I unknowingly bought a Kiesel that someone made a 22 page thread complaining about.

[slim231990]

I love Kiesel guitars, and I also think that Jeff is a bit of an ass. I praised their customer service rep Cal for being great and people were like "but Jeff's a dick". People assume (especially on here) that if you like Kiesels you automatically approve of Jeff. I think the song Stranglehold is a cool guitar song, but I don't like Ted or a agree with his views one bit. I judge the guitar by the guitar not by the company's owner.

 

[Perge]

Ah thanks dude I appreciate you


Dude I post videos on here rather often and can't recall a single other thread where people have taken this tone about me doing it. That aside though, I feel that I've always been a pretty divisive forum dweller, where people seem to either like me quite a lot or rather dislike me and that's totally ok. I'm 35 and frequently make videos, I've come to terms with the fact that people will dislike me at times. That being said, I get the most smoke on dedicated guitar forums, and I do think that the reason people have made comments about me trying to farm views is just because they don't like the video. Besides that steven guy, I think he's the kind of dude to complain about paying taxes on a $35,000,000 lottery ticket that he found on the ground and is an equal opportunity curmudgeon.

In any of your other posts did you basically call another user a liar? Because that's what your first post does to a degree. He didn't post 22 pages complaining about kiesel. He posted his experience, you bought a guitar that had been repaired, and you tried to make it out like it was all kiesel slander.

Glad you got a working guitar, but that doesn't invalidate the other guys experience.

 

[Lord Voldemort]

In any of your other posts did you basically call another user a liar? Because that's what your first post does to a degree. He didn't post 22 pages complaining about kiesel. He posted his experience, you bought a guitar that had been repaired, and you tried to make it out like it was all kiesel slander.

Glad you got a working guitar, but that doesn't invalidate the other guys experience.

He got the guitar and the first thing he did was take off the neck and fuck up the alignment, because it's what he always does with his guitars for whatever reason. He says this himself, except he spins it in a way that makes it seems like it's Kiesel's fault because they probably didn't align the pin properly. He then thinks that the truss must be maxed out because when he cranks on it he doesn't think it's moving. So fucks up the setup massively by cranking and cranking on it. Kiesel say that it's fine and in pretty much completely neutral, but needs to be relieved a bit which it presumably was when he got it, so they reset it for him. He doesn't believe them about this, and thinks that the wood must have been wet and all warped so they had to have used a press. They fix the tuners for him, saying that they just needed a bit of a tighten. He doesn't believe them about this, and thinks that the indents in which they rest were done wrong and they used the wrong bushing size, so they had to have used new tuners with new bushings. And now, it won't stay in tune and the neck pickup sounds like an icepick. Except, as the owner of this guitar, it stays in tune perfectly and the neck pickup sounds like any other neck pickup.

Basically yes, I think that he's a fucking liar. Or rather, he's very overconfident in his expertise concerning guitar setup and repair and decided to immediately take his guitar apart when he got it and wasn't able to realign it upon putting it back together and also fucked up the setup in this process, but instead of recognizing his role in this he assumed that Kiesel sent him a bad guitar. And in true arrogant boomer fashion when they confirmed that all of this was fine, he just fucked up the setup and alignment with his tinkering and that the tuners just needed a bit of a tighten, it assaulted his massive ego and he concocted a plethora of unlikely alternatives as to what was actually wrong with it and proceeded to bash them in dozens of posts for years after a company kindly fixed a guitar that he fucked up via his incompetence for free.

Also people are saying that I'm farming views, that's what I was referencing.

Somebody never read the politics subforum.

That is absolutely correct.

That’s not to say I don’t like your content either, in fact you might carve out a niche if you do more freak shit with Chinese guitars

Ah dude I don't want to be that guy, though. But you're probably right. It's actually quite hard to think of new content ideas, so when one falls in my lap I can't not take it.

 

[StevenC]

I love Kiesel guitars, and I also think that Jeff is a bit of an ass. I praised their customer service rep Cal for being great and people were like "but Jeff's a dick". People assume (especially on here) that if you like Kiesels you automatically approve of Jeff. I think the song Stranglehold is a cool guitar song, but I don't like Ted or a agree with his views one bit. I judge the guitar by the guitar not by the company's owner.

Carvin used to be a cool company that would make you a good quality guitar to your specs at a reasonable price. The gamble was that they might screw something up but would resolve it and people would be happy in the end.

Kiesel is an annoying company that'll make you a good quality guitar at a fairly high price. The gamble is they might screw something up and tell you to eat dirt.

The quality hasn't changed, but the prices have gone up and the service has gone down under Jeff. Another major problem since Jeff took over is the sycophants brigading threads when someone has a legitimate problem that isn't being dealt with.

And here we have a thread where a someone bought a fixed guitar to complain about the previous owner making Kiesel fix the issues because, surprise surprise, the fixed issues are no longer apparent. Bearing in mind, this is digging up 4 year old drama to call out some guy who had to fight to get a functional guitar. All the while admitting that it's hard to find ideas for content.

My avatar is a Strandberg, but I have a lot of shit to talk about Strandbergs.

 

[Lord Voldemort]

And here we have a thread where a someone bought a fixed guitar to complain about the previous owner making Kiesel fix the issues because, surprise surprise, the fixed issues are no longer apparent. Bearing in mind, this is digging up 4 year old drama to call out some guy who had to fight to get a functional guitar. All the while admitting that it's hard to find ideas for content.

I mean you're literally tunneling a portion of my words and ignoring the rest just to fit your own narrative, I just want to point that out. You're literally not quoting 90% of what I said nor addressing it because it immediately clashes with the picture that you reflexively painted of this situation.

 

[StevenC]

I mean you're literally tunneling a portion of my words and ignoring the rest just to fit your own narrative, I just want to point that out. You're literally not quoting 90% of what I said nor addressing it because it immediately clashes with the picture that you reflexively painted of this situation.

So uh, when you bought the guitar unknowingly, how did you find out it was this guitar? And after you found out it was a guitar with a story to it, a story in which 4 years ago the original owner acknowledged it was now fixed without problems, what made you make a video digging up all that ancient drama?

And then once you've answered those two questions, can you see why people are calling this clickbaity?

Don't get me wrong, it's not 30 amp shootout (total 30 watts). But it's still clickbait.

 

[ArtDecade]

.... please ... for the love of Dokken - do not let this thread become 22 pages.

 

[StevenC]

.... please ... for the love of Dokken - do not let this thread become 22 pages.

Bump

 

[Lord Voldemort]

So uh, when you bought the guitar unknowingly, how did you find out it was this guitar? And after you found out it was a guitar with a story to it, a story in which 4 years ago the original owner acknowledged it was now fixed without problems, what made you make a video digging up all that ancient drama?

And then once you've answered those two questions, can you see why people are calling this clickbaity?

Don't get me wrong, it's not 30 amp shootout (total 30 watts). But it's still clickbait.

Dude you're still ignoring the situation. This is a strawman argument. I pointed out that you have completely ignored my interpretation of the original owners situation, and you respond with a completely new point, once again completely ignoring my interpretation of the original owners situation. It's quite frustrating tbh, fml.

It's not about the fact that this dude got a shit guitar and then it was fixed and now it's great. I don't understand how some people aren't seeing this. That's not even what happened.

It's about the absurdity of which he came to identify these problems, the fact that the first thing that this dude did was literally rip the guitar in half before even playing it (that's a literal quote from him) and then the fact that he then couldn't put it back together properly and blamed Kiesel for it.

You have literally sidestepped this over and over. That's not just significant, that's literally my whole point. It's a hilarious turn of events that I thought was worth sharing for the lulz.

 

[SalsaWood]

It's about the absurdity of which he came to identify these problems

You admit the absurdity in some regards being strictly his emotional response to the otherwise valid issue which you escaped from entirely at the point you encountered the guitar yourself- as with the tuners not fitting the guitar in the state it was rendered to him initially. You can blast the OP for being emotional, that's completely valid and it certainly worked counter to anything he seemed to endeavor towards, but such endeavors had concrete and quantifiable basis which you almost completely disregard outside of a thing to parade against from your later and largely resolved perspective on the matter.

And to think we all just don't appreciate Kiesel guitars as others have implied is a bit fancy, what we are questioning is the shade you're throwing on OP and his conclusions. Some of which may be warranted or not, but you have no idea at all.

 

[xzacx]

The irony for me is that I do think the OP was hoping for views on his video, but I also have seen some of his videos before and think he's actually a really good player—better than probably 90% of the big names I see get posted. So I did click the video...and there was no playing. It was a loss for me all around.

 

[MFB]

I enjoy how whether or not youtube links gets criticized comes down entirely to whether or not the forum decides they like you, seemingly regardless of how much engagement in the forum comes from it.

GuitarJon posts a new thread for just about every video on his channel, and it's very "youtuber" content. But he gets a pass because folks like him, and he engages with the forum. Lord V does exactly the same thing, engages just as much, and this is "bad" for "reasons".

¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Joke's on you if you think I've ever watched any of our SSO-fluencers (possibly intended wordplay on Fluence/influence) videos

 

[ArtDecade]

You admit the absurdity in some regards being strictly his emotional response to the otherwise valid issue which you escaped from entirely at the point you encountered the guitar yourself- as with the tuners not fitting the guitar in the state it was rendered to him initially. You can blast the OP for being emotional, that's completely valid and it certainly worked counter to anything he seemed to endeavor towards, but such endeavors had concrete and quantifiable basis which you completely disregard outside of a thing to parade against from your later and largely resolved perspective on the matter.

And to think we all just don't appreciate Kiesel guitars as others have implied is a bit fancy, what we are questioning is the shade you're throwing on OP and his conclusions. Some of which may be warranted or not, but you have no idea at all.

... so confused. The guy you are quoting is the OP.

 

[Lord Voldemort]

You admit the absurdity in some regards being strictly his emotional response to the otherwise valid issue which you escaped from entirely at the point you encountered the guitar yourself- as with the tuners not fitting the guitar in the state it was rendered to him initially. You can blast the OP for being emotional, that's completely valid and it certainly worked counter to anything he seemed to endeavor towards, but such endeavors had concrete and quantifiable basis which you completely disregard outside of a thing to parade against from your later and largely resolved perspective on the matter.

And to think we all just don't appreciate Kiesel guitars as others have implied is a bit fancy, what we are questioning is the shade you're throwing on OP and his conclusions. Some of which may be warranted or not, but you have no idea at all.

I feel that I addressed the fact that the tuners were wobbly. I don't think that they're wobbly for the reasons of which he claims. I don't think that they didn't fit, I believe Kiesel. Kiesel said that they just weren't tightened enough. And I don't believe Kiesel because I think they're without valid criticism, I believe them because of the other shit that crazy man said. But I feel that I addressed that fine, my bad if I didn't. It wasn't really the thing that stuck out to me the most about the situation.

The irony for me is that I do think the OP was hoping for views on his video, but I also have seen some of his videos before and think he's actually a really good player—better than probably 90% of the big names I see get posted. So I did click the video...and there was no playing. It was a loss for me all around.

Hey how dare you also thank you make sure to like and subscribe and hit that bell for notifications

 

[TedEH]

The gamble is they might screw something up and tell you to eat dirt.

the fixed issues are no longer apparent

The thing I'm having trouble piecing together here is that we have folks saying, at the same time, this OP is wrong because Kiesel fixes things so they aren't judging the same experience, but aaaalso, that the original thread guy was also wrong because Kiesel doesn't fix anything and tells you to eat dirt. So which is it? Did they fix it? Or did they tell the guy to eat dirt?

It sounds to me, if I'm following all this correctly, that original thread guy believes he was told to eat dirt, and that he got a "technically corrected" but still generally bodged (by his standards) guitar back in return, but that everyone else (including the OP) believes that the problem was fixed, if there even was a problem in the first place. So what's the conflict here exactly? The whole point of the youtube video was to show that there was a difference in perspective.

Without reading through the entirety of the original thread, it does strike me as really weird that the first thing a person does on receiving a guitar is to take the neck off of it. I've never heard of anyone else doing that.

Joke's on you if you think I've ever watched any of our SSO-fluencers (possibly intended wordplay on Fluence/influence) videos

I mean, we have no way to know who watches what links, but I comment on some of the video threads. They only get piled-on when people don't like the content of the video, or the person who posted it. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

 

[slim231990]

Carvin used to be a cool company that would make you a good quality guitar to your specs at a reasonable price. The gamble was that they might screw something up but would resolve it and people would be happy in the end.

Kiesel is an annoying company that'll make you a good quality guitar at a fairly high price. The gamble is they might screw something up and tell you to eat dirt.

The quality hasn't changed, but the prices have gone up and the service has gone down under Jeff. Another major problem since Jeff took over is the sycophants brigading threads when someone has a legitimate problem that isn't being dealt with.

And here we have a thread where a someone bought a fixed guitar to complain about the previous owner making Kiesel fix the issues because, surprise surprise, the fixed issues are no longer apparent. Bearing in mind, this is digging up 4 year old drama to call out some guy who had to fight to get a functional guitar. All the while admitting that it's hard to find ideas for content.

My avatar is a Strandberg, but I have a lot of shit to talk about Strandbergs.

Bro like 95% of all goods have gone up since post covid, idk if you've noticed that lately. Pretty much every guitar company has increased prices. And once again you have to bring in the Jeff hate, even tho he probably had nothing to do with this build. We get it....you hate Jeff ...awesome. Even in your own post you say that Carvin made a "quality guitar" and then you say the quality hasen't changed, so Jeff is your real problem? They make hundreds of guitars a year and there's thousands of happy customers out there. If you only judge a company by the negative reviews everything is shit lol. Maybe check out one of the many threads where people have had a good experience.

 

[SalsaWood]

I don't think that they didn't fit, I believe Kiesel.

You think, you don't know. The issue being you're very affirmative in the extent to which you think and we're very affirmative in that not being satisfactory qualification in regard to knowing, then you publishing it as such.

The guy you are quoting is the OP.

The OG OP from the original shit bitching thread on TGP.

 

[ArtDecade]

I don't sub to the @Lord Voldemort YT channel so someone will have to let me know if starts getting a new Kiesel each month.
Like and subscribe to my posts.

 

[StevenC]

The thing I'm having trouble piecing together here is that we have folks saying, at the same time, this OP is wrong because Kiesel fixes things so they aren't judging the same experience, but aaaalso, that the original thread guy was also wrong because Kiesel doesn't fix anything and tells you to eat dirt. So which is it? Did they fix it? Or did they tell the guy to eat dirt?

It sounds to me, if I'm following all this correctly, that original thread guy believes he was told to eat dirt, and that he got a "technically corrected" but still generally bodged (by his standards) guitar back in return, but that everyone else (including the OP) believes that the problem was fixed, if there even was a problem in the first place. So what's the conflict here exactly? The whole point of the youtube video was to show that there was a difference in perspective.

Without reading through the entirety of the original thread, it does strike me as really weird that the first thing a person does on receiving a guitar is to take the neck off of it. I've never heard of anyone else doing that.


I mean, we have no way to know who watches what links, but I comment on some of the video threads. They only get piled-on when people don't like the content of the video, or the person who posted it. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

The original guy received a guitar that shouldn't have passed QC. Then it got fixed. Our OP here is digging up that drama for his own content even though the original buyer acknowledges it was fixed in the end. There is value in people posting about their purchasing experience, positive negative or mixed.

Then, separately, Kiesel has a history of ignoring issues and making up excuses after the fact. See roasted maple fiasco, "5A" tops, photo provided colour match to another Kiesel not being achieved and then Jeff saying it can't be done. Etc. There's a bunch of them, and in that context, this is an example of good customer service relative to Kiesel.

Forgive me if I have a short fuse on Kiesel apologia, given this is the brand that has previously paid this forum to take down bad reviews.

 

[StevenC]

Bro like 95% of all goods have gone up since post covid, idk if you've noticed that lately. Pretty much every guitar company has increased prices. And once again you have to bring in the Jeff hate, even tho he probably had nothing to do with this build. We get it....you hate Jeff ...awesome. Even in your own post you say that Carvin made a "quality guitar" and then you say the quality hasen't changed, so Jeff is your real problem? They make hundreds of guitars a year and there's thousands of happy customers out there. If you only judge a company by the negative reviews everything is shit lol. Maybe check out one of the many threads where people have had a good experience.

Sensational reading comprehension bro.

If the options are 70% good guitar 30% return/repair/discount, then I want a company that deals with the latter gracefully. Like Carvin used to do. Kiesel no longer does that. Forgive me if I blame the CEO for policy changes, maybe the buck stops somewhere else and Jeff has no say over such things?

It's easy to find janky Carvins. Think of the guitar that had side dots on the wrong side. But the difference back then was Carvin dealt with the issues without calling anyone an idiot and people were happy with the interaction.

Also, the prices went up long before covid. See: $600 finish up charges for sparkle paint back in 2017.