Problems with band member

[Riffer]

Why is there hesitancy regarding confrontation? (besides the glaring car issues).
Have y'all been working together for a while now and are people uncomfortable escalating the lack of resolve from her side?

The problem doesn't sound like she's not being confronted, it's that the proposed solutions to these issues have not been escalated.

I mean there is always the uncomfortableness of having to discuss these issues with a band member you've been with for 6 years. At this point though I am over it and feel like to move forward she just need to be fired. But since we treat the band as a democracy and there is no real "leader" and I like the rest of the guys enough I will respect their desire to have the meeting and air it out even though I think we all know what is going to happen and/or needs to happen.

gonna agree with @TedEH shes a singer, she's not lugging cabs and amps and guitars anywhere. No excuse even car issues. Sounds like you guys also live in a metropolitan area, there are plenty of ways to get around without a car, even in the boonies. This is a joke to her if she can't make rehearsal. I wouldnt even kick her out, just ghost her at this point, not even joking, after all that disrespect.

It's really ridiculous. She acts like a child if you bring up her car issues and reference how she drives her car back and forth to the beach but then can't make it to rehearsals because its broke. You'd think if you knew your car was not running well or you only had a few rides left you would prioritize the things you need to get to that make you money, right? But she will act like we are telling her what to do with her free time or telling her she can't go out and have fun. Well, when your problems start affecting this job in negative ways it gives us every right to say something. If this was a normal 9-5 job and she acted like this or did similar things she would've been let go already.

 

[r33per]

Not much to add apart from the additional voice to what's already been posted.

Two choices: demonstrable change of attitude or dismissed.
By all means arrange a meet, but I'd recommend sticking to one's guns and not getting derailed. And if the promise of a change around is made, they've got one chance or out.

 

[TedEH]

See if the band is willing to schedule another rehearsal with a different singer and just say it's so the band can practice with a "backup" singer when the current singer can't make it due to transportation issues. "Just for practice reasons". Once you get some practice in with the "backup" or "practice" singer the band is in a better position to move on without the current problematic singer.

I'd be careful with this kind of approach, 'cause it can be read as kinda petty and might set an unprofessional precedent for the new vocalist. If you really want to boot the singer, just do it.

 

[VGK17]

Just send her this link. problem solved.

 

[Riffer]

Just send her this link. problem solved.

That would be my god damn dream since I'm a huge wrestling fan lol.

 

[wheresthefbomb]

She acts like a child if you bring up her car issues and reference how she drives her car back and forth to the beach but then can't make it to rehearsals because its broke. You'd think if you knew your car was not running well or you only had a few rides left you would prioritize the things you need to get to that make you money, right? But she will act like we are telling her what to do with her free time or telling her she can't go out and have fun. Well, when your problems start affecting this job in negative ways it gives us every right to say something. If this was a normal 9-5 job and she acted like this or did similar things she would've been let go already.

She's telling you with her actions what her priorities are.

I respect y'all's choice not to straight up ghost her, though nobody would likely blame you. If nothing else it acknowledges the humanity of everyone involved. I did my last one via text and they weren't privy to the decision, "artistic differences blah blah you can come by the practice space for your gear at your convenience."

Ultimately band relationships are a lot like other relationships, including in their dysfunction. We can't change people, she's obviously got some issues and it's cool to empathize with that but they are ultimately her issues and she will have to figure them out (or not) on her own time. At this point, anything short of parting ways is very likely enabling her behavior.

If you're friends it will probably cost you that, too, which sucks but that's how these things go. Also you and your bandmates will probably feel like assholes but that's how boundaries are sometimes. Good luck.

 

[metallicity]

I'd be careful with this kind of approach, 'cause it can be read as kinda petty and might set an unprofessional precedent for the new vocalist. If you really want to boot the singer, just do it.

Absolutely be careful with whatever approach is taken. My suggestion was meant to be a general idea/outline for something more nuanced, more of a way to transition from one singer to another. Yes, if that band decides to do something along those lines they should be careful to do it in a way that doesn't end up petty or unprofessional, it can be done.

I know bands, and have been in bands, that have access to at least one backup player that can fill in if someone can't make it, don't see why that can't apply to a singer too. Say the band wants a second singer for gigs that require all the members to be vaccinated. They can say to the current singer you're our person for unvaccinated gigs as we understand your decision not to get vaccinated but it's unfair for the whole band to miss out on gigs that require the whole band to be vaccinated so we'll have a second singer for those situations. Not at all unrealistic in our current world.

Only the OP and the rest of the band members have a feel for what approach would be best for them and sometimes straight up fired is best and sometimes a more nuanced transition is best. The band members may not want to burn the bridge with a straight up fire and leave the door open to working together again in the future. That is the more difficult approach but can be more rewarding in the long run.

I'm just offering up a few ideas to consider, not married to any of them, some may absolutely be wrong for their situation yet some may give them something they haven't thought of and end up aiding their process.

 

[c7spheres]

Maybe she needs a wake up call. Some people don't realize you're serious until you get stern with them. I'd sit her down or next time you talk to her tell her to get serious or she's out and make sure she know you're serious. Sometime's all people need is that wake up call to get back on track. - If it's been already discussed in a professional way with her then maybe it's time to go.

 

[USMarine75]

She must be hot.

 

[Xaios]

All I can really do is echo what other people have said. This person is chronically unable to manage her own affairs, and makes bad decisions not only knowing that it will negatively impact the group, but even refuses to change course when there's tangible evidence that said decisions already have done so. You may call your band a democracy, but given how you've kowtowed to her selfish and narcissistic behavior to this point, I'd venture to say that's not true. She has actively demonstrated repeatedly that she doesn't give a damn about the band, and is unwilling to make even the smallest effort to accommodate the rest of you the same way you have her.

Go ahead and meet with her, but I don't see this getting better. Cut her loose.

 

[Riffer]

She must be hot.

lol I would say no. I do not find her attractive. But a lot of that is her personality.



I appreciate all the input and it confirms what I’ve felt in my head that she needs to go. I’ve also neglected to mention that she isn’t some young 20 something. She’s 41 and to me it’s mind boggling that this is how she acts.

 

[USMarine75]

lol I would say no. I do not find her attractive. But a lot of that is her personality.



I appreciate all the input and it confirms what I’ve felt in my head that she needs to go. I’ve also neglected to mention that she isn’t some young 20 something. She’s 41 and to me it’s mind boggling that this is how she acts.

All I know is if I was your singer, I'd be giving handies in a train station bathroom because my ugly ass would have been fired a long time ago.

Just saying...

 

[budda]

Usually when someone in a band says "We're having a meeting" without explicitly stating why, everyone knows why.

Tell the others if she misses the meeting, that's her resignation. Democracy hasn't done your band favours keeping known dead weight around. All bands need a leader at the end of the day . It lets people work on their strengths within the band (booking, merch, bills, etc) and not worry about the whole package.

Sounds like you're ready to step up.

Also, if the whole local circuit knows you guys tolerate that behaviour, you may notice a trend..

 

[Bodes]

If your band mates are dead set on this meeting, make sure you have what you want to say written down and semi-scripted.
If you sound like to her that you are not sure what you really mean/want, she is not going to accept anything you say.

If you won't fire her, you could offer to her that the band members will upfront the cost of car repairs, and half or her share for future gig money will go back to the band members until the debt is paid off?
In saying that, I don't know what the cost of repairs or her share of gig cash looks like, from a time for her to repay perspective. I also don't know your band mates financial position.

This might work well, she might walk, or she may get the car fixed, then walk.

 

[Esp Griffyn]

Sack the bitch and find someone else. She doesn't sound like she cares at all about doing any of the legwork involved with being in a band, she just wants to sing what she wants, when she feels like it and massage her own ego.

 

[fantom]

Just some advice...

First, for some situations, going into a bunch of reasons about her behavior and then firing her is far worse than just saying, "It isn't working out, we are looking for a new singer. Sorry." If she has questions or concerns, listen to her out of respect, but do not discuss the reasons or give her a 2nd chance. If she gets emotional, do not try to fix it. Let her get out her emotions.

Second, she doesn't have car problems. She has a punctuality and professionalism problem. As someone who is an expert at being late, I can tell you that if she cared, she would make it early. That is pretty much on her regardless of why. Stop letting her use her car as an excuse.

Third, keep in mind that other band members may end up picking sides and causing a rift. Even if you all agree, you need to find a new singer (start doing that now). In that case, there is a chance people don't agree or the band loses gigs and people start resenting each other. I'm just saying you need to figure out with other members if you all want to make this thing work with a different singer. If the answer is yes, great..if not, expect the band to split up.

 

[guitar_player4_2_0]

I took my motorcycle safety class last weekend. Had to be there on a Saturday at 6:45am. Two people were extremely late. Before they arrived the instructor told us people who are late usually don’t pass because it shows they aren’t very committed. They finally arrived, but neither did well nor came back the second day, and all the rest of us passed. Step 1 in life is showing up. If we aren’t talking about Cristina Scabbia kick her ass out!

 

[fantom]

- She doesn't know how to sacrifice things and she's awful with her money. She will drive an hour and a half to the beach to hang out with her friends on a Sunday and spend money on drinks/food/tolls or tickets to have her car put on the Ferry to get from one beach town to the other but then might not make it to the gig or rehearsal because her car is fucked. Instead of just staying at home on a day off and saving that money and putting it towards her car issues, she has super bad FOMO (Fear of Missing Out) and needs to go out and enjoy herself or be seen.

Just want to point out. How she spends her personal money or time is her business. I would take her side on this point.

I can get that you want a requirement for band members to have reliable transportation and chip in on band expenses, but if you never explicitly agreed to any terms, that isn't entirely on her.

Many people in bands won't sacrifice their life for it. I've never been in a band where everyone was willing to drop everything for the band. Maybe 2 or 3 people do that, but they typically drive the project so hard that there is no space for other members to emotionally invest in it. And that is fine. Just be explicit about your expectations with your new singer.

 

[ixlramp]

Riffer,
I actually barely read the first post, forgive me, this is because ...
When it gets to the point of someone posting on a forum about how bad a band member is, then the answer is probably obvious and simple:
The problem member has to go, they probably will not change, or the poster should leave the band if the band is weak and refuses to sort the problem out (lifes too short, better things will be ahead).
And i suspect the poster knows this already, which makes me wonder why they even post about it.
Sorry for my arrogance

 

[Lozek]

No point in the meeting, I can say from bitter experience people do not change. You may shock her into changing her ways for a short while, but she will slowly slide back to her current behaviour.

Costing you a €3.5k gig over vaccination is enough of reason and that will only happen more as they become mandatory for corporate events. No-one is going to risk getting sued for not taking proper precaution.