ESP 2023

[somethingsomething]

ESP's pricing in the states just puzzles me. Like why would anyone pay nearly 4 times more for this ESP Arrow:

https://www.sweetwater.com/store/detail/ArrowOA2--esp-original-arrow-electric-guitar-andromeda-ii

than just buy this LTD 1000 Arrow?

ESP LTD Arrow-1000 - Violet Andromeda

Solidbody Electric Guitar with Mahogany Body, Maple Neck, Macassar Ebony Fingerboard, 2 Active Humbucking Pickups, and Floyd Rose Tremolo - Violet Andromeda

www.sweetwater.com

Maybe some diehards ESP peeps can explain it to me cause I don't get it? The differences I see are the original has a better bridge, tuners, switch, comes with a case and (probably) much better craftsmanship/finish. But I've heard great things about the 1000 series lately plus it even has stainless steel frets where the original doesn't (LOL!). For 3k, sure why not? 4k is already pushing it into nah territory but 5.5k is just crazy! Is there something else I'm missing or is the ESP on the headstock just worth that much to some?

I agree that ESP prices are all over the place. You can import an ESP Original from Japan for way cheaper than buying in the US (most of the time). But I will say that the Original series is MILES ahead of LTD when it comes to craftsmanship. Seriously amazing fit and finish on those guitars. I've owned a few and they've all been absolutely flawless. Also, the nickel frets on all the ESP Originals I've played have been immaculate and ultra-polished. Stainless steel frets don't mean much if the fretwork is subpar.

 

[metalstrike]

I agree that ESP prices are all over the place. You can import an ESP Original from Japan for way cheaper than buying in the US (most of the time). But I will say that the Original series is MILES ahead of LTD when it comes to craftsmanship. Seriously amazing fit and finish on those guitars. I've owned a few and they've all been absolutely flawless. Also, the nickel frets on all the ESP Originals I've played have been immaculate and ultra-polished. Stainless steel frets don't mean much if the fretwork is subpar.

For sure I have heard amazing things about ESP original craftsmanship. I wish I could test both side by side just to see what kind of difference there is. You are right about fretwork being much more important than material. I think its more that anything in the 5k range is a hard sell for me unless it's nearly perfect. Maybe ESP original is but not living in Japan limits my access! Maybe I'll import one someday to try but am apprehensive buying something that pricey overseas sight unseen with limited recourse concerning returns.

I see other companies doing similar things with pricing for their highest production tiers as well. Fender has the standard YJM strat for around $2k where the CS variants that come in different colors are $5.5k. Can't really speak to the value there either since I haven't played one but hey people buy them anyway so there is something there I guess.

 

[somethingsomething]

For sure I have heard amazing things about ESP original craftsmanship. I wish I could test both side by side just to see what kind of difference there is. You are right about fretwork being much more important than material. I think its more that anything in the 5k range is a hard sell for me unless it's nearly perfect. Maybe ESP original is but not living in Japan limits my access! Maybe I'll import one someday to try but am apprehensive buying something that pricey overseas sight unseen with limited recourse concerning returns.

I see other companies doing similar things with pricing for their highest production tiers as well. Fender has the standard YJM strat for around $2k where the CS variants that come in different colors are $5.5k. Can't really speak to the value there either since I haven't played one but hey people buy them anyway so there is something there I guess.

Yeah, I get that. I wouldn't spend $5K on a new guitar either. Not because they're not completely excellent--they are--just because I think that's too much for me to spend on ANY guitar. That said, I was able to snag a few ESPs at awesome prices from Japan (and you can find used Originals for pretty solid prices on Reverb sometimes too) and they're absolutely the most consistent and high-quality guitars I've ever played.

 

[narad]

I agree that ESP prices are all over the place. You can import an ESP Original from Japan for way cheaper than buying in the US (most of the time). But I will say that the Original series is MILES ahead of LTD when it comes to craftsmanship. Seriously amazing fit and finish on those guitars. I've owned a few and they've all been absolutely flawless. Also, the nickel frets on all the ESP Originals I've played have been immaculate and ultra-polished. Stainless steel frets don't mean much if the fretwork is subpar.

FWIW, ESP touts that the frets on the newer guitar are a material that sits somewhere between traditional nickel steel and stainless. They have a name for it, but I can't remember. But ya, maybe marketing BS, but that's the current pitch anyway.

 

[cardinal]

I think ESP original series just use Jescar nickel frets.

FWIW E-IIs are at least sanely priced and are awesome. If OS prices got you down, don't overlook the E-II line

 

[Emperoff]

I hope I'm not opening a can of worms here, but... Can anyone explain me the real differences between an "ESP" and a "E-II"?

I am severely GAS'd by the E-IIs arrow 7s, so...

 

[somethingsomething]

I hope I'm not opening a can of worms here, but... Can anyone explain me the real differences between an "ESP" and a "E-II"?

I am severely GAS'd by the E-IIs arrow 7s, so...

Someone will probably explain it better but think of the E-II line as a Gibson Standard and the ESP Original as a Gibson Custom Shop.

My understanding is that every ESP Original is made individually in ESP's custom shop. Even the standard mdoels like a black ESP Horizon-I are "made to order." So they don't do "runs" they just make the orders as they come in from dealers and customers. The Original series are made alongside the crazy, totally custom guitars that ESP also does. This is in contrast to the E-II line (still awesome guitars) that are made on a production line.

 

[cardinal]

I hope I'm not opening a can of worms here, but... Can anyone explain me the real differences between an "ESP" and a "E-II"?

I am severely GAS'd by the E-IIs arrow 7s, so...

I don't think the production lines have ever been officially explained, so it's all guessing.

All I know is that the E-IIs I've played are awesome.

 

[Nightside]

I hope I'm not opening a can of worms here, but... Can anyone explain me the real differences between an "ESP" and a "E-II"?

I am severely GAS'd by the E-IIs arrow 7s, so...

The E-II is a line by Esp that isn't good enough to wear the name.

 

[Nightside]

It's like if every Fender made outside the US was called Squier. Then the regular factory and team built custom Fenders were called F-II and only the master built guitars were allowed to have the Fender name.

 

[cardinal]

I have some E-II Eclipses that I prefer over the Standard and Original Series versions that I had at the same time. The E-II thicker bodies work better for me and the fretwork was just as good.

 

[Shawn]

I have some E-II Eclipses that I prefer over the Standard and Original Series versions that I had at the same time. The E-II thicker bodies work better for me and the fretwork was just as good.

I absolutely love my E-II.

 

[HeHasTheJazzHands]

I hope I'm not opening a can of worms here, but... Can anyone explain me the real differences between an "ESP" and a "E-II"?

I am severely GAS'd by the E-IIs arrow 7s, so...

E-II is the old Standard line. Made in Japan but not AS extravagant (I guess that's the word? ) due to being more mass produced.

ESP seems to be reserved for everything made in the higher-end custom shops. IE: Original Series, Signature Series, and custom jobs.

As said above it's like Gibson USA vs Gibson Custom. Ibanez Prestige vs Ibanez J.Custom/LACS/Sugi.

 

[HeHasTheJazzHands]

...Honestly the name change doesn't bother me, but at this rate I wish ESP would go back to the old name because it's been like a decade since the transition and people are still confused.

 

[MaxOfMetal]

ESP loves sub-branding, I don't see that changing anytime soon.

 

[Emperoff]

Ok, so E-IIs are the same stuff as the old "plain ESP" guitars. All good then!

 

[zimbloth]

I have some E-II Eclipses that I prefer over the Standard and Original Series versions that I had at the same time. The E-II thicker bodies work better for me and the fretwork was just as good.

Thats definitely not the case these days. We've had to send back dozens and dozens of E-IIs due to poor fretwork in the past year. Original Series are infinitely higher quality, and also the prices of E-IIs have jumped up massively this year. Frankly, given there are E-IIs that cost over $3000 now, I think it makes more sense to save up for a real ESP.

 

[Swarm]

Thats definitely not the case these days. We've had to send back dozens and dozens of E-IIs due to poor fretwork in the past year. Original Series are infinitely higher quality, and also the prices of E-IIs have jumped up massively this year. Frankly, given there are E-IIs that cost over $3000 now, I think it makes more sense to save up for a real ESP.

My SS ESPs and my friend's E-IIs are flawless in every aspect and make me wonder what could be better on the OS but knowing that the E-IIs are taking a dip in quality is making me really sad. MIJ ESP is supposed to be a safe space where you always get a great guitar, I really hope it doesn't become the norm considering there are some questionable choices on the E-II line apart from the name already (like switching to the regular thin U on the MII, why?)

 

[pahulkster]

That is really disappointing to hear

 

[Nightside]

MIJ ESP is supposed to be a safe space where you always get a great guitar, I really hope it doesn't become the norm considering there are some questionable choices on the E-II line apart from the name already (like switching to the regular thin U on the MII, why?)

They are not ESP anymore so they can't be as good as the real ESPs. They want a tiered product line.

The prices are getting way out of hand though. A new M400 is close to 1000 euros on reverb. That is straight up ridiculous.