Wintersun's Groundhog's Day Thread
- Thread starter jvms
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I'd like you to define what you think his "best working strategies" are. Because taking 6-7 years on average to release new music isn't very good, for a musician. Some bands crank out one album every 1-2 years and the material is just as good and consistent. Without crazy custom gear, without their own studio, without taking over all the studio duties... you're just thinking Jari "obviously" goes pretends to go for all the best things for an actually good reason (justified by the quality of the art he claims he will release) because in your tiny mind, a genius like Jari couldn't possibly have another reason to take so long time to release anything. It has to be because of perfectionism because it's Jari your hero, it can't be for the same reason as literally every other musical project ever that went into development hell: massive egos and money to piss away.
Well he isn't releasing anything after also having claimed he does have all the material and has had it for well over 15 years. If he actually tried to release anything, there are so many ways he could've done it. I've mentioned it before but apparently your head is way too far up your rectum to register any additional information. What prevented him from recording Time II, with the material he claimed to have already finished in total, in any studio, with the gear he has, accept the compromised mix, to just have FUCKIN RELEASED it. Call it Time II Demo, I don't care. Release it, tour for it, and then re-record it later with the money made from the tour, or whatever. That's what almost every band would have done. Because that's normal behaviour, unlike what Jari is doing while sitting on 450k of donated money that's in limbo.
Apparently he forgot how to do it since 2017 because I still haven't seen any new material, be it Time II or anything else.
Yeah, but you don't. You're the definition of denial. Quite entertaining tbh
Metropolis
Well-Known Member
For Jari it seems to be working alone, that's the way it is. And well... dude has been writing music with his Ibanez guitars just as ever... baritone mad custom high end guitars are for some future stuff and experimenting. And again if you don't objectively see it, then it doesn't mean it's not there at all. Many other bands can't even release that amount, or they just break up and certainly won't be releasing any music. Been there, done that.
I don't think I can call anyone as my hero, because people tend to be quite disappointing in most cases. Wintersun's slow release cycle is really disappointing, and I've never denied that.
For Time II yes, but who really cares about that anymore. And being with a record company it's not that simple just to put them out, it involves schedule planning and financial things. Just as they did with The Forest Seasons.
"If you don't objectively see it, it doesn't mean it's not there at all"
I've been on somewhat technical fields always and interested on that kind of stuff, so I know what I'm talking about cold and hard logic.
TedEH
Cromulent
Maybe re-read this one to yourself a couple of times and ask how reasonable it is to ask the general public to just "trust you bro" about material that may or may not actually exist, when there's an existing track record of contradictions and not delivering quite what was promised.
Lets hear these examples of other professional level bands that took crowdfunding money to complete a 10+ year long project and then didn't deliver.
Are we..... finally starting to come around?!
I guess not. Back to our regularly scheduled Jariposting.
Edika
Well-Known Member
With the fast paced life nowadays and the short attention spans most people have developed from the continuous bombardment of useless information, in the unlikely event that Jari releases those 4 albums he's working on simultaneously, in our lifespan at least, then will anyone sit down and listen to 4 albums straight on? And how will not everything bleed together and nothing stand out in the end? Even the more loyal fans will have a hard time digesting all those albums.
Unless he has a plan to release them spaced out, in which case why not focus on one album, release it, work on the next album release it etc etc? What will he gain from recording all 4 albums at once? Will the grand opus he has in his mind can not be written in another way? I'd say that makes it more dangerous to overlap ideas between albums and homogenize the end result.
Of course all the above are just mental gymnastics. We all know, except one person, that even if there are recordings, they won't see the light of day.
Unless he has a plan to release them spaced out, in which case why not focus on one album, release it, work on the next album release it etc etc? What will he gain from recording all 4 albums at once? Will the grand opus he has in his mind can not be written in another way? I'd say that makes it more dangerous to overlap ideas between albums and homogenize the end result.
Of course all the above are just mental gymnastics. We all know, except one person, that even if there are recordings, they won't see the light of day.
I really don't understand that part tbh. We're supposed to have stopped caring about Time II? For all I know, The Forest Seasons only happened so that the crowdfunding required to get a studio that was announced as a necessity specifically for mixing the absolute madness that Time II is supposed to be would have something for the donors. So the end goal is Time II, and The Forest Seasons were one means to that end.
And even then, there's some mind-bending craziness going on with the logic. He can't release Time II now because the project is supposed to be of a magnitude requiring their own studio n shit, and that's why he's not been able to complete it all these years, and... on the one hand, we're supposed to accept that Time II just won't happen (although the crowdfunding for the studio reached triple its goal), but also that Wintersun will continue to release albums that have nothing to do with Time II. But also, if Wintersun can't release Time II but will release other albums, how could that not mean those albums will be absolutely subpar? Because if they were good, they'd be on the level of Time II, so unable to be done as well. So... what the absolute fuck of a mind gymnastics olympic run is all of this shit?
DiezelMonster
Complainasaurus Rex
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I can't believe there is a 112 pages of this.
hahahaha
hahahaha
Metropolis
Well-Known Member
Yeah, he should just release ten second tiktok videos or shorts to youtube because attention span is so low in these days.
Devin Townsend just released seven albums of just ambient noodling, and I could just get little bit over one album of that boredom.
Double album of Wintersun would be really great... in a composition where it carries on like a real album, and not just a bunch of songs taped together.
Not quite actually... but we we all know why it's not going to be released. I guess other albums are not as demanding on producion side of things. Who knows what kind of madness Jari thinks about it, I have not cared to ask about it specifically.
Devin Townsend just released seven albums of just ambient noodling, and I could just get little bit over one album of that boredom.
Double album of Wintersun would be really great... in a composition where it carries on like a real album, and not just a bunch of songs taped together.
Not quite actually... but we we all know why it's not going to be released. I guess other albums are not as demanding on producion side of things. Who knows what kind of madness Jari thinks about it, I have not cared to ask about it specifically.
CTID
Pondering My Orb
sometimes i see this thread get bumped and get a little excited for the drama, but often i just walk away with another headache
davemeistro
Well-Known Member
This thread is 99% of the reason I come back to lurk on SSO, it must be protected at all costs
Join the madness if you dare.
Jarmake
Frost Giant
Devin Townsend has released ~30 albums and there's a few ambient noodling albums. Let's say there's 10 of them. That leaves us with 20 albums, which include such classics as City, Heavy as a really heavy thing, Alien, Strapping young lad, Ocean machine, Terria, Infinity, Accelerated evolution, Ki and Casualties of cool. That's not even counting all the live albums released.
I mean yeah, that's 10 excellent albums right there and there are more in the discography... how many does wintersun have? 1 great melodeath album, 1 great symphonic metal album which was shot in the leg by the shitty mixing and one quite bland album with bad sounding instruments made with vst plugins.
I don't even count the two Ensiferum albums, since I don't believe they were only Jari's doing... especially when Ensiferum went on just fine after Jari got out and has released 6 albums since.
And I don't mean to say that Devy can do no bad albums, there's plenty of his stuff I don't particularly like, but hey, many people seem to enjoy them and at least he puts out music he feels like doing any given time.
I mean yeah, that's 10 excellent albums right there and there are more in the discography... how many does wintersun have? 1 great melodeath album, 1 great symphonic metal album which was shot in the leg by the shitty mixing and one quite bland album with bad sounding instruments made with vst plugins.
I don't even count the two Ensiferum albums, since I don't believe they were only Jari's doing... especially when Ensiferum went on just fine after Jari got out and has released 6 albums since.
And I don't mean to say that Devy can do no bad albums, there's plenty of his stuff I don't particularly like, but hey, many people seem to enjoy them and at least he puts out music he feels like doing any given time.
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You don't trust yourself?
Antiproduct
Well-Known Member
He released like 4 ambient noodling albums under a completely different name to not water his brand down WHILE he was working on Lightwork, the b side Nightwork, 2 "ambient" albums that were actually composed and feature like 30 different musicians and a comic and a opera kind of thing called The Moth.
So yes, he released ambient noodling albums specifically meant for relaxing while working on 4 to 5 different albums and released all but one of them in a time span of 4 years.
TedEH
Cromulent
I legitimately don't even back myself up as blindly as Metropolis backs up Jari. A reasonable person knows they're fallible.
CTID
Pondering My Orb
right? i made a whole ass thread about my self-doubt when it comes to songwriting. at least i'm not gonna take half a million dollars from people and then do nothing with it.
finnish homies gotta stick together lmao
Yeah no. Don't lump us all into that category.
