US Political Discussion: Biden/Harris Edition (Rules in OP)

[Riff the Road Dog]

In other events, John Oliver started his new season with a bang Sunday. He's offered Clarence Thomas a million $ a year for life and a brand new 2.5 mil "motor coach" if he resigns from the Court in thirty days. Contends it will be an excellent test of the quality of his good friendships with billionaires like Crow.

 

[narad]

Oh no, the basement crew of '24 featuring @TheBlackBard @StevenC @narad are teaming up against me...what will I do???

Ha, you think we have basements here?

But yea, I know what you're probably not going to do, which is present any argument against trans rights that isn't based in your own sexual discomfort.

 

[TedEH]

John Oliver started his new season with a bang Sunday

I kinda wish the youtube channel wasn't delayed by two weeks in Canada. I don't get why they do that.

 

[ArtDecade]

I kinda wish the youtube channel wasn't delayed by two weeks in Canada. I don't get why they do that.

We don't want to overwhelm the Canadians with too much information at one time - especially during the NHL Season. The hope is that some stuff will leak out before you get the whole shebang.

 

[Drew]

Wake up dude. Unplug the TV and start to think for yourself.

I don't even own a fucking TV, is the funny thing.

 

[RevDrucifer]

I think the biggest ‘surprise’ to me I’ve come to realize when seeing the shit the anti-trans crowd comes up with is their inability to separate ‘trans’ from ‘sexual activity’ which is an automatic sign of projection to me.

If one can’t see that every single human isn’t motivated by what they’re doing their genitals, I HAVE to assume that person is motivated/frustrated/focused too much on what their own genitals are doing or not doing.

 

[Drew]

We'll see if he actually appeals or not. He'll have to come up with the cash up front to be able to first. Maybe he just gets jared and ivanka to front him some of their $2billion Saudi monies.

One aspect of this not getting the attention it probably should - Trump has about $600mm in liquid assets as of the end of the year - cash and near-cash investments that can be converted to cash quickly. Regardless of how you value his real estate holdings, they're highly illiquid - it would take a long time to sell, or even borrow against, and now isn't exactly a great time for the commercial real estate world, so there's some concern about what sort of valuation he could actually get.

So, $600mm... and in the last couple months he's been hit with an $80m defamation lawsuit that was super-avoidable, had he just shut his damned mouth or limited himself to things like "I continue to assert my innocence to the charges against me," instead of continuing to slander Carroll the same day the courts found against him. And then, add in a ~350mm settlement here for fraud in the State of New York.

He just took a $430mm hit to an $600mm cask of dry powder, leaving him with about $170mm. Considering he has a bunch of other pending cases going on that have the potential to result in large fines, AND he's waging a very expensive campaign to run for President... he's starting to look like he's at real risk of a liquidity crunch, where he just doesn't have the available cash to pay court settlements and continue to fund his campaign. And he's got a LONG track record of burning contractors working on credit.

There's a material chance - not probable, but at least possible - that what eventually does in his campaign isn't his low general-public approval or his criminal cases, but the fact he simply runs out of money to continue to campaign on. God knows side-hustles like his stupid hideous gold shoes aren't helping, either.

 

[StevenC]

Oh no, the basement crew of '24 featuring @TheBlackBard @StevenC @narad are teaming up against me...what will I do???

Assuming you're asking earnestly, I'd recommend maybe logging off for a bit and unplugging from political spaces if you can. Take some time to yourself, get some fresh air, and think about why you've got all this hatred inside you and what function and value it serves in your life.

After that, there are plenty of great resources around to help you understand more of the reality around issues such as trans rights. There are several very qualified youtubers with fun and digestible content on the topic, and wider reaching deradicalisation content. Contrapoints is a good place to start in my opinion. Go in with an open mind and really think about the information being presented to you.

 

[StevenC]

I think the biggest ‘surprise’ to me I’ve come to realize when seeing the shit the anti-trans crowd comes up with is their inability to separate ‘trans’ from ‘sexual activity’ which is an automatic sign of projection to me.

If one can’t see that every single human isn’t motivated by what they’re doing their genitals, I HAVE to assume that person is motivated/frustrated/focused too much on what their own genitals are doing or not doing.

A large amount of the anti-trans movement is just internalised misogyny. They don't see women as people, so they can't fathom why anyone would want to transition to a lesser entity for any reason other than to abuse women.

 

[Drew]

I think the biggest ‘surprise’ to me I’ve come to realize when seeing the shit the anti-trans crowd comes up with is their inability to separate ‘trans’ from ‘sexual activity’ which is an automatic sign of projection to me.

If one can’t see that every single human isn’t motivated by what they’re doing their genitals, I HAVE to assume that person is motivated/frustrated/focused too much on what their own genitals are doing or not doing.

You'll also note how carefully the anti-trans movement is to focus exclusively on trans women, but refuses to talk about trans men, because it's WAY easier to frame it as "no, but really, they're just men trying to prey on women, we need bathroom bills!" than to talk about the experience of people biologically born women who identify as male.

But, as a CIS man, one of the things that's been kind of eye opening about the growing attention to trans identity is how honestly WEIRD it is just how big a part "gender" plays in public life. Like, whatever's in my pants, and who I want to see what's inside of their pants, is something that we should really use to "sort" me in public life, and make a huge part of my identity? Honestly, on some level, that's extremely creepy when you really start to think about it. Why the fuck do we care so much?

 

[brector]

Lacks empathy - You're correct. I should welcome a dude looking like a lady using a urinal next to my girlfriends teenage son, or a lady that looks like a dude using the restroom with my sisters daughter. How could I lack so much empathy and still wake up everyday with a smile on my face???

Do you even read what you write?
You are afraid of a "dude" standing next to your g/f's son in the bathroom? And you are also afraid of a "lady" using the bathroom with your sister's daughter in the same room?

 

[thebeesknees22]

One aspect of this not getting the attention it probably should - Trump has about $600mm in liquid assets as of the end of the year - cash and near-cash investments that can be converted to cash quickly. Regardless of how you value his real estate holdings, they're highly illiquid - it would take a long time to sell, or even borrow against, and now isn't exactly a great time for the commercial real estate world, so there's some concern about what sort of valuation he could actually get.

So, $600mm... and in the last couple months he's been hit with an $80m defamation lawsuit that was super-avoidable, had he just shut his damned mouth or limited himself to things like "I continue to assert my innocence to the charges against me," instead of continuing to slander Carroll the same day the courts found against him. And then, add in a ~350mm settlement here for fraud in the State of New York.

He just took a $430mm hit to an $600mm cask of dry powder, leaving him with about $170mm. Considering he has a bunch of other pending cases going on that have the potential to result in large fines, AND he's waging a very expensive campaign to run for President... he's starting to look like he's at real risk of a liquidity crunch, where he just doesn't have the available cash to pay court settlements and continue to fund his campaign. And he's got a LONG track record of burning contractors working on credit.

There's a material chance - not probable, but at least possible - that what eventually does in his campaign isn't his low general-public approval or his criminal cases, but the fact he simply runs out of money to continue to campaign on. God knows side-hustles like his stupid hideous gold shoes aren't helping, either.

it's worth noting, his lawyers missed the deadline to appeal to the SCOTUS for civil immunity. (I didn't get a chance to look into all of the details yet)

But apparently he's essentially opened himself up to getting sued by people affected by Jan 6th by not continuing that appeal. (or so a quick blurb I caught said)

I'm not sure if anyone will try, but someone might. Even if they don't win, it would add to his mounting legal bills.

 

[Drew]

Do you even read what you write?
You are afraid of a "dude" standing next to your g/f's son in the bathroom? And you are also afraid of a "lady" using the bathroom with your sister's daughter in the same room?

The irony, is this is exactly what would happen in a world where "bathroom bills" would go universal and people were required to use the bathrooms of their birth sex - you'd have people who present as women in the men's room, and as men in the women's room. It's probably less disruptive to gender norms to just let people use the bathrooms of the gender they present as, and just not look over the stall or anything.

 

[MetalDestroyer]

it's worth noting, his lawyers missed the deadline to appeal to the SCOTUS for civil immunity. (I didn't get a chance to look into all of the details yet)

But apparently he's essentially opened himself up to getting sued by people affected by Jan 6th by not continuing that appeal. (or so a quick blurb I caught said)

I'm not sure if anyone will try, but someone might. Even if they don't win, it would add to his mounting legal bills.

This is America. If there's a suit to be won, a suit WILL be filed. I think a lot of those people who were promised help by trump are feeling a little pissed off at the consequences of their own actions, and would jump at the chance to have someone else (trump) take responsibility for them.

 

[TedEH]

Something that I don't understand is how we've managed to reach a state of mostly abiding / tolerating the vast majority of the major parts of a persons life that don't coincide with how we see things, but this one specific issue of gender gets everyone up in arms.

If you put 100 people in a room together in the US, there's a good chance that no more than a third of them will share the same religion, let alone diving into whatever way you want to subdivide those groups - but it's been a long standing faux pas, a huge taboo, to speak unprompted against someone's spiritual understandings or affiliations. I mean, I'd love to go around telling everyone what I think of their religions, but I don't do that because I operate off of a baseline of minding my own business and respecting that people can believe whatever they want.

There's no reason gender has to be any different. You don't have to agree with everyone, you don't have to think it's right or moral, or understand it, you just have to mind your own business when nobody is asking. I mean, I've got lots of potentially provocative thoughts and opinions about both religion and gender if anyone really wants to talk about it, but the reality is that nobody really cares what my philosophy on those things are, and it has zero bearing on how anyone else should live their life.

Years ago I would have said being critical and skeptical was a good thing - and in a good-faith way, I still believe that - but there's "I don't understand, so lets explore this" critical, and then there's "I want to legislate you out of existence" which goes beyond critical into being plainly malicious.

 

[wheresthefbomb]

Something that I don't understand is how we've managed to reach a state of mostly abiding / tolerating the vast majority of the major parts of a persons life that don't coincide with how we see things, but this one specific issue of gender gets everyone up in arms.

If you put 100 people in a room together in the US, there's a good chance that no more than a third of them will share the same religion, let alone diving into whatever way you want to subdivide those groups - but it's been a long standing faux pas, a huge taboo, to speak unprompted against someone's spiritual understandings or affiliations. I mean, I'd love to go around telling everyone what I think of their religions, but I don't do that because I operate off of a baseline of minding my own business and respecting that people can believe whatever they want.

There's no reason gender has to be any different. You don't have to agree with everyone, you don't have to think it's right or moral, or understand it, you just have to mind your own business when nobody is asking. I mean, I've got lots of potentially provocative thoughts and opinions about both religion and gender if anyone really wants to talk about it, but the reality is that nobody really cares what my philosophy on those things are, and it has zero bearing on how anyone else should live their life.

Years ago I would have said being critical and skeptical was a good thing - and in a good-faith way, I still believe that - but there's "I don't understand, so lets explore this" critical, and then there's "I want to legislate you out of existence" which goes beyond critical into being plainly malicious.

I worked with a trans man in a kitchen for a while (actually a couple different trans men in a couple different kitchens, but that's beside the point) and I remember our chef, who was a very "oldschool macho" hispanic guy, catching himself misgendering them one day when it was just me and him, and saying something along the lines of "I don't understand it, but I'm happy to do whatever makes them more comfortable." He didn't tolerate anybody else saying transphobic shit in the kitchen, either. If he could figure it out all on his own...

 

[Big Dumb Bitch]

The irony, is this is exactly what would happen in a world where "bathroom bills" would go universal and people were required to use the bathrooms of their birth sex - you'd have people who present as women in the men's room, and as men in the women's room. It's probably less disruptive to gender norms to just let people use the bathrooms of the gender they present as, and just not look over the stall or anything.

A trans man who looks like this seems like they'd be a lot more disruptive in the women's bathroom than a non passing trans woman whos early in their transition but what would I know lol

 

[Big Dumb Bitch]

I think the biggest ‘surprise’ to me I’ve come to realize when seeing the shit the anti-trans crowd comes up with is their inability to separate ‘trans’ from ‘sexual activity’ which is an automatic sign of projection to me.

If one can’t see that every single human isn’t motivated by what they’re doing their genitals, I HAVE to assume that person is motivated/frustrated/focused too much on what their own genitals are doing or not doing.

Data Finds Republicans are Obsessed with Searching for Transgender Porn - Lawsuit.org

Closet Cases – Republicans secretly love what they publicly hate So far in 2022, more than 300 anti-LGBT bills have been proposed across 36 states – at least one third of which are directed at trans youth. This surge, especially in anti-trans legislation from Republicans, stands in stark...

lawsuit.org

Red areas of the country consume more trans related adult content than blue areas. Their only exposure to trans people is usually through porn which is why they think being trans is inherently sexual. They're ashamed and afraid that people will think they're gay or something. These people have irreversible brain rot and are so stupid they think that being attracted to women makes them gay lol

 

[Randy]

Data Finds Republicans are Obsessed with Searching for Transgender Porn - Lawsuit.org

Closet Cases – Republicans secretly love what they publicly hate So far in 2022, more than 300 anti-LGBT bills have been proposed across 36 states – at least one third of which are directed at trans youth. This surge, especially in anti-trans legislation from Republicans, stands in stark...

lawsuit.org

Red areas of the country consume more trans related adult content than blue areas. Their only exposure to trans people is usually through porn which is why they think being trans is inherently sexual. They're ashamed and afraid that people will think they're gay or something. These people have irreversible brain rot and are so stupid they think that being attracted to women makes them gay lol

Hate criming literally just to run away from the thoughts in their own head. Overcompensating for their sexual curiosity by volunteering that someone's existence makes them uncomfortable.

If someone wants to be ashamed of their sexual interests, fine but it's super dumb to alert everyone else to it with these kinds of things.

 

[StevenC]

Something that I don't understand is how we've managed to reach a state of mostly abiding / tolerating the vast majority of the major parts of a persons life that don't coincide with how we see things, but this one specific issue of gender gets everyone up in arms.

If you put 100 people in a room together in the US, there's a good chance that no more than a third of them will share the same religion, let alone diving into whatever way you want to subdivide those groups - but it's been a long standing faux pas, a huge taboo, to speak unprompted against someone's spiritual understandings or affiliations. I mean, I'd love to go around telling everyone what I think of their religions, but I don't do that because I operate off of a baseline of minding my own business and respecting that people can believe whatever they want.

There's no reason gender has to be any different. You don't have to agree with everyone, you don't have to think it's right or moral, or understand it, you just have to mind your own business when nobody is asking. I mean, I've got lots of potentially provocative thoughts and opinions about both religion and gender if anyone really wants to talk about it, but the reality is that nobody really cares what my philosophy on those things are, and it has zero bearing on how anyone else should live their life.

Years ago I would have said being critical and skeptical was a good thing - and in a good-faith way, I still believe that - but there's "I don't understand, so lets explore this" critical, and then there's "I want to legislate you out of existence" which goes beyond critical into being plainly malicious.

Patriarchal structures fall apart if we remove rigid gender rules and this is very scary to people who benefit from those structures. If a transman can all of a sudden start receiving these benefits by opting into them, then it demonstrates that the structure was a social construct not an immutable natural one.

In a lot of ways, transphobia is being used as a stand in for "traditional" homophobia, as that's no longer a winning drum to beat. It's all the same Anita Bryant nonsense it's always been, just now targeting trans people specifically. If the T can be eliminated, it'll be the Ls, Gs and Bs next.

And to that end that is part of why intersex folks are ignored in these conversations. The idea that a gender binary is backed by science falls apart with even a passing glance at the science. Regardless of genitalia, it is impossible to say what chromosomes a person actually has without genetic tests. Statistically, there are transwomen out there who have two X chromosomes and were AMAB because of genitals.

This is how we get to things like "large gamete producer" being used people people who want you to "just say woman". This is in turn deeply misogynistic, reducing women to little more than incubators.

All that is to say, transphobia is irrational.