Fake Shredders

[GuitarBizarre]

FUCK my speakers were on too loud, I'm dead now

The same album this comes from, also features a cover of stairway to heaven, constructed entirely out of pitch-shifted samples of screaming. It's called "Halfway up the stairway of mucus".

 

[HungryGuitarStudent]

What's the point? I can't see any of these links for some reason, but I've seen these types of shred olympics type guys and they need to get some feeling. They are missing the entire point. It would be like comparing Bruce Lee to some random guy that can punch ten times faster than Bruce Lee. One understands and one doesn't. It's also like comparing a great novelist to someone who can memorize the dictionary. The guy who memorized the dictionary probably knows more words, but there's no point. He's just a biological robot, essentially. He just doesn't understand. Then there's these shred olympic's people and then those who can actually feel music or write music. No. Really.. Actually, feel.. music. Most great emotionally charged songs are not on a high technical level of playing ability. There are songs that are better and it's really just not an opinion whether it's better once you really "get" it, imo. Usually the farther back in time you go during the 20th century, the better it gets. It peaked between the 1920's to 2005 or so, regarding flat out songs that are more in touch with the real human race. Even the shredders from that era where mostly still emotionally involved. It's my bias and opinion sure, but nothing greater than that period in human history will probably ever happen again. It was the modern day equivalent of what other cultures already developed, such as India, China, Japan, Mongolia, and pretty much everywhere else on Earth other than modern Europe and America. It was the last real evolution of music because music theory and techiniques etc were still being figured out largely, and now even though there is still new concepts and such, pretty much eveything has been tried to a certain extent. The world is now ready to mix everything and anything it wants into it's music. Techincal ability isn't as important as self expression and creating the art/music itself. This is what is going to be and starting to be the new frontier in musical exploration (mixing styles and cultures) along with new instruments and sounds as well. This will lead to new types of theory eventually, but the old theory at this point is more like a proof rather than a thoery. Just a thought.

Isn’t it kind of obvious that feeling is subjective ?

I don’t want to be a dick, but making a blanket statement lumping together a bunch of guitarists based on technique or BPMs is akin to a 90 year old saying metal all sounds the same, that is has no musical merit and that these angry kids should all grow up and play the violin.

 

[Lorcan Ward]

Damn that first take riff and tapping at the end was tight.

Dude is such an insane player. I need to check out more of his music and not just his guitar videos.

And I seriously need to do some woodshedding this Winter.

 

[Drew]

What's the point? I can't see any of these links for some reason, but I've seen these types of shred olympics type guys and they need to get some feeling. They are missing the entire point. It would be like comparing Bruce Lee to some random guy that can punch ten times faster than Bruce Lee. One understands and one doesn't. It's also like comparing a great novelist to someone who can memorize the dictionary. The guy who memorized the dictionary probably knows more words, but there's no point. He's just a biological robot, essentially. He just doesn't understand. Then there's these shred olympic's people and then those who can actually feel music or write music. No. Really.. Actually, feel.. music. Most great emotionally charged songs are not on a high technical level of playing ability. There are songs that are better and it's really just not an opinion whether it's better once you really "get" it, imo. Usually the farther back in time you go during the 20th century, the better it gets. It peaked between the 1920's to 2005 or so, regarding flat out songs that are more in touch with the real human race. Even the shredders from that era where mostly still emotionally involved. It's my bias and opinion sure, but nothing greater than that period in human history will probably ever happen again. It was the modern day equivalent of what other cultures already developed, such as India, China, Japan, Mongolia, and pretty much everywhere else on Earth other than modern Europe and America. It was the last real evolution of music because music theory and techiniques etc were still being figured out largely, and now even though there is still new concepts and such, pretty much eveything has been tried to a certain extent. The world is now ready to mix everything and anything it wants into it's music. Techincal ability isn't as important as self expression and creating the art/music itself. This is what is going to be and starting to be the new frontier in musical exploration (mixing styles and cultures) along with new instruments and sounds as well. This will lead to new types of theory eventually, but the old theory at this point is more like a proof rather than a thoery. Just a thought.

"Area Man Shakes Fist At Clouds."

"...until 2005 or so." You didn't happen to be in your mid-30s around then or so? It's just this thing where every generation thinks music peaked right around the time THEY were settling into adulthood, and these kids today with their loud rock music and their, idunno, I guess now it's skinny jeans, just don't understand, man. Music just isn't what it used to be, man. etc etc etc.

I have my own biases and preferences when it comes to shred, and one of them is that thanks to guys like Rusty Cooley it's increasingly hard to impress people purely with technique, because technique-heavy players have come SO far that it's an amazingly high bar you have to hit now (certainly not one I'll ever be able to touch, myself). But, whatever, if someone digs listening to someone very technique-heavy, as long as they can physically pull off the stuff they claim they can that's cool in my book. And there are plenty of contemporary shredders post-2005 who have a ton of "feel," whatever that means, in their playing - Nick Johnston has quickly become a favorite of mine, and honestly I think Angel Vivaldi's melodicism has increased substantially in his most recent albums - I love some of the solos on his last two, and he's a dude who could get by on pure technique if he had to.

It's all music. There's a lot I don't get, but if I'm going to condemn any genre for lack of musicality, it's going to be mumble rap, not extremely technical shred.

 

[HungryGuitarStudent]

@Drew : Totally agree with you. Other shredsters like Per Nilsson and Paul Wardingham also have really nice melodic lines in their solos.

@c7spheres : Although I’m an old fart who grew up with Satriani and Vai, I stay up to date on shred and prog metal (and other genres). I find myself listening to current music 90% of the time.

It does wonders for music appreciation, breaking out of a rut and opening up new technical/compositional perspectives.

Dude is such an insane player. I need to check out more of his music and not just his guitar videos.

And I seriously need to do some woodshedding this Winter.

His EP is incredible. I thought it was too dense at first, but it grows on you.

I have the same reaction; he makes me want to step up my game with his original note choices and weird stretches.

 

[c7spheres]

Staring into the past, wishing it was the future. Fixed it for you.

Not at all what I was saying.

Except that your time period completely ignores Vaporwave, which is a fundamentally distinct, anti-commercial genre that seeks to render moot the commercialisation of rebellion that ultimately became the death knell of punk?

What you're saying doesn't do anything but betray your ignorance of contemporary subgenres and movements in artistic thinking. You're stuck in the past because it's all you're able to appreciate. The reason you're able to appreciate it is because there's plenty of analysis of it that other people have put in front of you over time and you've not had to think about how that music works, you've just absorbed the opinions of others, many of whom stopped looking forward themselves once they found something they enjoyed.

- I'm not stuck in the past. I can listen to something and decide on my own if I'm into it or not.
- As a guitarist I can appreciate the ability certainly, but when I'm listening to music I don't take that into account. I take into account how it moves me emotionally.
- Most people of today do not have the feeling or spirit in their music the people of the past did. Probably because most people of today are domesticated. It's not an insult, but a reality and a privlage for them.
- Someone like BB King's music is filled with emotion and rawness, whereas a bedroom shredder that grew up in the burbs music just isn't in comparison. It comes through in the music.
- What generation you're from does have something to do with it though because the more domesticated you are the bigger emotional impact minimal things have on you, whereas someone who is more "hardened" from the past won't even perceive it. So I guess you could say that later genterations are more sensitive to these things, sure. This could be interpreted as more honed or evolved to the finer nuances within music.

 

[KnightBrolaire]

something interesting to note: Dan Griffin just happened to start posting raw takes of his playing right around when Berried Alive got called out for miming to midi by Fountainhead and others. I'm just glad not to see him pantomiming to fucking midi piano rolls anymore.

 

[GunpointMetal]

something interesting to note: Dan Griffin just happened to start posting raw takes of his playing right around when Berried Alive got called out for miming to midi by Fountainhead and others. I'm just glad not to see him pantomiming to fucking midi piano rolls anymore.

Is he playing the lightspeed tap stuff live now on IG? He would post live videos sometimes, but it was always just riffs with lots of open chugs.

 

[Spaced Out Ace]

Ola talked about "fake guitarists" in one of his most recent FAQs. He said he has pre-recorded riffs or whatever and then mimed to them for videos. Not exactly the same thing, but honesty is appreciated. I figured all of the "produced" bits of his earlier demos were pre-recorded miming, sort of like a music video. I think that is quite different from manipulating the speed via DAW or otherwise, or even flat out using midi tracks.

 

[KnightBrolaire]

Is he playing the lightspeed tap stuff live now on IG? He would post live videos sometimes, but it was always just riffs with lots of open chugs.

it's a mix of stuff, some of it tapping but nowhere near as technical looking as his midi videos tbh.

 

[Lorcan Ward]

So a lot of people are fine with doing it in the studio and even some were ok with miming to surgically edited tracks in your room/studio.

But how about miming to a guitar pro file live?
https://www.facebook.com/142914828462/posts/10158029288708463?vh=e&d=n&sfns=mo

For anyone who doesn’t have Facebook that’s Lucas from Rings of Saturn miming to a backing track live. That is a whole new level of dishonesty.

 

[Eptaceros]

the comments section, oh lord...

"HOW ARE YOU THAT CLEAN?!"
"It's called practice"
"Actually, it's cause he's using the fretwrap"

 

[Avedas]

- Most people of today do not have the feeling or spirit in their music the people of the past did. Probably because most people of today are domesticated. It's not an insult, but a reality and a privlage for them.
- Someone like BB King's music is filled with emotion and rawness, whereas a bedroom shredder that grew up in the burbs music just isn't in comparison. It comes through in the music.
- What generation you're from does have something to do with it though because the more domesticated you are the bigger emotional impact minimal things have on you, whereas someone who is more "hardened" from the past won't even perceive it. So I guess you could say that later genterations are more sensitive to these things, sure. This could be interpreted as more honed or evolved to the finer nuances within music.

As "old man" as this sounds I do kind of agree with it in a sense. That's why hip hop is probably the most interesting and diverse genre of music.

 

[c7spheres]

As "old man" as this sounds I do kind of agree with it in a sense. That's why hip hop is probably the most interesting and diverse genre of music.

Hip hop? How so? Can't tell if you're being sarcastic or not. I honestly get practically nothing out of hip hop. I did get into some of the older (oG) stuff back when it came out like NWA, Easy E, Dr Dre, Too Short, Public Enemy etc. To me that was coming froma real place and not fake. Stuff I hear nowadays mostly just makes me laugh, which is nice, but the problem is it's not supposed to be funny. These people are actually serious but I can tell they're full of shit. I can feel it in their voice if they're real or not. It's hard to explain. Not trying to get into an argument or anything, just being honest. That being said. Some of the production work in some of the modern hip hop songs is good. I can always appreciate a good fidelity. There just seems to be a lack of true representation in every style nowadays. It's like everyone is just doing because it's their day job and they hate it. Going through the motions etc.

 

[Avedas]

Hip hop? How so? Can't tell if you're being sarcastic or not. I honestly get practically nothing out of hip hop. I did get into some of the older (oG) stuff back when it came out like NWA, Easy E, Dr Dre, Too Short, Public Enemy etc. To me that was coming froma real place and not fake. Stuff I hear nowadays mostly just makes me laugh, which is nice, but the problem is it's not supposed to be funny. These people are actually serious but I can tell they're full of shit. I can feel it in their voice if they're real or not. It's hard to explain. Not trying to get into an argument or anything, just being honest. That being said. Some of the production work in some of the modern hip hop songs is good. I can always appreciate a good fidelity. There just seems to be a lack of true representation in every style nowadays. It's like everyone is just doing because it's their day job and they hate it. Going through the motions etc.

No, I'm not being sarcastic. It has a huge grassroots scene because anyone can mix a decent track on their laptop with nothing more than a MIDI keyboard and the voice recording app on their iPhone. There's a large overlap with RnB, funk, jazz, soul, gospel, blues and other styles. It's not all centered around a single instrument like the electric guitar. There are a billion subgenres. "Gangsta" rap probably doesn't even make up 1%.

 

[Fenriswolf]

Hip hop? How so? Can't tell if you're being sarcastic or not. I honestly get practically nothing out of hip hop. I did get into some of the older (oG) stuff back when it came out like NWA, Easy E, Dr Dre, Too Short, Public Enemy etc. To me that was coming froma real place and not fake. Stuff I hear nowadays mostly just makes me laugh, which is nice, but the problem is it's not supposed to be funny. These people are actually serious but I can tell they're full of shit. I can feel it in their voice if they're real or not. It's hard to explain. Not trying to get into an argument or anything, just being honest. That being said. Some of the production work in some of the modern hip hop songs is good. I can always appreciate a good fidelity. There just seems to be a lack of true representation in every style nowadays. It's like everyone is just doing because it's their day job and they hate it. Going through the motions etc.

I'm not too big on hip hop, but I'm sure it's the same as rock/metal or country. All the Guchi Gang stuff is their version of Nickleback and Luke Bryan. The stuff they play on the radio is shit, and you have to do some digging to find the good stuff.

 

[SlamLiguez]

Any genre is a lake with the least dense shit at the top; you're gonna have to look a lot deeper to find stuff with substance. I mean ghostemane (imo) achieved what most rappers try to imitate only through aesthetic alone with his latest music and live set, most of them just adopt a "punk/metal" aesthetic in their attire and music solely for the sake of being "different" but you can tell when it's genuine, and just as in metal there are fake performances all OVER mainstream radio, I remember hearing a "country" song somewhere and the male singers notes were hilariously perfect, but where's the line when there's extra distortion added on a screamed vocal or a solo is recorded in parts? If you can do it live then there's not really a problem.

Part of the whole argument about having authentic takes is about what makes metal what it is culturally, something raw and difficult that someone poured hours of practice into and can prove it through the barest of mediums, because (I think) if metal went mainstream the way of Poppy you bet your ass there'd be a room of Grammy-winning producers locked into Guitar Pro ready to make the next hit. Most guitar-based music is largely based on merit, and overprocessing and cleanliness mentally puts it closer to something formulaic and sterile for me. It takes the sword out of the hand and replaces it with a mouse and keyboard, and that ain't metal.

 

[Spaced Out Ace]

or a solo is recorded in parts

"Comping" solos is pretty common even on old records from what I've gathered.

 

[Fenriswolf]

It like a video I've seen that Upchurch posted. He's explaining the meaning of one of his songs, and the lines are 'Cause I'm connected to the time and ya'll connected to the phones
How many followers are all ya'll gitting? How many hoes ya'll takin' home?. And it's a stab at the hip hop community because all he's heard on the radio is songs about bitches and hoes and shit that doesn't matter, and he just wants to hear song about you.

"Comping" solos is pretty common even on old records from what I've gathered.

I don't really have a problem with that. I get that solos are hard to play perfect in one take, especially because you're your own worst critic. But on the other hand, I like playing guitar a lot more than trying to edit shit together, so I don't bother trying to record stuff. I'd rather spend the time playing along to a song and trying to improvise shit than sitting there trying to record the perfect take.

 

[Spaced Out Ace]

I don't really have a problem with that. I get that solos are hard to play perfect in one take, especially because you're your own worst critic. But on the other hand, I like playing guitar a lot more than trying to edit shit together, so I don't bother trying to record stuff. I'd rather spend the time playing along to a song and trying to improvise shit than sitting there trying to record the perfect take.

Some of it is done as a way to write the solo, with some different stuff in each of three takes for example.