in your experience?

 

[Scordare]

Additional frets don't themselves make the nut farther away. That's really more a function of upper horn length/shortness. Have these factors been related in your experience?

I have got to disagree.. in order to be able to access the additional frets, the neck & bridge/scale is typically shifted towards the nut compared to 22 fret instruments. The lower cutout could alternately be deepened, but that changes the body shape. Extending the upper horn is a way to compensate for the extended neck but again changes the body shape. Look at how much empty body area there is between the bridge and edge of body compared to the Atelier Z. The neck on that Spector is way out there and the small, light body makes the neck dive worse.

 

[cardinal]

Man, that Atelier Z is nice..I need to check that brand out. I have never been a Spector fan and that one raises red flags to me..short upper horn, 24 frets and 35" scale really puts the neck out there. I had a Brice 6 with similar specs and it was also uncomfortable to play, especially with my short arms. 21/22 frets are mandatory on long scale basses for me.

Additional frets don't themselves make the nut farther away. That's really more a function of upper horn length/shortness. Have these factors been related in your experience?

I think it boils down to where the front strap pin is (closer to the nut will balance better), but as more frets and longer scales are added, I think there's a tendency to just extend the nut further from the existing body, which then causes the front strap pin to be further way from the nut.

If a bass was designed from the ground up to be 24 frets with a longer scale, it can balance just fine. But when you take an existing design and try to just add frets and scale, things can go wrong, especially when you're concerned about keeping the body light weight.

I was just really shocked by the NS-JH6 because my NS5s (24 frets, 34" scale) balance just fine. I found a ridiculously wide leather strap in an old gig bag, and I almost convinced myself that it made the NS-JH6 comfortable to play, but then I switched to the M285 and felt what truly is comfortable to play, so I just need to give up on the Spector. Love how it sounds and plays great, but the fatigue from having to prop up the neck is just no fun.

 

[A-Branger]

Man, that Atelier Z is nice..I need to check that brand out. I have never been a Spector fan and that one raises red flags to me..short upper horn, 24 frets and 35" scale really puts the neck out there. I had a Brice 6 with similar specs and it was also uncomfortable to play, especially with my short arms. 21/22 frets are mandatory on long scale basses for me.

nope

you are thinking like on a guitar were the bridge position shift between 21/22 and 24 frets guitar (compare a 22vs24 PRS).

Basses on the other hand have such a long scale that the bridges are already on the edge of the body. Theres no shifting position or moving of the nut/bridge area. The difference comes on the actual size of the body, and the reason why I only like 24 fret basses and the why they all should be like that. Having a 24 fret bass pushes you to design a smaller body bass in order to be able to reach those extra frets. Compare an Ibanez SR vs a Fender jazz with 21 fret. See the difference in body size. And if you dont think a Jazz bass have a big body then go and see a pic of it with no pickguard. They are HUGE. Sadly every attempt of a Jazz bass with 24 fret only results on a similar sized body with an extended lower cut, which makes for a funny looking body as the top horn remains on the same spot, instead of extending the horn. See Mayones for an example. Also Jazz and Fender style basses (like 85% of the bass market really) have big boddies, both in size, width, big thick horns and thick full boddies

the difference comes in where the strap pin is located. Basses need a long horn with the strap pin around the 12th fret. See my point above, the Spector has the strap pin around the 15th fret, that is what makes the nut to shift to your left and to make the bass more neck heavy